Can this be done

Steve Bailey

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I'm putting together a system that will include an Allen Bradley Ultra V 3000 drive. The drive will need to follow a pulse train at a ratio to be set by the operator. The ratio can vary over a defined range. Once the ratio is established, it doesn't need to change until the operator decides to enter a new one.

I see where I can configure one (or more) of the drive's digital inputs to put it into follower operation at the stored follower ratio. I am considering using the DeviceNet interface to set the ratio.

My question is, can I use a MicroLogix 1100 with a 1761-NET-DNI module to pass the ratio? The manual for the NET-DNI module says it can be set up as a slave or as a peer, but not as a master. The DeviceNet manual for the Ultra V 3000 says it can only be a slave. Can a peer pass data to and from a slave or do I need a master on the network?

If I have to have a master, what is the minimum PLC model I need? Are there any MicroLogix models that can be DeviceNet masters or do I need to move up to a SLC or Compact Logix controller? The PLC task for the project isn't very sophisticated, so the smallest PLC capable of transmitting motion parameters to the Ultra V drive will be capable of handling the rest of the logic.
 
I'm putting together a system that will include an Allen Bradley Ultra V 3000 drive. The drive will need to follow a pulse train at a ratio to be set by the operator. The ratio can vary over a defined range. Once the ratio is established, it doesn't need to change until the operator decides to enter a new one.

I see where I can configure one (or more) of the drive's digital inputs to put it into follower operation at the stored follower ratio. I am considering using the DeviceNet interface to set the ratio.

My question is, can I use a MicroLogix 1100 with a 1761-NET-DNI module to pass the ratio? The manual for the NET-DNI module says it can be set up as a slave or as a peer, but not as a master. The DeviceNet manual for the Ultra V 3000 says it can only be a slave. Can a peer pass data to and from a slave or do I need a master on the network?

If I have to have a master, what is the minimum PLC model I need? Are there any MicroLogix models that can be DeviceNet masters or do I need to move up to a SLC or Compact Logix controller? The PLC task for the project isn't very sophisticated, so the smallest PLC capable of transmitting motion parameters to the Ultra V drive will be capable of handling the rest of the logic.

A Red Lion HMI or DataStation Plus is able to communicate with the Ultra 3000.
 
hd_coop,

Having the HMI communicate directly with the drive instead of through the PLC is an approach I hadn't considered. Thanks for the suggestion.

The customer seems to want a complete AB solution, although he's not as adamant about the HMI as he is about the PLC and motion controller. Can a Panel View Plus support simultaneous communications with two devices?
 
The Panel View Plus would have to be able to support communications with two different devices using two different protocols. The Red Lion Crimson software lists Ultra 3000 as a separate protocol from any of the PLC choices.

I believe one of my coworkers did get a Panelview plus to communicate with an Ultra 3000 a few years ago. It talked to the Ultra over the Panelviews serial port and used OPC or something I think. He is also the one who used a Red Lion to communicate with an Ultra and said it was about 1,000 times easier than with the Panelview PLus.

Edit: He has also used one of these in the past and said they worked okay...http://www.quartechcorp.com/products.htm

I can't speak personally as I've only communicated with an Ultra over Sercos.
 
Steve I didn't set it up I just have to support it. In the Ultra there is an add in to make it talk to a PV+. I found it once on the KB.
Sorry for being so not definitive but like I said I didn't set it up.
 
Can a Panel View Plus support simultaneous communications with two devices?

Probably. DH-485 and DH+ are peer to peer networks and should be able to accommodate this. The same is true of EtehrNet/IP. DF1, on the other hand, may not.

The PV+ can only support one additional communications adapter, from what I recall, but you can use the built in serial port, Ethernet port, and an extra comms board (DH+, RIO, ControlNet, etc) simultaneously.
 
I have used the Ultra3000 driver in the Red Lion G3 HMI extensively and have found it to be well implemented and very reliable. From your description, it sounds like DeviceNet would be overkill. Check out this thread:
http://www.plctalk.net/qanda/showthread.php?t=22687

If you want to stick with the Panelview HMI, you could get the Red Lion Datastation (DIN rail mount, no screen) and use it just for the servo communication.
 
Last edited:
A simpler option may be to configure the servo drive for step/direction inputs, and use the high-speed output of the Micrologix to control it. Steve I think you alluded to this in your post, but there shouldn't be a need to change the ratio after the initial configuration. Most of the Micrologix PLCs are available with at least one high speed output (DC base models I think). The max speed is 20kHz, probably higher on the 1400. This output can be set up to produce a continuous square wave at a frequency you specify, or to produce a specific number of pulses as a trapezoidal motion profile.
 
The sequence for the axis will be:
1. Rapid traverse to Position A
2. Follow master encoder at Ratio until Position B
3. Dwell for X counts from master encoder
4. Rapid return

Position A, Position B, Ratio, and X will change for different part sizes.

I plan to store that sequence in the Ultra 3000 and initiate it by a discrete output from the PLC wired to one of the drive's inputs. When the operator sets up for a different size part, he will send new data for the four variables to the drive, either directly from the HMI to the drive's serial port or pass them through the PLC and out to the drive over DeviceNet.
 
I have seen this type of application done simply using the serial port to send messages to the Ultra drive. This was with the older Ultra 200 series, mind you.

The PLC code was pretty involved.

A later version of the machine used the Quartech module which handled all the messaging. The quartech unit was programmed to monitor specific PLC addresses (DH+) and when the values changed, a message to the Utra drive was triggered.

This elimiated all the messy serial port logic in the PLC and was quite reliable. I do remember once or twice having to reboot the quartech module after comms failed, but it did run 24/7 for months without problems.

Since your messaging will not be constant, I would think you could use the serial port method with or without an interface module. The module might pay for itself in time savings versus the writing and debugging PLC serial logic.

Paul
 

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