"Automation Causes Job Destruction" OPINIONS<?>

jdbrandt

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Does anyone besides me have a strong opinion on the above article, which appears in Control Design (print and online) this month?
The premise is that the implementation of automation has caused job loss in manufacturing, and NOT the variety of other factors we all hear about in the media. Among the troublesome words in the article:

"The bogeymen are automation professionals..."

"Automation destroys manufacturing jobs at a fearsome rate..."

I'd love to know if its just me, or if other professionals reading this website think the same thing.
 
As already stated, the only way to stay in business is to replace the expensive to run parts of the business, which is PEOPLE. I see it all the time as capital expense justification.. if we spend xxx on automating this we can redeploy xxx workers.

The whole economy of the US and UK is on a slide, and China and India are on the up so it is impossible to compete without ADVANCED automation, afterall, the developing countries are building automated plants too so who knows where it will all end up.

Cheers
 
Just wanted to highlight a few statements.

And that’s a good thing. It’s called productivity, and making more stuff with fewer people is perhaps the major driver behind improved living standards worldwide over the last few centuries.
Perhaps these manufacturing jobs are moving to China? No, China lost 15 million manufacturing jobs during that time span. Mexican manufacturing employment also declined, and Indian manufacturing employment was flat at best.
Rather than spending billions on protectionism, nations and their workforces would be better off spending a fraction of those sums re-training low-skilled manufacturing workers displaced by automation. These workers could then become productive members of the service sector, or highly trained automation and machine operations employees in the manufacturing sector.
 
It has been a couple of years at least, so I don't remember the name of the magazine. It was related to robotics and the article was about Petersen Manufacturing in Grandview, Missouri.

The article discussed how Petersen added robots to automate, retrained workers, and by the end actually had more workers than before they automated.
 
If your company switches to automation, learn it!

It's an instant technical upgrade to people AND companies. Sadly, I have known people who seriously can't use a mouse n this day and age...

You can join up, or sit around in your underwear and complain about it. Wait, at least it's not "illegals" taking jobs here, lol.
 
I agree

jdbrandt said:
I'd love to know if its just me, or if other professionals reading this website think the same thing.

My first job out of the navy was saw mill controls back in 1980. I think there were 700 then. Now there are far fewer saw mills and each that is left requires fewer people to run them. Before computers lumber was sorted manually on a green chain. This was hard work and very labor intensive. It required a peron for every few type of wood that needed to be sorted. Now it is all automatic and even the stacker makes nice pallets of lumber for the forklift operator to take away. There is usually still a person at the head saw but down stream the edgers, trimmers and canters are all pretty much automatic. The few people that are left are usually maintenance people or those that clear up the wood jam ( jack straws ) and get production going again.

Now that doesn't mean all these jobs have vanished. There are new jobs for those that write the PLCs, optimizer code, develop the scanners, motion controllers and networking etc. The problem is that these jobs require more brain and less brawn that pulling lumber on a green chain.

Note, pulling lumber on a green chain is extremely hard work when you need to pull 2x12s or 4x12s. It often takes two people. Green lumber is very heavy compared to the dried lumber you buy in the store. I know because every once in a while we had to get lumber from the end of the green chain an lug it up to the trimmer and sorter to do testing. I would hate to need to do it all day at a fast pace.

Even know we ( Delta Computer Systems, Inc ) make french fry scanning machines that scan french fries and cuts the defects out. These are called automatic defect removal machines and we are on the third generation of these machines. In the past the potatos would go down a conveyor with about 10 people on either side with knives to cut the defects they cut see out. Now the machines run in auto and do a better job because each fry is scanned after they are cut into fries ( strips ). Each fry is logged to the 1/16th of an inch. The head office can access the machines over the ethernet and get data for each stip going in and how it was processed ( cut if required ).

BTW, it is nice to have some motion control technology when making the clippers that can cut the fries. The trick it so cut the fries without moving them while the move down the conveyor at 330 fpm or faster. We have special BLDC motors designed for this process and striped down versions of our commercial product to do the motion controls. These clippers are so fast that you can't see them cut.

Overall, we have probably displaced far more workers than we have hired or employ through our suppliers.
 
Ten Years Later

I posted this to the Control.com Automation List in January 1998. It's out of context because it replies to a previous poster's comments, but I like the writing:

----------------------------------------------------------------
It's a jarring scene Marc depicts, having your machine go online and send five people packing. One gleaming automaton destroys five livelihoods.

An odd but very common thing, to feel guilty about an accomplishment. "Rationalization" is the right word: Using reason and thought to understand an emotion or instinct.

I have two rationalizations.

When I was seventeen, I got my first real job as a production welder at Alaskan Copper Works in Seattle. One of the things I did was use a balky pantograph to convert part profiles into NC machine code. Three months later I had an IBM AT converting the profiles automatically and I had fixed the CNC and torch gantry and... I had obsoleted myself. And I'm no longer a welder.

The second rationalization for the "morality of automation" is the many occasions when I've attended a machine breakdown and been thrust into the role of doing the automated machine's task by hand- you did it too, Marc, didn't you? Building a machine that deprives a man of his shift of backbreaking drudgery is nothing I feel ashamed of. Ask any draft horse how he feels about diesel engines.

John Henry died with a hammer in his hand because he only knew how to swing a hammer.
 
Assuming you DONT displace people when you automate then the company still benefits because of lower accident / injury rates and associated costs. A perfect example is the sawmill green chain. Lots n lots of carpal tunnel and other soft tissue injuries. Regardless of company savings many people live out their lives with these injuries associated pain etc so there are times when one is better off getting laid off from these kinds of work.

I think also that automated machines require
more support systems such as cooling compressed air,

more maintenance (changing cabinet filters and cleaning cabinets),
more sensors (and as we all know those dont last forever)

So in these cases what you lose in production people you offset somewhat in your maintenance crew.

Finally these often have higher output so you need more people to supply them and take away finished product.

You also have more people working to make the automation equipment.

Last when the electrician and the engineer cant figure out what is wrong you have to bring in the Integration Consultant who creates jobs in the airline hotel and restaurant industries.

REGARDLESS of how we justify it
- when YOU are the guy going out the gate for the last time --
well you can fill in the rest.

Dan Bentler
 
[RANT]
We wouldn't have anything to automate if there wasn't a never-ending desire (from managment/owners/shareholders) to reduce costs and or increase profits, which is caused by us as consumers wanting to pay less. Thats' what is causing the loss of jobs, we as "Automation Specialist (to borrow form another thread) are just another symptom. The industies of countries like China and India are doing so well because you and I are prepared to buy their cheaper product because it saves us money. We are no more (or no less) to blame than anyone else on the planet.
[/RANT]
 
I dont think anyone was looking for a scapegoat. Besides with $2 and 5 pounds of blame I can get a cup of coffee anywhere.

Maybe another way of looking at it is
Better to automated and lose only 5% of jobs at home
than to not do so outsource overseas and lose all 100%

Dan Bentler
 
Dua Anjing said:
[RANT]We are no more (or no less) to blame than anyone else on the planet.
[/RANT]
So why do you feel you need to rant or make excuses? You are not the blame for the law of nature. It existed long before you did.

I invested heavily into energy stocks back in 2003. I make much more on the profits these stocks provide than my increased costs in driving. Essentially I get my gas, petrol, for free. So???? Does that pi$$ any body off?

That is just the way things are. You must see the punches coming ahead of time if you are going to roll with the punches.
 
Last edited:
Peter Nachtwey said:
I invested heavily into energy stocks back in 2003. I make much more on the profits these stocks provide than my increased costs in driving. Essentially I get my gas, petrol, for free. So???? Does that pi$$ any body off?

Yes ! Me ! But only coz I wasn't smart enough to think of that. I didn't mean that last one to sound as a rant. It was more an attempt at (obviously not a good one) humor than I a winge and a need to appoint blame. It's all part of life's rich tapestry
 

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