Striving for an entire Automated Plant. Need to Retool Personnel

Rob S.

Member
R
Join Date
Sep 2008
Location
Maryland
Posts
739
Good Morning,

I know this is a Human Resource Management question, but I am sure that many of you have supervisory responsibilities.
In these tough economic times ,I am planning on making our
plant more automated,we also have a new union contact to settle in October. I want to make good investments not only
in machinery , but also in personnel.Do you know of any grade scale systems concerning an employee's worth to the company that can be used to evaluate talent. I am thinking that if you have an employee with certain ratings than you can focus on pushing them in different areas and not put a drag on another dept. I am thinking of coming up with my own system.
Like for instance :
Attendance 1 - 10 8
Desire to solve problems 1 - 10 7
Is he a team player 1 - 10 8
Does he have a desire to learn 1 - 10 5
Does he work safely 1 - 10 6
Does he provide input 1 - 10 7
Overall rating 6.83
etc.
Some topics would need to be a higher score or carry more weight for certain positions, etc.

Thanks in advance for your input.
 
Close the plant. Fire everyone. Change one letter in the company name. Have a grand re-opening. Hire all new people without bad habits (yet). Remind each new employee what happens when the word 'union' pops up.

Much easier then a ratings system, and much more efficient and profitable as well.
 
Additional items to Rate:

How much does he suck up to the boss.
How much unpaid overtime can be had.

Other people can add to the list.


Do you know of any grade scale systems concerning an employee's worth to the company that can be used to evaluate talent.
Click to expand...
no, No, NO

The best thing to do is figure out how to motivate people without using them. Use their skills where they count the best.


Let me be more specific.

Attendance

About the only thing ratable item on this list, and then it's not black & white. If you think it is, then think again.

Desire to solve problems

Some people are problem solvers, some are not. Let's leave it at that.

Is he a team player

This is one the most abused term of the 20th century. Along with "Mission Statement". 'nuff said.

Does he have a desire to learn

Why does every one need to learn more and more and more? Can't they just do their job ? Some people are very very good on specific things and that's all they (and I) want them to do.

Does he work safely

Ok, I'll agree with this one. But still hard to establish a ranking.

Does he provide input

Why does every body need to provide input ? Can't they go along with what's happening ? Or do you want 10 different opinions on everything ?

In summary, all of the above are very subjective depending on who is ranking who.
 
I suspect there are dozens of rating systems out there published in various HR texts and magaziones.

I suspect they are all pretty much dreck.

I've used several rating systems in employee reviews over the years. All of them essentially try to take judgement out of a process that is inherrently judgemental. The fundamental objective of these rating systems is essentially CYA for the reviewer, with a secondary objective of management trying to get assessments from people whose judgements they don't really trust. Management feels they can quantify and make objective an inherrently subjective process.

(Note that many more employees fail because of lack of interpersonal skills than fail from lack of technical job skills.)

My MO was always to use my observation skills and make a decision on how well the employee performed, how they could improve, and what I could do to move their careers ahead. Then, if I had to, I'd fit that assesment into the silly formulas HR developed.

Maybe not kosher, but I ended up with a lot of outstanding employees over the years!
 
I agree with theDave2. Finding good people is like what supreme court justice Potter Stewart once said of ****ography - I can't define it but I know it when I see it.

In 30 years in the biz, I can think of people who would score very high on the list yet are totally useless. I can also think of people who'd score low but I'd hire again in a heartbeat.

Scoring systems like this aren't ENTIRELY useless, but they're a starting point not the be-all end-all. At the very least they can sometimes be a useful tool if HR needs a formal reason get rid of people they'd otherwise want to get rid of anyway.

Attendance? I don't want a "warm body" with a perfect record. Give me a talented person and I'll overlook the occasional absence...as long as they don't abuse the privelege.

Team Player? I don't want any brown-nosers but I don't want any dart-throwers either. I want someone who can follow orders and policy when they need to but can also think for themselves when they need to... and know the difference between the two.

Safety? Agreed. I don't want a safety risk no matter how good they otherwise are. Can be scored indirectly - keep track of things like LOTO and PPE violations and it'll give you a general idea of how safety conscious a person is.
 
You need the perfect Operator:
http://www.yaskawa.co.jp/en/topics/071121_01/index.html

Outfit with 3D vision system for under $100K. Much cheaper then employees when you do the math.

My input on unions is that the existing review processes are not used or enforced. Unions are not inherently bad, it is when we as 'company people' don't put to use the tools that the union provides.

There isn't a union out there that doesn't have a clear cut method to 'write-up' people when they don't perform. Enough write-ups and they are gone.

My big gripe with unions is that it keeps people from striving to excel beyond their current position because they know they just need to 'do their time' to get to the next step.

From my experience, the people that are most vocal about the union are the average to below-average employees. You never here the above-average employees touting that the union is great.

It is because they know the union structure is holding them back for the good of the whole.
 
The *ONE* thing I'll say in favor of Unions though, particularly industrial electricians that are IBEW, is that they generally know what they're doing. As an engineer, I've done commissioning and startups on a number of jobs where the installation was done by IBEW. Say what you want about union policies and laziness and surliness etc - I've my own share of run-ins with the Unions on this - but from a technical standpoint I've never seen an IBEW crew do a shoddy job. I can't say the same for non-union crews.

I did a startup in Florida some years ago. The plant hired a non-union electrical contractor that CLAIMED to have industrial experience to wire a new MCC. My god, it was the worst wiring job I'd ever seen. Open an MCC bucket and the wires might be landed correctly but you'd be confronted with a bowl of spaghetti with no markings rather than wires that were neatly tied into a bundle and then neatly bent to land on the terminals. It was like looking at commercial/residential wiring rather than industrial. They may have been licensed electricians but clearly they had no industrial experience. I've never seen an IBEW crew do a job like that.
 
I have to agree with Fred.... and not just because I was in the IBEW :)

Some unions, IBEW being one, put quality and knowledge high on the priority list. But there are others that don't.

Had a non-union electrician wire up a 3-phase diamond wheel tool grinder. Long story short, it lacked power, and I found out the hard way that it was single-phasing.

He put one of the hot legs on the case ground and I got nailed when I touched the grinder and the machine next to it at the same time, which was properly grounded!

Nothing like a shot of 220 from one hand to the other to get the heart going!

Taught me quick that saving money isn't always the most important thing, even on small jobs.
 
Thanks for all your input. Good points. I was out of the office most of the day and did not get a chance to respond.
I am conducting a baseball mini-camp for 8th and 9th graders,
and the one thing I stress is do not settle for being mediocre. I believe that management needs to be life coaches
as well. What gets me about union employees, is that most do
not desire to pursue their own careers. It is not my job to
pursue their careers for them , but I believe it is my job to
prepare them.What a powerful company , what powerful country we would be if we would just challenge our people. "What do you mean pickup a book and read it" the union is nothing but a dumbing down institution.Most of our employees would not think of picking up a book and learn how their machines work and how
to make their machine work better for them.

" You can have a company without a union , but you can't have
a union without a company "

Me
 
We have a union shop and you are right, people feel that the company is here to support them.

The company is in the business of making money. They pay us to help them make money. Anyone that thinks there is more then that is just fooling themselves.

One thing I try to stress to the Engineering personnel is that we do not make the company money.

We save money by making efficient and robust processes that make quality parts.

The Operators are the one that make money. The things they build get sold to the customer.

The things I build never leave the building until their dead!

Applies more to production facilities then integrators.
 
Just wondering how many of you have ever taken the first Monday in September off as a holiday w/pay?

Or have ever been paid overtime, holiday pay, paid vacations, benefits, etc.

Even though you don't pay union dues some who did help make all of the above the norm in the USA.

Before you bash them, then give up EVERYTHING positive that they ever done too.
 
Unions had their place and, no doubt, made major impacts on work conditions, but their time has past.

They have been replaced by the over-abundence of Lawyers in America.
 
TheStarr said:
Unions had their place and, no doubt, made major impacts on work conditions, but their time has past.quote]

I can only partially agree with you, Starr.

There are still occupations that need unions - hospitality workers come to mind as one possibility. There are other areas where the union has helped ruined an industry - UAW comes to mind here as a possibility.

It comes down to a question of balance. When the employer has too much power the tendency is for greedy bloodsucking capitalists to take advantage. When the employee (union or not) has too much power the lazy bloodsucking workers take advantage.

I've been on both sides of the equation over the years. Neither management or labor has a lock on hardworking decent human beings. Neither managmenent or labor has a lock on nasty avaricious human beings either.
Click to expand...
 
dogleg43 said:
Just wondering how many of you have ever taken the first Monday in September off as a holiday w/pay?

Or have ever been paid overtime, holiday pay, paid vacations, benefits, etc.

Even though you don't pay union dues some who did help make all of the above the norm in the USA.

Before you bash them, then give up EVERYTHING positive that they ever done too.
Click to expand...
You would be right except to put in "demand and supply" in place of "union".
 
Men and Women ,even if they are in a union, can choose to learn ,
pursue a career , multi task , etc. If they have a solid value system
It is time to stand on it and do the right thing. It is all about "Me"
 

Similar Topics

O
Message Read entire Analog Inputs from CompactLogic to another CompactLogic PLC
Hello I need to message read the entire 16 channel raw analog inputs from a 1769-L33ER Compact Logic controller to another 1769-L33ER Compact...
Replies
8
Views
243
Ones_Zeros
O
A
Powerflex set IP without powering up entire drive
Is it possible to set IP address of Powerflex drive, without powering up the entire 3 phase circuit? Is there some way to just power up the keypad...
Replies
3
Views
703
alan_505
A
M
S7-1200 move entire DB via PUT/GET
Hi, I would like to move the values of an entire DB from one S7-1200 to another. Tried to configure GET function but not possible to select DB...
Replies
1
Views
758
Rob...
R
D
Can I edit tags and UDTs in Logix5K without having to reload entire program?
Hi all, I'm working on some Control and Compact Logix A&B PLCs, running Logix5K version 24. I've been doing online edits just fine, but I've...
Replies
6
Views
2,419
jstolaruk
J
B
How do I make my entire program reset and repeat EVERY time a single input is closed?
My program is initiated by a N.O. input and once it is closed, it stays closed until the end of the program cycle (program is still running in PLC...
2
Replies
15
Views
4,126
jdbrandt
J
Back
Top Bottom