Dedicated Virtualization Rigs...Anyone running one?

Paullys50

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Jan 2006
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WI
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Curious, with the growing use of virtual machines how many of you are running or considering running a dedicated computer to house your virtual machines? I've been thinking about it, mostly as a learning experience but it would be nice to have a second computer as I bounce around supporting projects. My laptop is a powerhouse so it handle's multiple VM's just fine, it's more of a hassle as I review and assist on projects the constant changing of networks, reloading VMs...etc.

So I was thinking of a small footprint setup, the Apple Mac Mini in particular. I just saw a youtube video showing VMWare fusion running on a Mac which was running a VM of Windows 8, which in-turn was setup for Hyper-V running another VM. So you can do nested VMs. I think this would be great as I use VMWare all the time maintaining my current needs and I would get the benefit of working with Hyper-V so I can learn it.

Curious about everyone's approach, however I think I'm probably in the minority with my thinking?

I think the Mac Mini with an i7 processor, 16GB of ram and that fusion drive would be a pretty decent setup for what I'm looking to do.

Thoughts?
 
Paully

I am not sure I fully understand your question but it sounds like you are moving VM's to and from your laptop hard drive.

I run 2 hard drives and only store VM's on the secondary as you get better performace this way and it's a VM Ware best practice.

I also have a small 1.5 TB pocket hard drive that runs over ESATA and that is fast enough to run the VM's directly from that pocket hard drive.You really can't tell the difference from running on the internal hard drive.

As far as hyper v it sucks. Trust me. But if you really want to play with it load it on a flash drive and run it from there and point it to where your hyper v vm's are stored internal HD, external HD, NAS, etc.

You can run ESXI the same way if you want to play around with it and when you are finished remove the thumb drive and reboot.
 
Kid -

I want a second computer to run VMs that are specific for projects. I too have two hard drives in my laptop (both SSD) and run them from my laptop the same as you. Great performance, and I have my backup external drive, connected via esata and that works just as you said.

I sometimes have 4-5 VM's going at once, and pending what they are I need multiple NICs to accommodate, or I need constantly switch IP's, all depends what I'm working on. Very minor hassle, just trying to give myelf reasons to get a Mac Mini ;) (I probably just need a hobby!)

From what I know about Hyper-V it's not something I want to get into, however our IT department is pushing it as they are starting to use Hyper-V within the business and as such they believe we should not be using VMWare because of cost (They have volume Microsoft licensing) and so they can provide better IT support for us. I need to be familiar with Hyper-V as it evolves so I can continue to justify VMWare. Also, for our clients as their IT departments become more involved in control systems (Server, Network specifications) I am sure at some point in the very near future we will be asked to provide solutions for a Hyper-V environment. So I may need to provide that solution on a project, and build test rigs to validate our proposed methods. Better to learn when I am interested rather when I am under the gun!

As for the computer itself, looking at the Mac Mini simply because of the small size and power I can pack into it, I already have a laptop so I don't need another. The Mac Mini seems small enough that I can toss it into my laptop bag and transport it from Home/Work if needed.
 
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I sometimes have 4-5 VM's going at once, and pending what they are I need multiple NICs to accommodate,.

For this I use these https://rockwellautomation.custhelp.com/ci/fattach/get/113620/


or I need constantly switch IP's

In that case I use this http://www.eusing.com/ipswitch/free_ip_switcher.htm

Very minor hassle, just trying to give myelf reasons to get a Mac Mini ;) (I probably just need a hobby!)

Understandable. I purchased mine with the same reasoning except the need a hobby part. I have enough of that going on :)

From what I know about Hyper-V it's not something I want to get into, however our IT department is pushing it as they are starting to use Hyper-V within the business and as such they believe we should not be using VMWare because of cost (They have volume Microsoft licensing) and so they can provide better IT support for us.

Well also with a VLK the VM's on Hyper V and HyperV itself is free. VM's running on ESXI under a VLK fall into usage base rules which are difficult for even MS itself to clarify at times.


I need to be familiar with Hyper-V as it evolves so I can continue to justify VMWare. Also, for our clients as their IT departments become more involved in control systems (Server, Network specifications) I am sure at some point in the very near future we will be asked to provide solutions for a Hyper-V environment. So I may need to provide that solution on a project, and build test rigs to validate our proposed methods. Better to learn when I am interested rather when I am under the gun!.

I agree. If you have any questions fire away. I have to use it on a daily basis so I am a little bit better educated on it than I would prefer to be. But it comes in handy on the IT side of things.

As for the computer itself, looking at the Mac Mini simply because of the small size and power I can pack into it, I already have a laptop so I don't need another. The Mac Mini seems small enough that I can toss it into my laptop bag and transport it from Home/Work if needed.

Yes it does work well for that. I run boot camp on mine also to run VM Ware workstation and not remove the default Mac OS.

You can run hyper V and ESXI in a VM. Most people will tell you it can't be done but it can and it's easy with workstation 8. That is they way I would set it up for testing and education.
 
Thanks for the response Kid, I'll look into the IP switcher, I've been trying to fine a "reliable" one since switching to Windows 7, I've been creating .bat files to achieve similar automatic results, however keeping track of batch files is a pain, I'd like some type of library if I can. I'll have to look at that program at home, "Access Denied!" (Those IT punks!)

I do have a second NIC card already, so that helps but I still bounce between different project virtuals with different IP settings. The second NIC allows me to maintain my corporate internet connection and have a controls network connection.

I'll hit you up once I start playing with Hyper-V, some other project work to get cleaned up first though.
 
Mac Minis are not good for VMs. The 5400 RPM hard drives and weak CPUs will make the VM run slowly. I have 3 Mac Minis and they are the slowest of the slow.
I have an older Mac Pro early 2008 vintage. I still use it and I do almost all my Windoze work in a Win XP VM using Fusion. I am going to replace it with a new computer or at least upgrade the current Mac Pro with an SSD.

You want a computer with lots of memory and a fast hard disk so there isn't a need to do a lot of page outs and if there is a need the page outs and ins will occurs quickly. That won't happen win a Mac Mini.

There may be a chance if the Mac Mini has 8GB or ram or more AND a SSD but then the SSD must be big enough for multiple operating systems.
 
Mac Minis are not good for VMs. The 5400 RPM hard drives and weak CPUs will make the VM run slowly. I have 3 Mac Minis and they are the slowest of the slow.
I have an older Mac Pro early 2008 vintage. I still use it and I do almost all my Windoze work in a Win XP VM using Fusion. I am going to replace it with a new computer or at least upgrade the current Mac Pro with an SSD.

You want a computer with lots of memory and a fast hard disk so there isn't a need to do a lot of page outs and if there is a need the page outs and ins will occurs quickly. That won't happen win a Mac Mini.

There may be a chance if the Mac Mini has 8GB or ram or more AND a SSD but then the SSD must be big enough for multiple operating systems.

Peter

My Mac Mini I was speaking of has a I7 Prcessor and 16 GB ram and 2 256 GB SSD drives. My VM's on it are plenty fast but my VM's are small and lite and app specific.
 
Thanks for the feedback Peter, I completely agree with your assessment. Pick the wrong Mac Mini setup and performance will suffer and certainly won't be of value.

Any computer that I would consider for this has to be similar to the performance specs of my laptop (Dell M6600, i7, 16GB ram, 756GB SSD goodness). I think the Mac Mini has the component selection to match, I'm basically looking build a Mac Mini similar to Kid's specs.

My ideal setup: Quad-Core I7, 16GB Ram, 512 SSD. Certainly on par with a Macbook pro at half the price. (I'd love to have a Macbook Pro, but the one that I want would be well over $3K when you consider a retina display, applecare, and SSD's from apple:wish:).
 
Just a followup, maybe someone down the road might be interested -

Kid, have you considered making your Mac Mini an ESXi or Hyper-V box instead of your bootcamp/workstation setup? Maybe you've already tried it and decided the bootcamp/workstation was ideal for your situation.

I just got a Mac Mini today, got a great deal off of Craigslist. 2012, i7, 16GB Ram and a 1TB Fusion drive. Got ESXi up and running on it, very cool stuff! I might try to setup Hyper-V on it just as an exercise. Already ordered the dual hard drive kit from iFixit, I'll probably be moving my 512 GB SSD from my laptop to the Mac Mini. Add a thunderbolt to Ethernet adapter and I think I'll have a great little setup.
 
Paully

Yes I have done both hyper V and ESXI on the mini. Hyper V is a little difficult to get working but ESXI is a breeze.

Many people would never know this but a lot of web hosting companies use mini's because they have a small foot print and heat load and they are very reliable and allow them to scale easily when needed.

They can run bare metal hypervisors as you have seen and they can run apache well. Most ship with Apache.

This is a slight of hand secret in the smaller webhosting biz. Here are some links you may find intresting.

https://www.macminiworld.net/

http://www.macstadium.com/?gclid=CKK008CWjLgCFQbJtAodun8Acw

http://www.colocationamerica.com/colocation/mac-mini-colo.htm

http://www.macminivault.com/

http://www.littleoak.net/

http://www.macconnect.com/

http://claritywebhosting.com/macpromo
 
I mostly use Virtual Box running XP hosted in hackintosh at home for my photography hobby. I run windows programs in there, I thought of dual booting but this way is much faster and I love snapshots.
 

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