FactoryTalk View 7.0

Just noticed today that FactoryTalk View 7.0 is out. Anyone had time to find out what was fixed and now broken, was broken and now fixed, what is still broken, and what is just plain different?

Also, AB finally released V21 for the new Compactlogix just in time for my latest controls project. Seems to be working nice so far for the little bit i had to do.

I built a VM with Studio 7.0 and version 21 Logix on it the other day. I have not used it yet, but there are some POWERFUL development tools in version 7.0. Lots of improved search replace functions, Tag substitutions now work on global objects, and a nice cross reference function.

There is no telling what new issues came with it, but I like the new tools a lot. The gui has not really changed much.

There is also a new option to build a Network Directory Connected SE Station project.

RSL

Is version 7.0 only Windows 7 or greater compatible? No more XP?

WinXP SP3 is still supported. O/S up to but not including Win 8 are supported.

OG

Windows XP is a DEAD HORSE. Time to pack it in.

Everything other than legacy type software has worked on Windows 7 for at least a year. Windows 7 is a better OS anyway. I know XP is like an old worn in comfortable blanket, but it is time to get a new one.

RSL

Just started using it today, haven't noticed much other than it loads faster and I believe it no longer uses SQL Express - the installation script indicated it could be uninstalled from the computer.

RSL said:

Windows XP is a DEAD HORSE. Time to pack it in.

Everything other than legacy type software has worked on Windows 7 for at least a year. Windows 7 is a better OS anyway. I know XP is like an old worn in comfortable blanket, but it is time to get a new one.

RSL

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Completely agree, HOWEVER....

The world of Virtual Machines is such a wonderful thing, the unfortunate "catch" is the software OS license for those virtual machines. Windows 7, such a wonderful OS that it gives you a free license for a Windows XP virtual machine! FREEBIE!!! I am sure many have multiple virtual machines that take advantage of this (as I do), however I'm sure others are just using XP key's they may have accumulated over the years, or the corporate volume license XP key as in reality XP is dead and those that have migrated to Windows 7 have plenty of useless XP licensing available.

I think VM's are great, and are the future however from a controls standpoint, understanding the ways to license them becomes cumbersome once you start to consider Windows 7/Windows 8 based VM. Certainly a conversation with IT folk, and certainly makes you wonder about activating multiple Win7/8 VMs. What considerations need to be made with IT or does the controls department go rogue and get their own volume licensing in place to accommodate?

Something I certainly need to learn up on.

And to prevent hijacking the thread, to the OP thanks for the update I'm downloading now!

RSL said:

Windows XP is a DEAD HORSE. Time to pack it in

Click to expand...

It is no where near dead.

It is bleeding to death lying on the ground perhaps, but history tells us it will be breathing its last breaths 20 years from now as far as industrial controls. I am not saying it should be a host OS. Virtualization makes it possible to support Windows XP in our world, ad infinitum.

RSL said:

Everything other than legacy type software has worked on Windows 7 for at least a year. Windows 7 is a better OS anyway. I know XP is like an old worn in comfortable blanket, but it is time to get a new one.

RSL

Click to expand...

I agree with your latter comment regarding the hardware operating system.

And to the others' comments, the virtual Windows OS license is not free, you pay for it with your hardware OS version.

Our IT group uses the Microsoft hypervisor, i forget what they call it.

But, to learn, I just piddled with XPMode and XPMore to get the basics down and practice. It took some trial and error to get it working but now that it does, it is a safe place to install FactoryTalk Studio Patch Roll Ups, for example. Sure this freeware (+ Windows pro license) is slow and missing a few things, but it proves how easy it should be for joe the maintenance tech to figure out how to run (fictional) ServoBlaster from 1997 on his virtual Windows xp sp3 with Windows 10 as the host nine years from now.

Paully's5.0 said:

Completely agree, HOWEVER....

The world of Virtual Machines is such a wonderful thing, the unfortunate "catch" is the software OS license for those virtual machines. Windows 7, such a wonderful OS that it gives you a free license for a Windows XP virtual machine! FREEBIE!!! I am sure many have multiple virtual machines that take advantage of this (as I do), however I'm sure others are just using XP key's they may have accumulated over the years, or the corporate volume license XP key as in reality XP is dead and those that have migrated to Windows 7 have plenty of useless XP licensing available.

I think VM's are great, and are the future however from a controls standpoint, understanding the ways to license them becomes cumbersome once you start to consider Windows 7/Windows 8 based VM. Certainly a conversation with IT folk, and certainly makes you wonder about activating multiple Win7/8 VMs. What considerations need to be made with IT or does the controls department go rogue and get their own volume licensing in place to accommodate?

Something I certainly need to learn up on.

And to prevent hijacking the thread, to the OP thanks for the update I'm downloading now!

Click to expand...

Thats what we have our own VLK that is under the Global corporate Microsoft software assurance program.

Each Site has it's own VLK and at most sites maintenance and engineering has their own VLK. We have to let the IT dept perform audits as they wish and we have to keep a tight track on the licenses.

Also many people but OEM versions of a OS like win 7 for example and install on a VM. From a licensing standpoint that is illegal. Only retail boxed or volume licenses can be used.

I really wish I could find some more retail boxed versions of XP but they are getting hard to find from reputable sources.

The Plc Kid said:

...
Also many people but OEM versions of a OS like win 7 for example and install on a VM. From a licensing standpoint that is illegal. Only retail boxed or volume licenses can be used.

I really wish I could find some more retail boxed versions of XP but they are getting hard to find from reputable sources.

Click to expand...

Exactly the habit I don't want our department getting into. I'm ready to be done with XP, I know full well that I will be around it for years to come for support of existing equipment, however anything new that I develop I certainly don't need to do it within XP. However, isolation that VMs provide is extremely valuable, so it's important to understand how to achieve the licensing required for Windows 7/8 based VMs. It's a conversation I need to push with my boss. Windows 7 Pro with it's "XP mode" has served well, but out IT department likes to jump on to new OS's and I know Windows 8 will be coming to us soon so I need a migration plan for VMs since Windows 8 won't provide "XP Mode" like Windows 7.

I would like to put FT View 7.0 on a Windows 7 based VM, so off to IT I shall go!

If you want LEGAL copies of Windows 7 VM's and XP Mode then you need to put your Windows 7 license under Software assurance. This gives you access to Windows 7 Enterprise. Which has a different EULA. It also entitles you to free upgrades to future releases. I just changed my host machine to Windows 8. It is lighter on it's feet. I have Windows 7 Virtual machines for my development software. Yes, I do have a Windows XP VM just in case I need it.

Respectfully disagree, XP is dead. It goes out of support by Microsoft at the end of this year. More important, there is no GOOD reason to keep using for RA software.

I have had EVERYTHING on Windows 7 for a LONG time now.

RSL

Sorry, but there is still a bunch of RA software that won't work with Windows 7. I need to support customers who don't always have the time or money (or both) to upgrade their software to the latest. I need to support multiple versions of everything. I'll still need my XP VM for years to come, I'm afraid. There's probably people out there still running stuff on DOS.

As I stated I do have an XP VM for when I need it. It is rare though.

I did not say it was not needed, but everyone acts like it is the absolute right place to run everything. Mostly because we are human and hate change. If the bulk of your work is on products that will not run on Windows 7, I agree you are stuck. (in more ways than one)

All I am saying is we have reached the point in time XP should be the exception not the rule. We are rapidly going to start seeing compatibility issues with XP from this point forward. Clinging to it and saying it is the "way" will only work so long.

RSL

Since most of us are working with customers, it is the customer's platform who "decides" what OS we will be using; we could always recommend a migration to newer hardware, however, whatever it takes to accomplish the at-hand task might be using "legacy" OSs such as WinXP.
I believe XP will be around for a long time; virtual environments OSs do not require the same level of "support" as Host ones do.

jkerekes said:

Sorry, but there is still a bunch of RA software that won't work with Windows 7. I need to support customers who don't always have the time or money (or both) to upgrade their software to the latest. I need to support multiple versions of everything. I'll still need my XP VM for years to come, I'm afraid. There's probably people out there still running stuff on DOS.

Click to expand...

I don't think anyone is discounting the need for Windows XP for support of legacy systems. Certainly any new equipment should not be using Windows XP as it is obsolete and quite frankly dead as a previous poster has said. Unless you opt for the "XP Mode" virtualization solution.

It think it will be interesting when existing Windows XP computers start to die, and cannot be replaced due to finding a solution to license the OS. The original OEM license that came with the original machine is technically not transferable to the new machine, but I know that facilities will violate this to "do what they gotta do". Migration solutions will be required, some can jump to virtualization solutions yet still require a valid XP license, some will opt to upgrade the software to Windows 7/8 equivalent at a cost.

I don't think another OS will have the run that Windows XP did, I think businesses will need to start to understand the life cycle of their automation equipment especially in large integrated facilities were servers and pc's are used instead of dumber terminals like PanelView+'s and equivalents and plan for migration. I think as the role of IT expands into manufacturing assets it will naturally flow, however the growing pains of IT/Automation integration will be there. I think instead of automation companies supplying computer hardware it will change to Automation companies supplying hardware specs, the customer's IT department acquires the hardware and associated OS licensing and sends off to the automation company for software installation and configuration.