GE Fanuc 90-30 and WinCC Flexible

grnick50

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Nov 2010
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My client is in a dire situation where his ESA VT440L HMI (2.jpg) connected to a 90-30 Fanuc PLC (1.jpg) has failed, and has no control of the machine.
I have both the HMI software and the PLC software. I imported the Logicmaster files to Proficy ME 8 sucessfully (3.jpg).
The CPU is CPU301 and it is marked on the top-right (not seen in 1.jpg).
To get the machine working in no time, I am thinking of building a WinCC flexible project reconstructing the ESA HMI structure. WinCC has a GE Fanuc driver, but I have some questions, as I have not used 90-30 before.

My questions are:
1. What is the protocol used by the Fanuc CPU?
2. What cable is required to connect the PLC to my PC which has RS232 and RS485 or RS422 ports? From the WinCC manual (4-5.jpg) I can see it talks about RS422 and MP8 cable (although my application is not multidrop).
3. What are the correct WinCC flex connection settings (6.jpg) and especially what is the bus address parameter?

1.jpg 2.jpg 3.jpg 4-5.jpg 6.jpg
 
The name of the GE Fanuc protocol is SNP. It could also be SNPX. SNPX is just a stripped-down version of SNP. If WINCC gives you a choice, select SNPX.
One caution though. Very early models of the CPU won't support SNPX. If Proficy Machine Edition does not throw a warning about an incompatible firmware level, then the CPU will support SNPX. If Proficy thinks that the CPU is too old, it could still be OK. SNPX was introduced sometime around firmware version 4.
The fifteen pin port on the PLC power supply is RS485. The pin designations shown in 4-5.jpg are accurate.
 
Dear Steve you mention that the port is RS485 and I also saw that in a couple of GE manuals. However in Siemens documentation it talks about RS422. I am a bit confused on what RS I have to use.

Regards
 
Dear Steve you mention that the port is RS485 and I also saw that in a couple of GE manuals. However in Siemens documentation it talks about RS422. I am a bit confused on what RS I have to use.

Regards
Either will work.
 
Ok back from site and time to re-assess.

Before doing anything I wanted to perform an upload from the 331 CPU just in case anything goes wrong. I have cable IC690ACC901 and Proficy ME 8.0. I managed to go online with the CPU (331-1.jpg) in no time. I then tried to upload the PLC. Connection was lost and It gave an error (2.jpg) sending the CPU into stop. Also the OK LED on the power supply went off. I cycled the power and the PLC came back online. I reconnected and then I saw that the diagnosis table recorded a software error. I tried uploading the Hardware config only and it worked. I then tried uploading the values and it worked. When I tried uploading the code the PLC crashed. No matter what I tried I did not manage to get an upload of the PLC. I have the code from the OEM but as it has been quite a few years he thinks it is best to do an Upload first.

I then prepared a miniPC shuttle DS437 with wincc flexible. The PC has RS232, RS485 & RS422 ports. I managed to connect with Proficy using RS232 COM2 port.
I then tried to make WinCC flex talk with the PLC but It didnt happen.
In WinCC flex I matched the settings of the uploaded HW configuration from the PLC. I selected RS422 and I used blank for the BUS ADDRESS setting (I guess this is where the SNP ID goes)(3 & 4.jpg).
Note that for the cable I used the one that is suggested by Siemens manual (4-5.jpg) of the original post. I only adjusted the pins on the PC side to match the RS422 Pinout (see attached). I didnt manage to make it work.

I then tried to use the IC690ACC901 cable to connect to WinCC using the same settings but changing com port and changing from RS422 to RS232. It did not work.
So I am quite lost at the moment. It is a bit late that they decided to upgrade but I need to get it going until that happens in the next few weeks.

Can WinCC talk to the PLC using a blank SNP-ID?
Can I only download the HW configuration to the PLC (if I need to change SNP-ID) and how?
Are there any dip-switches inside the CPU for setting the comms?

Also what is the deal with CPU and the battery. It looks to me as a strange setup. The battery is on the PS. What happens If i need to change the CPU or try a spare one?
If I pull the CPU out of the rack will it lose the software?

In all that process I dropped by a nearby machine and I succesfully uploaded the program from a similar setup with the same CPU. I tried to monitor a code block. I was online but I could not see anything happening. I mean I did not see the ladder being animated to show the program state as in Siemens and AB. It was just a grey background and the code on top. Any Ideas?

1.jpg 2.jpg 3.jpg 4.jpg
 

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That is a very old CPU331. It is quite likely that it is incompatible with Proficy Machine Edition. You will probably have to use Logicmaster software to do anything with it. It could also be the reason for your communications problems. WinCC may be using SNPX protocol and that CPU may have been new before SNPX was released.

Also what is the deal with CPU and the battery
There is a capacitor on the CPU module that will maintain RAM memory for a short period of time if you remove the CPU from the rack. Keep the time under a half hour and you should be OK.

I was online but I could not see anything happening
The PLC you successfully uploaded from was probably programmed using Logicmaster software. You won't be able to see the I/O animated until you download using Proficy ME. Once you do, the owner will no longer be able to use Logicmaster software with it.
 
What you describe in post 5 is a symptom of the CPU being early or pre version 3, I have seen this before. As Steve says you will need LogicMSter to work with it, you may even need a pre LM90 version 5 to upload it. You will be better served to take the backup files you have and import into Proficy ME then upgrade the CPU331 to a new CPU350. IMHO that will be your quickest fix, even if it takes some troubleshooting after downloading.
 
The client has a copy of Logicmaster left by the machine manufacturer. Problem is that after all these years it was copied in floppies other than the original. When we try to install it in MS-DOS it says that the floppy is not an original one. If I recall correctly Error +25554 or something. Is there any workaround in that?
 
I do not recall ever being able to Run LogicMaster 90-30 from a floppy.
But the original floppies had a non-standard sector either first or last on the first diskette of a set, IDNR which. That is why a copy will likely not work for installation. I have also run into the inability of some of the newer USB floppies (Or it may be the new OS.) that cannot or will not see this non-standard sector.
Once installed the complete 'Folder' can be copied and put on a different and/or multiple computer(s) to run. (The old security.)
So it will depend on what is on your copied diskettes.

I repeat, updating your CPU331 to CPU350 and importing the existing backup into Proficy will be your most efficient approach with this REALLY OLD system.
 
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An upgrade to a non GE PLC is underway. I was just trying to grt it running for a little while. I did that today using an VT440 from a decommissioned machine.
 
Looks like someone didn't do their homework. That OLD GE Fanuc system can be upgraded to the latest GE-IP system with little effort or cost.
Given the age of it and the little anyone knows about it, I suspect that it has been trouble free for a good long time. No reason the next generation of GE product the RX3i will not be just as reliable. :)
http://www.ge-ip.com/products/pac-programmable-controllers/c547
 
If you mean that I didn't do my homework then your wrong. It is a not very complicated system that can easily convert to any Plc brand. Especially since I have the Ladder logic in proficy.
The system run for a good 20 years with no issues. Now that the client wants to upgrade, they would rather go for their company standard (not GE) since they have stock, support contracts and so on from another vendor.
On top of that you have to consider how well established a vendor is in your area (GE is not) and also what is the level off support.

I guess it is best not to judge if you don't now all the details of a situatuion.
 
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I am sorry, but you took it wrong.
I was referring to the system owners who failed to find the "best" option for them instead of the best that a specific manufacturer had to offer.
 

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