backup scaner & I/O adapter mpdules

Hi all
I am trying to configure a system using remote I/O link with SLC 500
i have 2 local racks each contain
power supply
CPU SLC 5/04 slot 0
Scanner backup module 1747-BSN -slot 1
Both this local racks are controlling a Remote rack ,the remote rack contain the following
I/O adapter module 1747-ASB and "2" 32 digital input modules , "3" 16 digital output module , "1" 16 anlaog (4-20ma) module & "5" RTD modules .
My problem is the image size of the I/O adapter ,as i under stand from the manuals is that this image is four logial racl each of the is eight logical group(logical group is one word input image and one word output image),so the max size for the image is 32 logical group(32 input word ,32 output word).
To clearify the problem i have to mention that the RTD module for example uses 8 input words &8 output words .so I need 40 logic group fro the RTD's module only regardless the other I/O.
my question is Am I wright about the number og logical racks and logical groups and how can i reconfigur the system.
BR

no feedback

hi all
Even that i didn't get any feedback till now?I ask that if configuring the G file for the scanner module 1747-BSN can increase the image size or not?
BR

What series of processor do you have?

SLC 5/04

Hi ken
I have SLC500, 1747-L543 5/04 CPU.
BR

Bloch transfer

hi
As i revised the manual times and times i found that my understanding for the logical racks,logical groups are correct.what i rechecked again is the block transfer for the speciality modules .the user manual said that
"all Speciality I/O modules are block transfer mapped regardless of thier image size"
Can any body explain to me this.
BR

Check this thread: http://www.plctalk.net/qanda/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11503

It may point you in the right direction

Hesham,

I am not familiar with the backup scanner, but from your post it looks very much like "regular" RIO that I know pretty well.

With RIO, a RTD module is a "specialty" module that must be accessed via block transfers.
It does NOT take up 8 i/o words. Only one slot is used for the module and it will occupy i/o addresses depending on the addressing scheme.
With ½-slot adressing it will occupy 2+2 i/o words.
With 1-slot adressing it will occupy 1+1 i/o words.
With 2-slot adressing it will occupy 1(+1) i/o words.
But the i/o occupied addresses will be dormant. The access from the program to the module will be via block transfers.
Search for the exact module type on Rockwell Knowledgebase and there should be programming examples on how to access the particular module via block transfers.

Again: I am assuming that RIO and backup scanner on RIO works the same. You may have to check up on that a bit further.

I just looked at the product brief for the 1747-BSN. It says that the backup scanner listens to the comms to the other scanner (the active one). I think that it means it knows how to sort out the block transfers that the active scanner issues.
Read thru ALL the manuals for the 1747-BSN !

To elaborate a little further:

As you have 32-point i/o modules you must select ½-slot addressing.
Then your setup will be like this:

Logical rack 0: FULL rack
32 point input module Input words 0+1
32 point input module Input words 2+3
32 point input module Input words 4+5
16 point output module Output word 6
Logical rack 1: FULL rack
16 point output module Output word 8
16 point output module Output word 10
16 point analog module (block transfer with rack 1 group 4)
8 point RTD module (block transfer with rack 1 group 6)
Logical rack 2: FULL rack
8 point RTD module (block transfer with rack 2 group 0)
8 point RTD module (block transfer with rack 2 group 2)
8 point RTD module (block transfer with rack 2 group 4)
8 point RTD module (block transfer with rack 2 group 6)

Backup Scanner

Jasper
Thank you very much for your clearifications,
So the result now that my configuration is ok ,and i don't need to change it any more all what i have to do is to adujst the addressing mode to 1/2 addressing and specialty module mode to block transfer mode in my adapter I/O module.
And i want to confirm that the image size og the RTD module for example will not 8/8 I/O words of the I/O adapter module size and only 2/2 I/O words.Also i want to know what is the case if i use class 3 modules with I/O image 16 input words & 24 output words.
Regarding the Backup scanner module it's used to back the data to another backup scanner module and hence another CPU in SLC redundant system.
The I/O image size for the Backup scanner module is exactly as the I/O adapter.
Thanks & Best regards
beerchug

And i want to confirm that the image size og the RTD module for example will not 8/8 I/O words of the I/O adapter module size and only 2/2 I/O words.

Click to expand...

Correct.

Also i want to know what is the case if i use class 3 modules with I/O image 16 input words & 24 output words.

Click to expand...

Also correct.

To clarify:
The i/o image (2+2 words) for the specialty modules are not used, but they are still occupied by the module. This because by nature of the RIO network, every slot is assigned the same number of words.
In stead you have to use block transfers with 16 words BTR and 24 words BTW to access the module.

Scada

Thanaks all for replys,
now i want to connect this system to a scada or a VB application .Which communication i should use Physical a and protocol>
BR

It depends on which SCADA you pick.
The ones from Rockwell have their own drivers to the SLC5/04 via DF1 or DH+.
Other SCADA packages will typically use OPC to connect to the SLC5/04.
You can use RSLinx Single node or RSLinx OEM for this.

An alternative when using VB is an ActiveX driver.
Look for "Automated Solutions" or "InGear".

VB application

Jasper
Thank you for your reply.
i am planning to create a VB application and talk to the PLC through the RSlinx.
What confusing me is
1-I read in manual that the backup scanner have two communication channel the first is RIO/DH+ .this channel is configured using dip switch either to be RIO or DH+ hence they are mutually execlusive as said in the manual.IF i configure this channel as DH+ can i connect my scada in this network and in this case do i need to use the interface card 1784-ktx.
as i under stand from the manual i can't connect my scada on thr RIO link?is this wrigh?
the second channel available is RS232/DH485 and i belive that i can connect my scada through this network the problem is that AB mention in the manual that only the primary processor can connect through this network.this means that in case of switchover and the secondry proceesor takes control the operator should transfer the communication cable to the new primary processor.which i am afraid to rejected by the clint .
Please correct me if i am wrong ?or suggest another solution for that?
Thanks & best regards

The BSN can work in DH+ mode or RIO mode to backup one of the two networks.
You have to pick RIO for your system.
I think that a PKTX CAN work in RIO mode, but I doubt that it is a good idea.

The smartest is to setup the two PLCs with different DH+ node numbers but with the same RIO setup.
In your HMI application you duplicate all the tags, so that they look at both PLCs via DH+.
You then have to detect in a way which PLC is the active.
I think that it can be done in code so that it is the PLC that says "I am the active one".
In your HMI application you must monitor which PLC is the active, and automatically switch the tags to the active one.

You cannot use RSLinx single node, because you are looking at two PLCs at the same time. It must be at least RSLinx OEM.

DH+

Jasper
thanks for reply.
You mean that it's better to use the DH+ network.in the same time i don't need any extar hardware on my PC to connect to this network.
Br