Square D 8003 MICRO-1 Timing Question

The STIG

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Jun 2012
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I need to program a Square D Class 8003 MICRO-1 controller to time a kiln but I am running into a problem.

I need to be able to run a bank of fans for 12 hours, stop wait a minute or so (to let the fans run down) and then run in the rev direction for 12 hours.

The problem I am having is from my reading this PLC's timers can only be set to a max of 9.999 sec. That is not going to work for me.

My Question,

Is there a function or some other type of timer I am missing that can time 12 hours?

I am new to PLC's so this may be a dumb question but I am still at the level of asking dumb questions.

Any help would be super great. Thanks in advance.
 
Welcome to the forum!
From what I understand the timers have a 100 millisecond or .1 sec timebase to a maximum of 999.9 seconds. I would set up a self resetting timer for 600 tenths or 60 seconds or 1 minute. I would then use that timer output on another rung to trigger a counter with 720 counts (minutes) for a total of 12 hours. I would then use the counter output for whatever you want timed. Just curious, since it is a very old type, do you have the software and cable interface to program the plc?
By the way, you can use WindLdr software by Idec to program this plc. Square D just private branded and re-labeled this plc, Idec was the parent manufacturer. If you have a copy of the current program on the plc, zip it and post it here. Maybe I or someone here can edit it and re-post it for you. For info on how to attach a zipfile, Click on the FAQ button at the top of the screen, then type "attach a file" in the search box.
 
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jrwb4gbm said:
Welcome to the forum!
From what I understand the timers have a 100 millisecond or .1 sec timebase to a maximum of 999.9 seconds. I would set up a self resetting timer for 600 tenths or 60 seconds or 1 minute. I would then use that timer output on another rung to trigger a counter with 720 counts (minutes) for a total of 12 hours. I would then use the counter output for whatever you want timed. Just curious, since it is a very old type, do you have the software and cable interface to program the plc?
By the way, you can use WindLdr software by Idec to program this plc. Square D just private branded and re-labeled this plc, Idec was the parent manufacturer. If you have a copy of the current program on the plc, zip it and post it here. Maybe I or someone here can edit it and re-post it for you. For info on how to attach a zipfile, Click on the FAQ button at the top of the screen, then type "attach a file" in the search box.
Click to expand...


Sir thank you very much for your reply. Sorry I have not responded sooner but I was called out of town unexpectedly.

As I said I am very new to PLC programing and have not been able to make a counter work with a timer to give me my needed 12 hours.

I dont have anything to upload as of yet. I have not got to that point yet. What I need is very simple. I have only 1 input. That is just a power on line from the panel. All I need is 2 outputs. 1 for the forward run of 12 hours, a delay of 50 seconds to let the fans run down and 1 for the reverse run of 12 hours. Then a 50 second delay and start over.

Any help would be of a BIG help. Thanks again.
 
I still think using the Idec software WindLDR is the way to go. Having said that, here is a link to a manual that is for how the units were originally programmed with a hand-held Type PR-3 programmer. They were also programmed with SFW-30 Square D software. Please post what you intend to use to program the PLC or what was used in the past.
Link:
http://static.schneider-electric.us/docs/Automation%20Products/SYMAX%20Programmable%20Controller/Micro%20Programmable%20Controllers/30598-791-01A2.pdf
And for the SFW30 software manual.
Link:
http://static.schneider-electric.us...o Programmable Controllers/30598-788-01A1.pdf

See this thread for some additional info.
Link:
http://www.plctalk.net/qanda/showthread.php?t=57669


Edit:
Here is a change of direction to accomplish the task at hand. Unless you have all the necessary programming cables and software, plus the time to learn how to use it, I would suggest getting a 7-day programmable timer with two channels of output to control the fan starters. I have done this in the past. Here are a few links to example timers.
Links:
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/DAYTON-Electronic-Timer-2VJ58
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/DAYTON-Electronic-Timer-2VJ57
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/DAYTON-Programmable-Timer-4A342
 
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Sir thank you again for your reply.

I have not gone threw the links you have posted yet but will this afternoon. I did want to let you know I did download WinLDR softwar but I do not have a cable to hook my toughbook to that PLC.

I will be using the MICRO-1 Program Loader Type PR3 to upload the program.

The Owner of my company really wants to use this Square D PLC to control the fans becasue we already have it in house. Want to keep the cost of this project down as much as he can.

I want to thank you once aqain for all the great help you have given me. I work for a small company and don't really have anyone to turn to for help with this. Thanks again.
 
I looked at the link for the PR3 manual. It seems to be close to the book I have now (Square D Instruction Bulletin # 30598-779-01A1, Oct 1990). I am going to read threw your PDF today.

As always thank you for your help.
 
Here is a link for a cable. I don't know if your toughbook has a real RS232 serial port but you will probably need that plus a 25 to 9 pin adapter to use the 25 pin cable. See page 1-9 in the manual 01A1 in your post #6.
Link:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Square-D-80...367?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43a1c2744f

As you can see, it is not cheap. Old technology is getting more expensive every year. Unless you just have the time, even learning how to use the PR3 can easily run the cost up.
I will be glad to help any way I can.

Edit:
If you need the technical drawings to build a cable and interface, let me know. I have the cables and interface to figure out a drawing if needed.
 
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I found a schematic wiring diagram for an Idec Micro-1 interface cable here on the forum. The Idec Micro-1 and the Square D Micro is basically the same PLC, so this interface cable should work. If you decide to build one, the MAX232 chip will substitute for the MAX202.
Link:
http://www.plctalk.net/qanda/attachment.php?attachmentid=5431&d=1149258271

Here's a link to the thread:
http://www.plctalk.net/qanda/showthread.php?t=136&highlight=idec+micro&page=2

Link to MAX232 chip:
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/MAX232CPE%2B/MAX232CPE%2B-ND/947834
Link to Transistor TR1:
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/BC547BTA/BC547BTACT-ND/1532789
Link to regulator LM7805:
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/LM7805CT/LM7805CT-ND/458698
 
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I have a basic program running on the PLC now but it only has a max forward and reverse times of 999.9 seconds (just like you said it would). Sadly this is a big step for me as this is the first program I have ever done (I am a machinist and tool maker but I do have a strong computer background).

I am as of yet not sure how to add the Counters. I understand the concept but not how to make the timer interact with the counter. I have an idea from the manual you kindly sent me but am still not sure.

I have uploaded my program. Like I said it does run but am sure there is a better way of doing it. Try not to laugh so hard you hurt yourself if you look at it.

To show how new I am I was not sure what file you needed so I uploaded all with the file name I used. Hope I did not just send you my bank statment by mastake because then you will hurt yourself laughing.

Once again thank you so much for all your help sir.
 
I don't see any files attached, here is a link with info how to attach:
http://www.plctalk.net/qanda/faq.php?s=&do=search&q=attach+a+file&match=all&titlesonly=0

You need to put them in a .zip file to upload to the forum.

Edit:
See page 12 in this manual:
http://static.schneider-electric.us/docs/Automation%20Products/SYMAX%20Programmable%20Controller/Micro%20Programmable%20Controllers/30598-791-01A2.pdf

It shows using a counter and special relay 714 or 715. Use 714 and a value of 3600 (seconds) for one hour. Put a NO contact 200 in parallel (OR) with the NO contact 1. Add a rung similar to the 1st one changing the Counter to CNT3 and a value of 12. Change the NO contact (715 in the example) to NO CNT3. Add a rung similar to the 2nd rung in the example, changing NO contact CNT2 to CNT3 and changing 202 to 203.
There is a start. You will probably get the idea from here as to what else is needed.

2nd Edit:
Since you posted WindLDR files in post #11, I will change over to WindLDR info. Just disregard the info above except as an example.
 
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Attached is a WindLDR zipfile, untested, use at your own risk.
I added rungs 3, 4, 9, 10. Changed rung 5 by changing timer 0 to M11. Changed rung 11 by changing timer 2 to M13.
M314 is a 1 second timer, same as 714 on the PR3.
 
Sir this is great. I can not thank you too much for all the great help.

I am just using Windlr to help make the program. I am entering everything with the PR3 Programer. I have no way to get the program out of the computer into the PLC sadly. I have saved the parts list and links you posted. I really would like to make the needed data cable to use WinDLR.
 
Attached is an update, revision 2. I added a new rung at rung 4 and at rung 11. I changed rung 3 and rung 10 output coil addresses. The 3600 seconds (one hour) timers were not resetting in revision 1.
 
Sir
Is there a way in WinDLR (My ver.is 5.34) I can test run a program? I looked but did not see anything. My guess is I missed it.

I know I keep saying this but I once again would like to thank you for all your help with this project. You are my Yoda.
 

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