what program to use?

g.robert · Nov 8, 2004

Hello.

I am bidding on controls for a hydraulic press. I will use a AB ML 1500 or SLC 500 with ethernet comm.

Problem is specification calls for PC interface. I have yet to be involved on the PC side.

System would have PC and keyboard from which operator would insert predefined parameters (mostly timer values). They would need to be able to save each set up for future use. It also has to be able to pull up ladder logic from PLC to troubleshoot.

I am hoping that there is some windows based (non-program language) software that I could work my way through this with. Maybe like panelbuilder for HMI.

Any ideas or budgets for this type of interface would be greatly appreciated. Bottom line I have to bid now and figure out how to do it while doing it.

rsdoran · Nov 8, 2004

You will need a SCADA/HMI or PC control program, checkout http://www.citect.com/ they offer a demo download of their software that is fully functional for 8 hours at a time.

I know many here have used it an like it.

Kepware offers an HMI program http://www.kep.com/infilink/infilink.html

Another commonly used program is Think and DO http://web6.automationdirect.com/ad...trol_Products/Entivity_PC_Control/PC-ENT-LIVE

Since an ML is being used you could go with RSView32 and RSLadder which will do the plc control/hmi and allow troubleshooting ladder without operators etc being able to make changes to code.
http://www.software.rockwell.com/rsview32/

http://www.software.rockwell.com/rsladder/

BobB · Nov 8, 2004

Citect is definately my favourite. You could also have a look at Omron CX-Supervisor. It is quite good and will work on any device with an OPC driver.Here is a link to a demo download
Omron CX-Supervisor Demo Download

I have used it several times. It is fairly inexpensive but very powerfull and adequate for a lot of jobs. You purchase the developer edition and own it and then only have to purchase a run time licence and dongle each time you use it. Program language included or you can use VB.

msinclair · Nov 9, 2004

rsdoran said:
Since an ML is being used you could go with RSView32 and RSLadder which will do the plc control/hmi and allow troubleshooting ladder without operators etc being able to make changes to code.
http://www.software.rockwell.com/rsview32/

http://www.software.rockwell.com/rsladder/

Short of writing a heck of a lot of screens to emulate/display the ladder programming (which could be done in any SCADA package), I think this is a good way for you to go. It may be a high price for your customer - but the "pull up ladder logic" spec is a tough one to handle. RSLadder is a good compromise.

Good luck,

Marc

g.robert · Nov 9, 2004

I don't mind sticking with AB. I don't even mind buying additional AB software as long as it does what I need.

So if I am understanding this right, between RS view and RS ladder, I will be able to program to where PC inputs / saves data to and from PLC and display ladder from PLC for diagnostics?

I assume that if I made my way through RSlogic and RS panel builder then the same format will apply? Windows based drag and drop with little or no actual programming language?

If the above is correct, would it be safe to assume that working with the above software would require equal time to say the time used to program the PLC in RSlogic? Or are there hidden problems with large learning curves?

rsdoran · Nov 9, 2004

There will be a learning curve and maybe a little more time involved with the HMI program depending on what you want to use. Since you are familiar with AB and have used Panelbuilder (I think you said that) then RSView may be your best option.

RSLadder is basically RSLogix with no editing options, not much work to do there.

I am not sure of the cost for this software but I believe it may offer the simplest solution with the most options in your case.

Wiggum · Nov 9, 2004

press

I already programmed a hydraulic press. I suppose that you don't need a lot of input and output. That control is relatively simple.

My press is equiped with a ML1200 and panelview 300

The Ml is linked to ethernet network throught a Digi box. ( digi.com )

This system is cheaper than slc505. Slc 505 that control a hydraulic press is like a porches motor that drive a Lada.

g.robert · Nov 9, 2004

Thanks Ron. I'll have to try and get paid for the learning curve by including extra time in quote. I did check out the link, it did not mention the micrologic supported , only the SLC and up for the panel view32. Will it work with the micrologix 1000 to 1500?

Wiggum. I also did a press with the 1200 and a micro 300. This system however, requires PC at press where operator will enter / store parameters via standard keyboard and view on a standard SVGA monitor. I have done HMI panels before but this time the PC is the HMI.

rsdoran · Nov 9, 2004

I dont see why it wouldnt, RSLinx comes with RSView32 and you use it to setup the connection to the PLC. The ML is basically an SLC but in someways new and improved, overall though the data files are the same...ie I=input O=output B=binary/bit etc etc.

If you work alot with AB and your customer base uses primarily AB and you havent work much with SCADA/HMI software then this would be a good route to go for you.

bwheat · Nov 9, 2004

Do they want to log data with the PC? Are they looking to load presets from the PC? Setting up RSView to do data logging is not a problem but I am not sure how well RSview does at loading presets. There is a recipe loader part to RSview but I have not used it. The injection molding machine I had in the plant I worked in that that had RSView but they wrote custom VB code to do the loading of molding parameters. If they are loggging data do they want reports? Do they need to be able to store the setup data on disk to move to another machine? When you have PC in the mix you open up lots of capability but it all takes time to work out.

g.robert · Nov 9, 2004

As far as to the extent of desire of function to the PC, I can only go by what they requested now.

They would need to walk up to press. Look at monitor. Enter values if desire to be different than existing via standard PC. Assign a name to that setup. Save that setup for future reference and use (I have to assume use on only this machine as no further request exist).Assign a count value (desired product output). Monitor output count.

Those seem to be all that is required up front but you know how that goes. The better I understand what I am supplying, the more I can be prepaired for as built changes.

Thanks for all the help. As it stands now I will bid with RS view 32 and ladder.

Ken Moore · Nov 10, 2004

Depending on the size of the "recipe". You could do all of you data storage in the plc. Then you could use a panel view for data entry and monitoring.

I have a process that uses this format now, but they only have about 10-15 recipes.

When an operator enters a new set of values, the plc stores them into the next available memory location, and stores the id also.

When the opertor selects this recipe in the future the plc moves the values to the "working" registers.

Just a thought.

Ken

93lt1 · Nov 10, 2004

g.robert said:
I am bidding on controls for a hydraulic press.

Problem is specification calls for PC interface.

Is the spec a general equipment spec? I would see if they would opt for a panelview, like Ken Moore said. It seems a waste to buy a PC and RSView32 just for a hydrualic press. (if it's the type of press I'm thinking about)

I have seen instances where a company's "general equipment spec" calls for PC with all source code, maintenance software, etc. Usually inculded for large installations, and they will waive it for small installations.

If they really do want a PC, don't rule out RSViewME, it is quite a bit cheaper than RSView32.

rsdoran · Nov 10, 2004

That was my bad, didnt think about RSViewME.

what program to use?

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