Training material

mrdmrd

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Join Date
Dec 2002
Location
Nebraska
Posts
77
I am looking for advanced PLC training material. I have a very good understanding of all of the basic stuff but I can not seem to find anything that talks about the more advanced things. Is there any books that you guys know of that dive deeper into the PLC world? Or am I just stuck using the information that I get from the AB website?
 
Greetings mrdmrd,

first question: what exactly do you mean by the term “more advanced things”? ...

basic idea ... once you’ve gotten past the basics of PLCs (the stuff that EVERYBODY needs to know), then the more advanced topics tend to become a lot more specialized ... think of it as something like “choosing a major” in college ...

so what do you want to learn next? ... if the answer is “everything” then I’m afraid that you’re doomed to disappointment ... nobody knows it ALL ...

on the other hand, if you have some specific goals and objectives in mind, then let us know what you’re interested in and we’ll try to help ... just as a few topics off the top of my head to get you started:

1. motion control
2. data collection and analysis
3. process control (example: PID for temperatures, flows, pressures, etc.)
4. communications
5. SCADA, HMI, etc.
6. etc.

of course some of these topics overlap each other, but the main point is that a lot of this material is going to be highly specific to the type of machinery that the PLC controls ...

or did I simply misunderstand what you’re asking for? ... by “more advanced things” you might have simply meant “analog signals” or something along those lines ...

one suggestion: look at the “instruction set” for your particular PLC platform ... this is, of course, a list of ALL of the “pieces-parts” (timers, counters, math functions, etc.) that you could possibly use in your PLC program ... once you’ve looked over that list, mark off the items that you are already familiar with ... then decide what else on the list you want to learn next ... that might be the best way to nail down “where are you now?” and also “where you want to go from here?” ... of course, just knowing how the instructions work is only one part of the puzzle ... after that, you’ll still have to learn how to put all of those parts together in order to write an effective program ...

plan of attack: post again and tell us what you really want ... we’ll try to help you make it happen ...
 
I would like to get into the career field of setup and design of automated manufacturing equipment. I have a A.A.S Degree in Electro-Mechanical Technology. Don't get me wrong this is great for the maintenance field that I am currently in. In college we learned all the analog, DH-485 messiging, some panel view programming and some
RSview. But there is so much more capability's that PLC's can do. If I could I would just buy the various equipment and spend all my time playing and learning (much to the dismay of my girlfriend). But $$$$ is an issue. I was just wondering if there was any other books that can help me with everything or anything from advanced PLC control to PID to HMI the sky is the limit. I am one of those people that not to sound concieded but has a mind like a sponge if it is out there I would like to learn it. If I could stuff half of the knowledge that I see from some of the people on this site into my head I would be more than on my way to where I want to be

Thanks in advance for all of your help
 
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I can almost hear it now. Everyother person that I talk to say's go back to school and get an engineering degree. Yes this is an option. But until then the more I can learn on my own the better
 
just a thought ... is there a decent technical college nearby? ... if so, do they have an automation lab? ... if not, could they be convinced that they need one? ... if they already have a lab, do they already have a “lab technician” to develop and maintain it? ... if not, could they be convinced that you’re “the man” for this job? ...

this is basically the path that worked for me ... in short, the sovereign state of South Carolina actually paid me to learn this trade ... all I had to do was “work” my butt off (it was more like “play”) putting the lab together ...

suggestion: the best way to go about starting a lab from scratch is usually NOT to try working through the school ... they’ll probably just be scared off by the amount of money and work involved ... so ... are there any local industries around who might be interested in having some local automation training available for their present or prospective employees? ... many (most?) technical schools have an “advisory board” made up of local industry leaders ... these are the guys who would be in a much better position to convince the school to get things moving ... let me know if this sounds even slightly interesting ... I might be able to give you some advice on how to best proceed ...

again ... it worked for me ...
 
There's a limit to what you can learn on your own.

Going to school and getting a degree is certainly an option. And book learning, either in school or with some "Advance PLC Stuff" book will only get you so far.

There are all sorts of things that you learn about when you have a real PLC program operating real machinery. Things that look good in on paper or on the screen, often don't work in reality for reasons that are sometimes quite subtle. Most of the time, it's a matter of "in the real world, things don't happen instantly". Sometimes thisgs that are supposed to happen, never do.

It's not THAT difficult to write a PLC program that causes things to happen in a certain order when everything goes RIGHT. The bulk of my job is planning what to do when things go WRONG.

- What should happen if THIS occurs?
- What should happen if THAT occurs?
- What should happen if both THIS and THAT occur?

Unfortunatly, the only way to know what can go wrong is to be there when things go wrong. Each time something doesn't work the way you expect, you learn a little something about Things to Avoid. Sometimes, the lesson can be misleading ("I learned from trying to troubleshoot this: Never use Latch/Unlatch") But unfortunatly, no amount of schooling is going to teach you this stuff. You've got to be there, at the plant floor, writing code and making things happen and making, finding, and fixing mistakes.

So, then, how do you get on the plant floor? There are lots of different ways (see THIS LINK for some of the paths taken). A degree WILL help open doors. Buying a small, inexpensive PLC (new: <$300; E-Bay: ~$200) and then trying to make something, anything (an automatic pet food dispenser, for example) out of Radio shack and other parts is another. It may not go on the resume, but if you can talk a good game (because you know what you're talking about), you might be able to convince someone to take a chance on you.

But I don't know of any "Advanced PLC Stuff" books or courses. The really advanced stuff, as Ron said, isn't in using the individual instruction, but in combining them to solve problems. The ability to properly define a problem, and the creativity to come up with a solution is something that simply can't be taught, or at least can't be taught simply.
 
wise words from my distinguished colleague, Allen Nelson:

The ability to properly define a problem, and the creativity to come up with a solution is something that simply can't be taught, or at least can't be taught simply.

here’s an analogy to help nail down that nugget of truth ...

suppose you ask someone: “teach me how to read a best-selling novel” ...

now compare that to asking: “teach me how to WRITE a best-selling novel” ...

there is a world of difference between the two requests ... and it should be obvious that one crucial requirement of learning how to WRITE a best-selling novel would certainly be to READ a very great number of existing novels – both best-sellers and also some barely-acceptable ones ... then comparing the “best” from one to the “worst” from another would become natural steps along the path to enlightenment ...

it should take no great stretch of imagination to apply that simple analogy directly to the field of PLC programming ...

and of course Allen is absolutely correct when he says that there is NO substitute for experience ... so perhaps your question is not actually “how can I learn more about PLCs?” but rather “how can I gain more experience with PLCs?” ... Allen has already given you several suggestions ... and I’ve given you at least one ...so give us some more feedback ... are we making headway or not? ...
 
Thanks Guys,

As of now I am working in an Electro-Plating Facility that is in my opinion very automated. After reading your posts I think that the best way to get what I need is to gain as much information and pratice with the free equipment that is avalible to me at work. In my opinion I have yet to see an automated process that did not have some room for enhancement and improvement. I just need to take the ball and find those oppertunities. This will not only help with my experiance but also give me more of a background to talk about in future endevores.

Again thanks guys
I am sure you will be hearing more from me in the future when I need help with a problem the is PLC related at least I know a good place to look for help
 
just thinking out loud ...

... gain as much information and pratice with the free equipment that is avalible to me at work.

an excellent approach ... and if you have a good relationship with your employer, you might want to daydream about this angle ...

suppose that there just happens to be some “spare” PLC equipment available around your plant ... maybe some used pieces on the maintenance department’s “we’re-not-sure-whether-this-piece-is-good-or-bad” shelf ... so maybe there’s enough pieces-parts lying around to put together a small “training room” PLC setup ... maybe using an old laptop or desktop computer with a “just-as-long-as-the-engineers-don’t-need-it” copy of the programming software ... nothing fancy to start with ... just a few buttons to push ... some lamps to flash ... but everything gets done neatly and professionally ... all the wiring is labeled ... the parts are mounted straight and “squared-away” ... everything looks “loved” ... and just maybe after awhile, a few of the other technicians start to take an interest in learning something about PLCs ... that could be good for the techs – and certainly good for the plant ... so maybe there would be enough interest to justify a little extra cash to add some more functionality to the test rig ... and then suppose that someone were to take the time to research and document the test rig ... I’m thinking about some nice binders with neat labels ... maybe a couple of lesson plans with student exercises to help the other techs learn what the test rig can do ... some wiring diagrams and schematics all done up as a nice neat CAD drawing ... so maybe there’s a chance that all of this “test rig” documentation might someday lead into a project to organize all of the rest of the plant’s PLC equipment ... that could mean a lot of ongoing lessons into how a lot of automation gear works ... of course someone would have to tackle that project ... and it might turn into quite a lot of work ... but it sure sounds like a great opportunity to learn a lot about PLCs and automation in general ...

I don’t know ... just some things to think about ...
 
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