Setting up message board display from network

2004sk4

Member
Join Date
May 2005
Location
Georgia
Posts
172
The current project i am looking into from management is to display buggy capacity on a message board to allow the lift truck driver determine which machine needs the raw materials first. We are having alot of issue with machine downtime becuase the driver pull material to the wrong machine first.The product is feed from a buggy into a j-box. The jbox is not big enouch to fit a whole buggy worth of product because of space constaints

There is a total of 6 production lines. Each line has a 5/05 or micrologix 1100 plc hooked to the ethernet. The product will be read with a 0-10 volt ultrasonic sensor,(banner q45 series) Each plc will have the sensor logic included to scale the photo eye and determine the low and empty states and how long the machine was down for no product.

I have planned on using a microlgix 1100 to recieve the data from the various lines and to transfer the data to the board through the serial port to the message board(possibly ezautomaiton marquee.)

I would like any help on the best way to setup up this type of network.

I would also ask for any information on displaying information to
a message board with ascii.

thanks
 
Alittle more information
The photoeye will be reading a 0-10volts q45 ultrasonic sensor. The sensor will transfer 0-10 volts to 0-100% of capacity. I will need to transfer the 0-100% integer from all 6 plc to the target plc which will host the marqee.

Is it better to do a msg read or msg write.?

What is the best way to use the msg function with 6 plc without getting a timeout error? sequences or timers or on data change.

Should i use a multi-hop if all of the plc retain the same gateway address

What control bits need to be set and loophole watched out for?

I appologize ahead of time for all the questions but the whole msg thing is new to me.

thanks
 
Wait!

Let me save you some headache. The ML1100 will NOT work with the EZMarquee message displays via the serial OR optional Ethernet interface. It won't work with your 5/05 either. The problem is the EZautomation specific ASCII is case sensitive. You can only send upper-case strings with an 1100 or 5/05. I had to use a Compact Logix L-35E to accomplish this. I was highly dissapointed.

The money I saved by purchasing the cut rate message display was spent on the more expensive PLC required to drive it. I have only purchased AB message displays since. The build quality in the EZMarquee message displays is horrible and their tech support is lacking in knowledge.

Hope this helps,

Greg
 
Greg,
Thanks for the head up on that one. They surely don't mention that on their web site. How much should a AB single color 2line 20 or 40 character board cost. I have also looked into uticor but they are also owned by avg. (the higher end of ez-automation).
thanks
 
You're welcome. They don't have it on their website because their engineers didn't know about it. I spent many hours on the phone with them.

If you go to www.ab.com you can get retail pricing on the message displays. Go through your local distributor to get the most current pricing and discounts though...

Greg
 
If the processors are already communicating over ethernet why dont you simply set up a que and put a big red light at each dump area. You can use 5 discrete outputs and only illuminate the line that has priority? It might be a little cheaper.
 
Doug,

I agree. Stay away from message displays whenever possible. They require interpretation. A red light works wonders in terms of simplicity and at-a-glance status. Save the message displays for upper management who wants something flasy to view production data...

Greg
 
Greg and Doug,
I think you might be right about the message board but it was management that came up with it. "they say they saw it at some plant tour " The main thing right now is i don't have any of the plc networked together. They are all on the network for online editing and viewing but no information is transfered between them. I would like to know any information at all about the pros. and cons of setting up a network of plcs.


If the message board is used it will be something to this extent.
a 2 line 40 char board would work.

MINI-100% ML1-100% ML3A-100% ML4-100% 37 CHARACTERS
OFF -100% ML2-100% ML3B-100% 28 CHARACTERS

the % would flash when it gets to a certain level or a request from the machine operators for assistance.
 
Last edited:
What are you trying to do?

Upper management always seems to be impressed with message displays in OTHER plants. Since you seem a little new on the block, I'll give you some pointers. If you integrate a message display you will get:

-Everyone in disagreement as to what, how, what color, and how the data on the display should look.

-People asking you to put things on the display which are not practical...suddendy your display is no good.

-The "if only you could display this", your display would work better for ME.

-Asked to display the current sports scores.

Don't get me wrong, a properly thought out message display integration DOES have its place. Production data, status, and efficiency are some good applications. This works especially well when you display information by shift, you then get some competition and pride in the employees per shift. (in the right application).

As for networking your PLC's to get information:

-Why do you want to do this?

-Would this provide remote diagnostics and troubleshooting capability or provide data....or both?

-Do you know where you would need industrially hardened Ethernet devices and areas office grade equipment will suffice?

-Who is interested in the information you will provide?

-Is any of the data you provide "actionable"?

-This is a big project, depending on your layout and needs...but that's just it, you need to first determine the need and reason to network your PLC's together.

Hope this helps,

Greg
 
Greg,

The sports scores is funny to me. I could see that question being asked.

-Why do you want to do this?
I am only wanting to pull one data point from each machine. Management has asked to display the data of all the machine capacity in one place. The machines are spread far apart and have many detours between them. I think it will be easiest to translate the data on the local plc of that machine and then send the final result to a plc near the stacklights or marquee.

-Would this provide remote diagnostics and troubleshooting capability or provide data....or both?
Right now the Data would be all that is needed.

-Do you know where you would need industrially hardened Ethernet devices and areas office grade equipment will suffice?
Every machine has a din rail mounted Hirschmann industrial router. All of the machines have touch screens so i have one data drop that splits though the router.

-Who is interested in the information you will provide?
I am the one that will be using the information. I have programmed and update a variety of machines at the plant. I just have no experience with the msg function and don;t want to fall through any trap doors so to speak.

-Is any of the data you provide "actionable"?
What do you mean "actionable" The data will be for display use only. I will not be tracking any of the information.

-This is a big project, depending on your layout and needs...but that's just it, you need to first determine the need and reason to network your PLC's together.
The plc will only need a data tranfer from each machine to the remote plc at the marquee. No machines will be hook together. A good start is to send a 0-100 integer from the 7 different machines to 1 plc. That plc will evaluate the infomation and determine the color to display for the #'s. I know this is a big project but the only way to learn it is to try.


btw.
thanks for all of your help so far


 
From what I am hearing the message display is overkill to say the least. And I agree that a well planned display is very functional but you may be opening a can of worms here. It is a little confusing to me that you sound intimidated by per to per messaging but you are ok with setting up messaging between all of you processors and a third party display?

Either way I am sure that you will eventually make this work. Maybe I think too simplistically but if you do scrap the message display approach and want to go to the lights at each station you have a couple options.
First
if the slcs are on the same ethernet network the messaging is easy (i am sure you can get help here) then you only need to add a discrete output at each station.
Second
if you want to hardwire your communications you just have to add 1 discrete input (trigger for the light from the processor with the scheduler) in addition to the output.

I think that either way your right you are going to be learning alot on this project. good luck
 
Doug,
The machines are to far apart for a hardwired setup but i believe the stacklights will work. I only need the stacklights to be display at one location(where the buggies are pulled from). The basics will be that all the machines will be linked to one plc. that plc will turn on a discrete output(stack light).

I agree that I might be a little intimidated by the msg logic. I would like to learn as much as possible about it.

Can i use a n10:? or n11:? as the control bit for the message block. I don't have 51 open slot in the n7 integers?

If all the plc's reside on the network would it be considered local or remote?

Do i need to use the multi hop function?

Are there any control bit i need to watch out for during the setup?

If i want to set up the network to only update with a number change how would be the best way to approach this?

thank for everyones help
 
Why don't you use a basic card in one of the 505's I have a system that currently talks to 12 message displays, it polls them & works a treat.
 

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