Convincing Power..!

markfa

Member
M
Join Date
Mar 2012
Location
dubai
Posts
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Dear respected programmers and plc community. I need your help. I want some solid technical, logical and economical reasons for conversion to plc. i.e to convince customers to convert thier machines on PLC......... waiting for ur kind, helpfull replies (y)
 
What are they running currently? Simple or complex relay logic, or small stand alone controllers like specialized motion controllers or temperature controllers?

The benefits depend on the system.
 
basically they are using simple relay logic and might be some complex logic in demanding conditions...They use printing machinery which i think does not reqire any temp-controller etc.....but mostly they use sipmle relay logic...
The machines might be:
1) Bailing Press.
2) Chart printers.
3) plastic moulders. ( they have temp controllers)
4) wraping machines.
3) carton making machines etc etc.
 
PLC control can improve uptime more than anything else.

Explaining how and why this is true, you can then overload them with explanations that they might grasp, but uptime is valuable, and PLC control (when done right) can always improve reliability of a formerly relay logic controlled machine.

High speed stuff that currently works at the speed of electricity and suffers only from the delays in contact movements should be carefully studied. I have seen two or three situations in which the speed of hard wiring was underestimated when switching to a slow PLC. I have seen more cases where the repeatability and quickness of normal, "slow" PLC I/O greatly improved equipment efficiency (overall machine speed) right out of the gate sometimes with the help of judicious application of better sensors and actuators/controllers along with the PLC.
 
one of the reasons PLCs are more desireable than old Relay Logic, is due to the fact that if you want to make a simple change or optimization you can. doing that in an old relay logic panel can lead to more downtime... lol. but some customers dont like the price or upgrading. in that case you might convince them to go with a cheaper plc solution. just make sure its reliable for the situation lol.
 
Honestly speaking, you would never convinced me to convert a working machinery to PLC control. Why? It works without it. Unless it has an operational problems, difficulties in troubleshooting/maintenance or lack of flexibility.
 
val_99 said:
lack of flexibility.
Click to expand...

That was the other thing I meant to discuss in my first reply.

Switching to PLC control, if done right, can add enormous potential for flexibility as well as quality monitoring. Making a machine more adaptable to current and future needs should always be the focus during re-design.
 
Yeah guyz...!! the most biggest and toughest thing they ask is 'why should i convert it??? is'int it running well now'? and this is the question which can make any engineer dumb *** :ROFLMAO:!!! just want to answer this question!! coz it is the point where your future earnings behold..!! if you can convince them at this point... means some quick and smart bucks add in your pocket:ROFLMAO:
 
We have done a couple of relay-based to PLC-based conversions.
The main selling point was that with relays, maintenance costs where much higher, downtimes much more frequent and longer, and the proces control non-existent (no trending or logging of data).

So the proces was running, but it was not running well.
 
val_99 said:
Honestly speaking, you would never convinced me to convert a working machinery to PLC control. Why? It works without it. Unless it has an operational problems, difficulties in troubleshooting/maintenance or lack of flexibility.
Click to expand...
A total change of opinion, in just two sentences.
You should have been a politician.
 
One of the biggest arguments I use to convert Relay Logic to a PLC is that a relay has a finite life. After so many transition from off to on it is going to fail. It is not a matter of if but a matter of win. The ways it fails will almost always cause unexpected and unpredictable operations. With a PLC when/if it fails it will just shut off.

Also depending on the PLC selected you can get a more robust operator interface for less cost than the same with Relay Logic.
 
Clay B. said:
One of the biggest arguments I use to convert Relay Logic to a PLC is that a relay has a finite life. After so many transition from off to on it is going to fail. It is not a matter of if but a matter of win. The ways it fails will almost always cause unexpected and unpredictable operations. With a PLC when/if it fails it will just shut off.
Click to expand...

PLC outputs aren't magical, many use relay outputs and have the same finite life spans. A PLC can fail in a way that is not just "shut off". Output relays can fail on or off and cause unexpected behavior the same as simple relays.
 
Ask them if they might ever possibly have a need, to make machine operational changes, due to new product needs, etc. If not, tell them to stick with the relays, until you can no longer buy them.

I'd say the biggest bonus of PLC's, is the ability to make operational changes, with shutting it down for hours, and rewiring relays.

Troubleshooting is another bonus, but they would need to have a person on site who could troubleshoot via PLC.
 
If it is a working, reliable machine I would agree with Val 99.
Remember, changeover time is lost revenue and that opportunity for revenue is lost forever.
Remember " It worked 'till we fixed it".
If revenue from that machine is unsteady because of electrical problems then the comments above pertain.
 

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