Which HMI software would you pick?

I work in a steel mill that has a melt shop that uses all Allen Bradley controls, and a rolling mill that is all GE. In the melt shop we have upgraded to 1756-L61 processors for most of our controllers, with a couple of PLC5s and a SLC still hanging around. We are using stand alone versions of RSView 32 with each step in the melting process having its own project. We have around 13 HMIs(runtime) and 5 maintenance PCs(works) that we are trying to keep up with. We have a nice redundant path gigabit fiber backbone for our Ethernet network, and we use ControlNet for inter-processor communication. The rolling mill is currently using Cimplicity PE, and ME with their GE systems. We need to upgrade to a client/redundant server setup. Does anyone have an opinion on which product we should go to, Cimplicity, RSView Enterprise, Something else? Any input is greatly appreciated.

I always liked InTouch Wonderware. I haven't had the opportunity to use it for over 2 years and haven't tried versions newer than 7.1 but I like it better than ProTool Pro, WinCC, RS View, & a few others I have used since. It was also much better than Cimplicity HMI but the GE rep claims that Cimplicity ME is completely different and much better but I haven't used it.

I think WonderWare is at 9.05 now. I haven't used it in years.

My choice would be Cimplicity since I am familiar with it, and can get FREE support.

If you are using AB and have the budget, then go with them, you may be able to get some tech support here.

regards.....casey

I have used Wonderware's Intouch and RSView32 but for what it sounds like you'll be using it for I would suggest you look into using Intellution's iFix. For distributed HMI's hands down it is the best. Much better than RSView SE. The entire core of the graphics as well as scripting engines are VBA and not just an addon as it is with RSView. It also has dual threads for scripting and ActiveX containment (means errant ActiveX control will not crash the system). I could go on all day about the differences but I will let you decide what you need for what price. I suggest you look into iFix at Intellution.com just for the awareness.

Randy

Hava a good look at Citect. It will connect to almost everything. www.citect.com. Download a free trial version. Great support too!!

In that case I would pick RSViewSE.
Then you can browse tags online and convert easyly eisting View32 applications.
Also if you have almost everything from RA ad there will be problems/questions,you can ask that what the hell. Othervie they can tell you that it's beause other vendors bugs.

BR
Lauri

Also if you have almost everything from RA ad there will be problems/questions,you can ask that what the hell. Othervie they can tell you that it's beause other vendors bugs.

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Have NEVER had that sort of response from Citect. With that sort of response, I would be changing supplier!!!!

BobB

Let's say:
I you have AB PLC and Siemens HMI (or vice versa) and your HMI does not connect to PLC. You can manage the problem with Siemens support, but if not, then you have to call to AB. They help you ofcourse but if they have to come on site, it's probably more expensive.

They can be quite strict.

Situation from life: DH-485 network problems. Guy from AB came on site and saw, that network cables are from third party manufacturer.
He sayd: "Change the cable" and wanted to go back to hotel.
Ofcourse the customer managed to make him move on with the investigation but it's quite nice example.

And in most cases I think it's acceptable (now this topic will probably get hundreds of replies), because why mix different things together if you can save yourself and others time (read moey) and choose complete solution.

HMI

My vote goes to IFix. I believe it now uses a single server as both development node and scada node with a web type design. Any one with Internet Explorer can view the screens. This means higher network traffic but that isnt a problem for you. Factory Talk and RSview are OK but overpriced. Go check out http://www.gefanucautomation.com/.
Have a good Week
Bruce

Having used iFix and Wonderware, IMHO iFix is the best for a client / multi-server type arragnement.

I'm sure others will disagree, but I don't think RSview will handle this type of network very well.

I've never used any other SCADA software, so can't comment on them.

One advantage of using a SCADA package that is PLC independant, is that they usually can connect with everyone's hardware, plus I think the Tech. support is better.

I you have AB PLC and Siemens HMI (or vice versa) and your HMI does not connect to PLC. You can manage the problem with Siemens support, but if not, then you have to call to AB.

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Citect will supply both drivers and SUPPORT BOTH drivers.

Situation from life: DH-485 network problems. Guy from AB came on site and saw, that network cables are from third party manufacturer.

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Shame they will not live in the real world, or substantially lower their prices. If you use third party cables it can be a worry but if it is Beldon, or another good brand, that has been manufactured to the correct specifications, there should be no problem.

Having used iFix and Wonderware

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Been there, done that. And RSview, and Factory Link, and Wizcon, and several others. Give me Citect any day. The only other one I quite like, it is very powerfull and inexpensive, uses OPC for connection to everything, also quite happy with VB, is CX-Supervisor. For an inexpensive SCADA it is great. All the others mentioned above are really quite expensive but have a lot more bells and whistles.

Horses for courses.

One advantage of using a SCADA package that is PLC independant, is that they usually can connect with everyone's hardware, plus I think the Tech. support is better.

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ABSOLUTELY!! That is the whole point!

Personally I would use wonderware but I am a little biased. Most of the systems I design are clx with ww interface.

You can not go wrong with any of GE Fanuc's offerings either.
Proficy (Cimplicity PE) HMI is very good at networking everything together or the Intelution products have some very nice modules for data collection and product monitoring (if you need to keep track of batch lots or serial numbers). For simple MMIs I would recommend the QuickPanel View products that also integrate very well with the other software products. The strength with these is that they all integrate with eachother and with SAP, Orical or other interprize software.

If this sounds like an advertisement it is because I make my living supporting some of these, but that is also how I know that they are very good doing what they were designed to do.

In your searches, make lists of the needs at each HMI location and use the product that makes since there. By using a family of products that cover a wide range of functionality and that integrate well with eachother you can minmize cost and still maintain standards and quality.

All the above products are capable of delivering a professional result.

If you really need to make and informed choice then I suggest you do a five step selection procesure.

1. Make a list of six or so products. eg, iFix, Wonderware, RSViewSE, Citect, Cimplicity, get hold of their product technical specifications for the LATEST versions, and spreadsheet them.

2. Then roughly categorise which features are "essential", "desirable" and "nice to have". Sort the above list into an order corresponding to your needs.

3. Make some notes about how you perceive the relative strengths of the technology, market share, and depth of support each product enjoys. This should not be the vital criterion, but is of significance.

4. Get hold of demo copies of the top TWO. Put them in front of the guys who will be using them and set up a short project to complete. Choose one. Usability and efficiency will be the aspects you measure here.

5. Repeat the exercise with the winner and the third on the list.

By now you should have a good idea of which product you will be happiest with.

Who is the user ??

Good product, adaptability, inter connectivity, tech support are real important but What about asking the guys who have to use it ??

Sorta like asking a truck driver what he wants Pete Freightlner or Kenworth.

Dan Bentler