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gorillaz_sg
August 15th, 2006, 09:30 PM
hi all

I am still new for the AB remote I/O scanner and now I need to write a program to read remote I/O cards. So pls give me some advice in this area. Now I am reading the manual and I saw some sample program. I think I am using the Bidirectional Alternating Block Transfer.

Thanks in advance
gorillaz_sg

Operaghost
August 15th, 2006, 10:18 PM
With the Allen-Bradley PLC products there are essentially three different PLC families. The PLC-5, SLC 500, and Logix5000.

I am guessing here that you are referring to the SLC 500 since you mentioned the Remote I/O scanner module.

There is a significant difference with how these different PLCs communicate with the Remote I/O. Can you please give us a little more info:

Speficially which PLC processor are you using. This would be something like a PLC-5/30 or an SLC-5/04.

Also, what is the catalog number of the scanner you are reading about? Is it a 1747-SN?

Next, what type of Remote I/O chassis or modules are to be configured? Are the I/O modules, digital (on/off) or are they analog (4-20mA)? This makes a difference as well. Digital I/O modules do not require the block transfer you asked about. Only analog and some other specialty modules require these instructions.

Lastly, what software are you using to perform this configuration? RSLogix 500? What version is the software?

Once we know these things we can offer much more usable help.

But in the meantime, if you are indeed looking to communicate from a PLC-5 or SLC 500 to analog I/O modules in a remote chassis then you are on the right course. You might even consider the: bidirectional alternating repeating block transfer method. But give us some more details and you'll get more detailed responses.

OG

504bloke
August 16th, 2006, 01:35 AM
Also if its an SLC then specifically which processor and what firmware revision is the processor ?

gorillaz_sg
August 16th, 2006, 02:34 AM
hi Operaghost

Ya u r rite i am using the SLC 500 and the processor is 1747 L551B/C 5/05 and RSLogix 500 version 7.

The catalog number of the scanner I am reading is 1747-SN.
And I need to configure AI card 4~20mA.

The attached file is the part that I don get it. The rest abit abit understand only.

The screen is captured from page D-25 example from 1747-SN manual.

Thanks in advance.

gorillaz_sg
August 16th, 2006, 02:35 AM
hi 504bloke


I think the reply just now got the enough information.


Thanks in advance.

504bloke
August 16th, 2006, 03:36 AM
hi 504bloke


I think the reply just now got the enough information.


Thanks in advance.

The reason i asked is because if the 5/05 processor has OS501 series C or above then you can use the BTR/BTW Instrucions, if its not then you have to do block transfers using the M files in ladder logic.

gorillaz_sg
August 16th, 2006, 04:08 AM
ya 504bloke I need to use the M file to do the block transfers. Pls help me out thanks

504bloke
August 16th, 2006, 04:20 AM
Read This (http://domino.automation.rockwell.com/applications/kb/RAKB.nsf/0/18655FAAA011E0AA85256AFB0062DB71?OpenDocument) first

Then read this (http://domino.automation.rockwell.com/applications/kb/RAKB.nsf/0/2C37AE4F4AB0237585256AFB0067EE96?OpenDocument) for an NI4 example using ladder logic or this (http://domino.automation.rockwell.com/applications/kb/RAKB.nsf/0/3BBF08875C97053685256AFB0067EA84?OpenDocument) example for an NI8 module

Personally i would just upgrade the firmware in the 5/05 and use the BTR/BTW commands.

gorillaz_sg
August 16th, 2006, 05:07 AM
Thanks alot 504bloke I ll read it through. by the way where can I get the BTR/BTW commands sample programs?

Thanks again.

504bloke
August 16th, 2006, 08:07 AM
Heres (http://domino.automation.rockwell.com/applications/kb/RAKB.nsf/0/F16894DFE7679BF485256AFB006E2306?OpenDocument) an example of BTR/W with an NT8 which is pretty much the same as an NI8.

You may also want to take a look here. (http://domino.automation.rockwell.com/applications/kb/RAKB.nsf/0/FC07C5A35898838085256AFB0069FA95?OpenDocument)

Operaghost
August 16th, 2006, 01:00 PM
First thing you need to do is upgrade the firmware revision of your processor to allow for use of the BTR and BTW instructions. This will make the Block Transfer procedure MUCH easier.

I would not recommend proceeding without the upgrade. Without the BTR and BTW, this is a procedure that requires a strong knowledge of the controller.

If memory serves me correctly, I think this upgrade may be free. Contact your supplier and they can let you know for certain. If it isn't free, it was pretty inexpensive, and one purchased update could be applied to all of your 5/05 processors.

OG

gorillaz_sg
August 17th, 2006, 02:02 AM
hi thanks to all friends
I think I understand abit more but I have another question which is "what is the logical rack? " As I understand I think it's just a mapping of the Remote I/O card to the scanner. But I don know how to map it? I saw ppl using Rack 0 Group 0 slot 0 for 000. Rack 0 Group 1 slot 0 for 010. But I don get it. Is it depend on the physically rack or ...?

Thanks again.
Actually I wanna update my firmware and I can use the BTR/BTW instructions but I think I have no choice because the first person who write this program write in this way I have to follow as my boss wish.

Ken Moore
August 17th, 2006, 04:58 AM
You haven't given any details on your remote I/O. But generally speaking you have to configure your scanner to match the ASB in the remote rack.

I don't have an ASB manual on hand, but there are three dip switch banks, that are used to set baud rate, type of addressing (1/2 slot, 1 slot, two slot), logical address and length etc...
I recommend you down load the ASB manual and ensure your switches are set correctly. If you have any problems, post back.


RIO has been around for a long time, when it started out, 8 bit processing was the standard.
So.... each logical rack is only 8 slots, if you have a physical chassis with 10 slots, it will have two logical racks, one logical rack for the first 8 slots, and then another for the remaining two slots. The preceeding was based on 1 slot addressing.

gorillaz_sg
September 4th, 2006, 01:26 AM
hi long time no see all friends

Past few days i ve been reading the manual and this part in the pic (config the G file) I not very sure. 1/2 rack means only using the group 0 to group 3 As far as I understand. But one group is one slot rite if 1 slot addressing?? If true, then I can use 4 AI or AO cards for rack 0 rite??

Thanks in advance
gorillaz_sg

Operaghost
September 4th, 2006, 11:57 AM
I think you are on the right track but for the moment let's forget about slots.

With RIO the terms Rack and Group are important terms to know and know well.

First off,as you probably already know, the PLC memory is organized into bits and words. A bit being a single location for storing on/off data and a word is 16 bits grouped together to allow storage of a value.

A Remote I/O Group is one word of input data and one word of output data. Or sixteen input bits and sixteen output bits.

A Remote I/O Rack is (8) I/O Groups. Or 8 input words and 8 output words (128 input bits and 128 output bits).

Racks can be broken down into the following:

1/4 Rack = 2 I/O Groups
1/2 Rack = 4 I/O Groups
3/4 Rack = 6 I/O Groups
Full Rack = 8 I/O Groups
A 1747-SN RIO Scanner Module is capable of 4 RIO racks which are numbered from Rack #0 to Rack #3. This means a total of 32 groups or 32 Input words and 32 Output words. The words are identified as 0-31.

Now as mentioned earlier, RIO is an older network that is based on an 8-bit numbering system. So what that means is that the Rack and Group numbering is in octal. The SLC 500 however understands decimal.

The rack # is combined with the group number to arrive at a word number in the SLC. So for example rack #0 group #0 combined would be 00 in octal which would mean word #0 (decimal) in the SLC. If you had a module in Rack #2 Group #4 then that would be 24 in octal which would be word #20 (decimal). So the very last address would be Rack #3 Group #7 which would be word # 31.

So when you configure the Remote I/O adapter (by dip switches) you must specify for that adapter how many groups it will use.

When you configure the Remote I/O Scanner Module (using the G File Config in software) you must specify how big each rack is and where it starts. Typically your first chassis would start at Rack # 0 and Group #0. But your first chassis could start at any rack # and any group #.

OG

Operaghost
September 4th, 2006, 12:16 PM
The next task is identifying Slot Addressing.

When configuring a RIO chassis you must specify how the slot # and the groups are related.

With 1-slot addressing, each slot is assigned one group. So each slot has available to it one word of input and one word of output.

Lets assume you have a main chassis with a RIO scanner in Slot #5. If you had a 13-slot remote chassis and configured that chassis to begin at rack #0 then you would have the following:

Slot #0 - 1747-ASB Adapter module
Slot #1 - Rack #0/Group #0 - SLC Word #0 (I:5.0 and O:5.0)
Slot #2 - Rack #0/Group #1 - SLC Word #1 (I:5.1 and O:5.1)
Slot #3 - Rack #0/Group #2 - SLC Word #2 (I:5.2 and O:5.2)
Slot #4 - Rack #0/Group #3 - SLC Word #3 (I:5.3 and O:5.3)
Slot #5 - Rack #0/Group #4 - SLC Word #4 (I:5.4 and O:5.4)
Slot #6 - Rack #0/Group #5 - SLC Word #5 (I:5.5 and O:5.5)
Slot #7 - Rack #0/Group #6 - SLC Word #6 (I:5.6 and O:5.6)
Slot #8 - Rack #0/Group #7 - SLC Word #7 (I:5.7 and O:5.7)
Slot #9 - Rack #1/Group #0 - SLC Word #8 (I:5.8 and O:5.8)
Slot #10- Rack #1/Group #1 - SLC Word #9 (I:5.9 and O:5.9)
Slot #11- Rack #1/Group #2 - SLC Word #10 (I:5.10 and O:5.10)
Slot #12- Rack #1/Group #3 - SLC Word #11 (I:5.11 and O:5.11)
When configuring the ASB module via dip switch you would identify that this module is using 12 groups.

When configuring the G-file, you would identify that Rack #0 starts at group #0 and is a full rack. You would also configure Rack #1 to start at group #0 and is 1/2-rack.

You could configure a whole new chassis to start where the previous chassis left off. So the next chassis could start at Rack #1 group #4. But it can start at any address not already used.

OG

Operaghost
September 4th, 2006, 12:21 PM
With 2-slot addressing, each two slots is assigned one group. So each two slots have available to them one word of input and one word of output.

Lets assume you have a main chassis with a RIO scanner in Slot #5. If you had a 13-slot remote chassis and configured that chassis to begin at rack #0 then you would have the following:

Slot #0 - 1747-ASB Adapter module
Slot #1 - Rack #0/Group #0 - SLC Word #0 (I:5.0 and O:5.0)
Slot #2 - Rack #0/Group #0 - SLC Word #1 (I:5.0 and O:5.0)
Slot #3 - Rack #0/Group #1 - SLC Word #2 (I:5.1 and O:5.1)
Slot #4 - Rack #0/Group #1 - SLC Word #3 (I:5.1 and O:5.1)
Slot #5 - Rack #0/Group #2 - SLC Word #4 (I:5.2 and O:5.2)
Slot #6 - Rack #0/Group #2 - SLC Word #5 (I:5.2 and O:5.2)
Slot #7 - Rack #0/Group #3 - SLC Word #6 (I:5.3 and O:5.3)
Slot #8 - Rack #0/Group #3 - SLC Word #7 (I:5.3 and O:5.3)
Slot #9 - Rack #0/Group #4 - SLC Word #8 (I:5.4 and O:5.4)
Slot #10- Rack #0/Group #4 - SLC Word #9 (I:5.4 and O:5.4)
Slot #11- Rack #0/Group #5 - SLC Word #10 (I:5.5 and O:5.5)
Slot #12- Rack #0/Group #5 - SLC Word #11 (I:5.5 and O:5.5)
When configuring the ASB module via dip switch you would identify that this module is using 6 groups.

When configuring the G-file, you would identify that Rack #0 starts at group #0 and is a 3/4-rack.

You could configure a whole new chassis to start where the previous chassis left off. So the next chassis could start at Rack #0 group #6. But it can start at any address not already used.

OG

Operaghost
September 4th, 2006, 12:31 PM
With 1/2-slot addressing, each slot is assigned two groups. So each slot has available to it two words of input and two words of output.

Lets assume you have a main chassis with a RIO scanner in Slot #5. If you had a 13-slot remote chassis and configured that chassis to begin at rack #0 then you would have the following:

Slot #0 - 1747-ASB Adapter module
Slot #1 - Rack #0/Group #0 & 1 - SLC Word #0/1 (I:5.0 and O:5.0 and I:5.1 and O:5.1)
Slot #2 - Rack #0/Group #2 & 3 - SLC Word #2/3 (I:5.2 and O:5.2 and I:5.3 and O:5.3)
Slot #3 - Rack #0/Group #4 & 5 - SLC Word #4/5 (I:5.4 and O:5.4 and I:5.5 and O:5.5)
Slot #4 - Rack #0/Group #6 & 7 - SLC Word #6/7 (I:5.6 and O:5.6 and I:5.7 and O:5.7)
Slot #5 - Rack #1/Group #0 & 1 - SLC Word #8/9 (I:5.8 and O:5.8 and I:5.9 and O:5.9)
Slot #6 - Rack #1/Group #2 & 3 - SLC Word #10/11 (I:5.10 and O:5.10 and I:5.11 and O:5.11)
Slot #7 - Rack #1/Group #4 & 5 - SLC Word #12/13 (I:5.12 and O:5.12 and I:5.13 and O:5.13)
Slot #8 - Rack #1/Group #6 & 7 - SLC Word #14/15 (I:5.14 and O:5.14 and I:5.15 and O:5.15)
Slot #9 - Rack #2/Group #0 & 1 - SLC Word #16/17 (I:5.16 and O:5.16 and I:5.17 and O:5.17)
Slot #10 - Rack #2/Group #2 & 3 - SLC Word #18/19 (I:5.18 and O:5.18 and I:5.19 and O:5.19)
Slot #11 - Rack #2/Group #4 & 5 - SLC Word #20/21 (I:5.20 and O:5.20 and I:5.21 and O:5.21)
Slot #12 - Rack #2/Group #6 & 7 - SLC Word #22/23 (I:5.22 and O:5.22 and I:5.23 and O:5.23)
When configuring the ASB module via dip switch you would identify that this module is using 24 groups.

When configuring the G-file, you would identify that Rack #0 starts at group #0 and is a full rack. You would also configure Rack #1 to start at group #0 and is a full rack. Also rack #2 starts at group #0 and is a full rack.

You could configure a whole new chassis to start where the previous chassis left off. So the next chassis could start at Rack #3 group #0. But it can start at any address not already used.

OG

Operaghost
September 4th, 2006, 12:58 PM
You must also choose whether you want to enable the Specialty mode transfer or the Discrete mode transfer. This is a dip switch on the ASB RIO adapter module. This really affects how the analog cards will work.

In Discrete mode all data from all cards is transferred automatically to and from the modules. But you are limited to 8 words of input and 8 words of output per RIO rack. This is particularly limiting for analog cards and 32-point cards.

In Specialty mode, all discrete cards transfer their data automatically, but analog cards require the block transfer to get or send data. Using block transfer the data will NOT land in the Input or Output data files, but instead will be stored in Integer files.

Now, if you use 1-slot addressing and discrete mode a 4-channel analog input card placed in slot #1 will use word #0, word #1, word #2, and word #3. Which means slots 2,3 and 4 would not have any inputs available to them as the first card will have stolen their inputs.

If you use 1/2-slot addressing and discrete mode a 4-channel analog input card placed in slot #1 will use word #0, word #1, word #2, and word #3 of the input file. If you place an 4-channel analog output card in slot #2 it will actually use word #0,word #1, word #2, and word #3 of the output file.

It is imperative using discrete mode and 1/2 slot addressing that the analog cards be no more than 4-channels and that the cards are alternated. 1/2-slot addressing pairs the slots so slot #1 and slot #2 can share their input and output words. Slots are paired in odd/even numbers (7 is paired with 8 not 6). If an input card is placed in an odd slot then an ouput needs to be placed in the even slot.

OG

gorillaz_sg
September 4th, 2006, 07:43 PM
Thanks alot OG

I still lost abit about the 1/2 rack 4 I/O groups. I define my remote I/O rack as #0 group 0 in G file(1/2 rack). Is it that I can use 4 AI cards for 1/2 rack?

Thanks again.

Operaghost
September 4th, 2006, 08:59 PM
Yes. But only if you alternate modules in odd even patterns.
For example this is OK:

Slot #0 RIO Adapter
Slot #1 Analog Input
Slot #2 Analog Output
Slot #3 Analog Input
Slot #4 Analog Output
This is also OK:

Slot #0 RIO Adapter
Slot #1 Analog Input
Slot #2 Analog Output
Slot #3 Analog Output
Slot #4 Analog Input
This is not acceptable:

Slot #0 RIO Adapter
Slot #1 Analog Input
Slot #2 Analog Intput
Slot #3 Analog Output
Slot #4 Analog Output
OG

gorillaz_sg
September 5th, 2006, 12:41 AM
Thanks alot OG

Now I quite clear the concept.
But I still wondering if I wanna use 4AI cards(not AO) is it possible?
One more thing is no matter 8AI or 16AI is it?

Operaghost
September 5th, 2006, 01:13 AM
Using the discrete transfer mode option limits you options. To use 4-channel AI modules wold require that you skip slots like this:

Slot #0 RIO Adapter
Slot #1 4-channel Analog Input
Slot #2 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #3 4-channel Analog Input
Slot #4 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #5 4-channel Analog Input
Slot #6 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #7 4-channel Analog Input
Slot #8 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #9 4-channel Analog Input
Slot #10 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #11 4-channel Analog Input
Slot #12 Leave blank or discrete output only
OR:

Slot #0 RIO Adapter
Slot #1 8-channel Analog Input
Slot #2 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #3 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #4 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #5 8-channel Analog Input
Slot #6 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #7 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #8 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #9 8-channel Analog Input
Slot #10 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #11 Leave blank or discrete output only
Slot #12 Leave blank or discrete output only
This is just simply due to a lack of memory. Each group only has 1 word of input and output memory. An 8-channel card needs eight words. In 1/2-slot addressing that means 4 slots.

Using Block Transfer would make this all so much easier and remove these module placement restrictions.

OG

gorillaz_sg
September 7th, 2006, 12:39 AM
Thanks again OG

I ll try first and post back if i got any problem

siva_maddala
February 6th, 2007, 01:37 AM
Hello sir,

My name is siva. Working as a PLC programmer. Recently i am attending to do the project for allen bradley redundancy. Here i am unable to understand how to fill the EDIT G DATA in Advanced I/O CONFIGURATION OF I/O CONFIGURATION. The details of the hardware configuration of the project is it is an allen bradley SLC500.It contains two racks the primary and seconday(or)MAIN And Backup.
The modules conained by the primary rack is
1746-P2
1747-L552
1747-BSN
1746-N2(Card slot Filler)
1746-N2(Card slot Filler).
This is the primary rack configuration. The secondary rack configuration is also the same as the primary rack configuration
The details for the remote input output rack is as fallows
it is 10slot chasis
1746-P2
1747-ASB
1746-NI8
1746-NI8
1746-N2(Card slot Filler)
1746-N2(Card slot Filler)
1746-IB16
1746-N2(Card slot Filler)
1746-N2(Card slot Filler)
1746-N2(Card slot Filler)
1746-OB16.

This is the only one remote input output rack. for this configuration how can i fill the EDIT G DATA in Advanced I/o Configuration of the I/o configuration for the SLC 500 ALLEN BRADLEY PLC.

Sir i think at present you are the right person for me to guide in this configuration.Because i am the regular viewer of the PLCS.NET. Then i studied the quote for ASB modules in AB then i found the reply from your address. So kindly Help me regarding this configuration. This is the my mail id: siva_maddala@yahoo.com
Try to help me. I will wait for your reply. thanks and regards
M.SIVA

gorillaz_sg
February 8th, 2007, 07:22 PM
http://literature.rockwellautomation.com/idc/groups/public/documents/webassets/browse_category.hcst


Hi i think this will help. you key in the 1747 ASB keyword and you will find the manual. If i not wrong, i think the config for G data is at the 1747 BSN.

Gorillaz_sg

Ron Beaufort
February 9th, 2007, 08:14 AM
Greetings siva maddala ...



in order to really nail this down, we need to know the settings of ALL 24 of the DIP switches on your ASB module ...


have you made all of those settings yet? ... if so, please tell us what they are ... if you need help with the settings, we can do that too ...