Temperature Monitoring

Tom@Pton

Member
Join Date
Dec 2009
Location
Central Nebraska
Posts
159
I set up a project so that it could be run in complete Manual control if needed, or so I thought. Eight monitored temperatures are displayed via the PLC and HMI, so when the PLC has a Major Fault the temperatures do not display correctly. No temperature display = no operation. Hand or Auto.

1: What is available that would give me a display independently of the PLC/HMI but still give me an input?

2: Why do things wait to fail until you are several hundred miles away?
 
Tom,
1. You could install Red Lion LED displays with an analog out to the PLC. I didn't search for them but I "assume" they exist.
2. More importantly, why is the PLC faulting?
Also, being from the same state, where is this controller located and what type is it if I may ask.

HTH
Bob O.
 
I know they make individual units that would give me ma outputs, I am thinking 8 all in one unit.

Would I just be better off using CLICK or similar?

Temperature monitoring by the CLICK, then output to my ML1400 for process?
 
I've never used a Click so can't comment but I would work on the Major Fault first unless this process is critical and needs to be able to run without a PLC.
 
I've never used a Click so can't comment but I would work on the Major Fault first unless this process is critical and needs to be able to run without a PLC.

Critical enough that it needs to run until someone can get there.

Not sure if it is hardware failure or programming glitch. Either way there will be a spare PLC on hand Monday.

Locatiion is Central part of state just N of I-80.
 
1) If the temperature sensors are RTDs, you'll need

- some device like an indicator or loop controller that retransmits the temperature signal to the second indicator/controller/PLC

- to change out the sensors to dual element RTDs and use one RTD for one device and the other RTD for the other device.

because you can't parallel an RTD.

2) If the temperature sensors are thermocouples, then you can parallel a thermocouple to 2 different analog inputs; one your PLC, the other an indicator or loop controller

AND IF
- there's no ground loop that creates noise or offset
- the thermocouple break detection circuit on one device does not interfere with the reading on the other device.

Ungrounded thermocouples do this better than do grounded thermocouples.

Sometimes thermocouple break detection can be turned off on one device, but it's there as a safety feature to drive the indicated temperature high which will drive the control output low to prevent overheating/fire danger if the T/C fails.

You'll always have some deviation between the temp reading on device A and device B, but an offset/bias adjustment at operating temperature can minimize that.

Precision Digital (PD) has a T/C scanner (multiplexor), PD138, that cycles through up to eight

T/Cs and displays each temperature in turn, but it does no control, just indication.
http://www.predig.com/PD138/ scanner only
http://www.predig.com/PDS178/index.php scanner and indicator in an enclosure

Although the PD138 multiplexes RTD's too, you'd need dual element RTDs, one for the scanner, one for the PLC.
 
Tom,
Going from memory that sounds like there is a math overflow issue. Can you post the program..zipped first..forum rules.
I don't have RSLogix500 on this computer so can't say for sure the exact address but I know some programers place a OTU as the last rung in LAD 2 to unlatch a minor math fault. The OTU address is S:5/0 [The address is from memory]
 
Tom,
Going from memory that sounds like there is a math overflow issue. Can you post the program..zipped first..forum rules.
I don't have RSLogix500 on this computer so can't say for sure the exact address but I know some programers place a OTU as the last rung in LAD 2 to unlatch a minor math fault. The OTU address is S:5/0 [The address is from memory]

I have an OTU S:5/0, but not in LAD 2, its on the last rung of the program or very close to it.
 
I have an OTU S:5/0, but not in LAD 2, its on the last rung of the program or very close to it.

Move it to the last rung of File #2

The overflow trap bit is the least useful piece of information the processor can provide, and should never have been implemented IMHO. None of the other A-B platforms have it, it's useless, worthless, gives you no indication where a "math overflow" occurred, so "Move it to the last rung of File #2", and forget about it.
 
I have an OTU S:5/0, but not in LAD 2, its on the last rung of the program or very close to it.

Actually need to spell it out.. the "last rung of the program" is always the last rung of file 2, which is an "END" rung. Place your rung OTU S:5/0 in front of the END rung, and it will be the last "user" rung executed by the processor in each scan.
 
Actually need to spell it out.. the "last rung of the program" is always the last rung of file 2, which is an "END" rung. Place your rung OTU S:5/0 in front of the END rung, and it will be the last "user" rung executed by the processor in each scan.

Yes, I understand the END rung.

I did not know the significance of file 2. I usually put it at the end of the file that has the most math functions and this time I put it in the last file. Today I linked up a counter to it to see how many times it was latching, just before the UTL.

I'll move it all to file 2.

Thank you,
 
Although it sounds like "math overflow" is the issue...

You can also use a RedLion Sixnet TC or RTD module.
TC
http://www.redlion.net/product/ethertrak-2-io-module-16-isolated-thermocouple-inputs
RTD
http://www.redlion.net/product/ethertrak-2-io-module-10-rtd-inputs

It talks Modbus TCP and has 2 Ethernet ports (which can act as a switch or have independent IP addresses)....so you can have the PLC talk to it and the HMI can also communicate with a Modbus IO server. ALSO comes free with KEPServer driver.
This way you can have redundancy.
 

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