Password Creation - HMI Function

schui

Member
Join Date
Sep 2011
Location
Toronto
Posts
51
Again I have been hacked, I used to use a numerical password but got found out, then I tried to use a total of Day + Month + Year but I am looking for some clever ideas that you may use for HMI special functions etc..
I am using Logix 5000 and Ft View and sometimes CMore

Thank you in advance for your suggestions and ideas
 
Did you mean that your co-workers know the passwords? I am currently programming cmore screens. I believe it has only two type of passwords. Built in or PLC tag based.
Cmore built in password is good. PM me your number may be we can talk.
 
Nothing's going to stay secure if people who aren't authorized to use the system learn your password.

FactoryTalk View's approach to password security was to allow the users to be authenticated via a Windows Domain. You can centrally handle password aging, complexity, and changing that way. But virtually nobody really used that feature, and I'm not sure if it's available on the PanelView Plus.

I've seen the date+serial number used successfully. That often results in a code where the user would have to open the cabinet (thereby shutting off the machine) to determine the password.

I personally use physical constants or well-known number sequences with the decimal places removed. This gives me something I can always look up or derive, with a moderate number of digits. I've used Pi, or Standard Gravity, or Avogadro's Number.
 
What is it that gets hacked ?
Normal operator access ?
Superuser access ?
Access to the PLC program ?

Here is an idea:
On a standard program I have some screens on the HMI for setting up the machine with what features are installed. It is a screen that the customer should never have to access.
In order to access the screens, the person has to enter a password that changes for every time a screen is accessed.
He will see a key code and has to enter a release code. The key code is generated by the PLC program. The release code is generated from the key code by a formula only I know.
When the release code is OK, the screens are open for 15 minutes. After that the screen is blocked and a new key code is generated.
In that way, I or our service personnel can access the special screens, and even if someone learn the release code by looking over the shoulder, it doesnt' matter. In the unlikely case the customer has to access the screens, he can contact me with the keycode he see, and get the release code that will grant him access for 15 minutes.
 
GeoffC said:
Nice idea Jesper

+1

I'm also currently trying to develop a method for secure access to HMI special functions, like high level critical bypasses, only allowed under certain circumstances, and only by authorized people.

I constantly have the line engineers and operators peeking over my shoulder when entering my pin number. My colleague has told me he has seen them at the login screens from time to time trying different numbers. They are not authorized to access these functions, but yet they try.

I really like your method JesperMP, but I would only use it for functions where temporary access is permitted or acceptable. It would be useful if you're off-site and called by a manager demanding a HMI function be accessed or bypassed, etc.

Another idea we have come up with is simple, but effective. Put a key-switch near the HMI tied to an input. You turn the key, that only you or authorised persons have, and then enter your password. So even if someone gets the password, they won't have the key. You can still cycle your password using date/day/month, date/serial, etc.

The key-switch allows removal after turning it on, so you don't have to leave it there. If you don't want a bypass or function on indefinitely, you can use a time-delay-off in your program. You can either give a list of available times to select from, or allow entering of the timer preset, limiting the value to a maximum. A discrete message constantly reminds personnel that it's active. When the time elapses, or is soon to, a message displays to notify them. I always time out bypasses, etc. so they're never permanent.

Even though the key-switch is still in the ON position, the function cannot be a activated again until the key-switch is cycled.
Of course, control of the keys is critical but, it's a more difficult and deliberate action to acquire a key that you shouldn't have.

Finger print login would be better, but again, if you're not on-site when they want a function activated. No one person should have sole access to any function for obvious reasons.

However, I'm sure there are lots of programmers out there who do.

G.
 
If it is really required that the operator must be logged in to change settings, and he is not sitting in front of the HMI all the time, then I also would suggest to use a key-switch, card-reader, or fingerprint reader. There are also RFID solutions so that you only have to be near the HMI for it to unlock automatically. Comes at a price obviously.
 
Jespers idea is probably the best.

I've also implemented access to commissioning functions by checking the authority level and user name of the account. Once the machine configuration is compete then the user account for commissioning can be deleted. To gain access to these functions someone must first compromise an administrator account and then know the specific user account to create. The weakness is that once this is route becomes known then it is known for all time so the code hash method is much better.

I've also implemented the keyswitch method but it is important to note that the machine should not be able to operate with the key inserted or they can get left in maintenance mode.

Nick
 
If a USB port is available the YubiKey is a great alternative to typing a password. It hooks on your keyring and in it's basic configuration its nothing more than a keystroke playback device. Press it's button and it "plays" the password into the terminal. It has much more capability than that but for protection from prying eyes, its perfect. I use it every day in my IT responsibilities for this reason.

Downside is that the device needs a USB port that will permit a keyboard interface. That would limit its usefulness in many areas.
 

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