OT submersible residential well pump

danw

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Join Date
Oct 2004
Location
midwest, USA
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A precipitous drop in the house water pressure sent me to check the pressure on the bladder tank - only 20 psi on system with a pressure switch set for 30-50 psi. I clamped an ammeter on one of the pump wires at the breaker and its running continuously @ 7A, like it should since it hasn't reached cut-out at 50 psid, but it's not producing any pressure greater than 20psi with no load on the system.

I turned the 240V pump breaker off and the water pressure dropped to zero over 3-5 minutes, so the water's draining back through the pump.

Clearly the 30+ year old submersible pump is on its last legs.

Question: Any opinions about US residential submersible pumps? Brands to use or brands not to use?

Dan
 
danw said:
Clearly the 30+ year old submersible pump is on its last legs.

You should be happy :) thats a lot of showers...

I have installed a few, only one I did not like but I can't remember the brand, we had to pull it by hand 200ft+, the first time was not bad as the check valve on the pump failed (like on yours) but 2 weeks later when the new one failed and the 1.5 pipe was full of water... it was heavy :(

I would recommend hiring a truck to pull it...
 
danw said:
A precipitous drop in the house water pressure sent me to check the pressure on the bladder tank - only 20 psi on system with a pressure switch set for 30-50 psi. I clamped an ammeter on one of the pump wires at the breaker and its running continuously @ 7A, like it should since it hasn't reached cut-out at 50 psid, but it's not producing any pressure greater than 20psi with no load on the system.

I turned the 240V pump breaker off and the water pressure dropped to zero over 3-5 minutes, so the water's draining back through the pump.

Clearly the 30+ year old submersible pump is on its last legs.

Question: Any opinions about US residential submersible pumps? Brands to use or brands not to use? Dan

Dan
Not sure your problem is the pump. If it is drawing the "normal / full load" current of 7 amps then you should have it pumping at full flow.

Do you have a gage on the pump discharge ie wellhead? Is there a valve between that and pressure tank you can shut off and then check pump pressure? Do not leave shut off with pump running for more than 30 seconds.

Are you SURE you do not have large leak in system somewhere? Pump may be pumping its little heart out just to supply the leak. Shut the valve between the tank and rest of system and read the gage.

Are you sure the bladder in the tank is OK and has not lost charge?

Dan Bentler
 
Thanks for input, Dan,

>Do you have a gage on the pump discharge ie wellhead?

No, But there appears to be a 1/4" plug where one could be installed.

> Is there a valve between that and pressure tank you can shut off and then check pump pressure?

No, the only installed valve is downstream of the tank, on the house supply line.

>Are you SURE you do not have large leak in system somewhere? Pump may be pumping its little heart out just to supply the leak. Shut the valve between the tank and rest of system and read the gage.

>Are you sure the bladder in the tank is OK and has not lost charge?

Positive, it's holding its 30 psi pre-charge.

No, I'm not sure. You're right, it could be a break in the 30' of buried line between the well and the house or even in the pipe coming up from the submersed pump through the well shaft.

I figure that for the effort and cost involved in fixing the problem it'll involve pulling pipe. Even if it were 'just' a leak, I'm inclinced to pay the piper and get a new pump, given the age of the system.

Dan
 
You can have the plumber inspect your lines with a fibre optic camera.
Another possibility is that your line could be partially plugged with calcium reducing its overall diameter
 
I concur with the concept of a giant leak, up to and including the pump coming completely off the drop pipe. This can happen BECAUSE of a clog (or stuck or closed valve) that causes the subm to go to shut-off. Without flow, and with max pressure it takes only a minute or so to melt the threads on the male thread adapter and leave the pump hanging by the wires.

That probably isn't YOUR problem because you still have SOME pressure, but a large leak in the drop pipe WOULD explain the combination of low pressure AND NORMAL load amps.

A worn out pump will, by contrast, draw proportionately decreased amps.

A clogged pipe will also result in reduced Full Load Amps

As you said, either way, if the problem is down the well, it's gotta come out. Use a boom truck if you can, clamp on to the drop pipe with a pair of chain wrench vise grips (you'll need 2 pair) just above the casing while you move the lifting strap. If the check valve isn't bad, make a saw cut into the drop pipe above the casing after each lift with the truck. Wear your rubber boots.

A bladder tank failure will not cause the problem you describe, but while you're renovating: be sure to check the air pressure in the tank WITH NO WATER in the bladder. Adjust the tank air pressure to 2lbs below start pressure, with no water. Bladder tanks work on air volume as much as air pressure, so any significant amount of water in the bladder (even at 0psi) while you're adjusting the air, can throw it off.

For the record. I've never heard of a bladder tank lasting 30 years. It's RARE for a submersible to last that long. Best of luck on the NEXT one lasting that long.

: )

Stationmaster
 
Thanks for input.

I pulled the pump this morning and there were two sources of leaks. The main pressure leak came from a galvanic corroded leak on the junction of a galvanized pipe nipple on the outlet of the pump and a brass check valve above it: a good sized hole.

However, piping above the check valve held water. The pressure bleed down when I turned power to the pump off was due to leaking O-rings on the pitless adapter, which for you Suthrun boys, is an adapter that gets the water out of the well casing and into the pipe running to the hosue which is buried below the frost line.

Surprise, the pipe in the well was sch 20 PVC (done 33 years ago).

I put a new Red Jacket pump with a Franklin motor down the well, with new Sch 80 plastic pipe.

My wife and chilluns like having their showers, dish washer and toilets back in normal mode.

Dan
 
Dan,

I'm not exactly sure where Midwest USA is located, by here in the plane old East USA, it is too d..m cold for this kind of nonsense. I recommend scheduling this sort of failure for much warmer weather!

I had the opposite kind of failure last week with the same result. My incoming water pressure regulator failed and I had 135 PSI all over the water system. There were leaks where I didn't know there were places. The water was off over night until I got to change the regulator which was only 6 months old.

Glad to hear you are on top of the problem!


Bob A.
 

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