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Old April 11th, 2006, 02:27 PM   #1
Rallywagon
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Hi! Basics of Logix 500 and 5000?

Hey,

Looks like a great group. I have a new processing line with a couple of SLC's and a couple of Control Logix...supplied by vendors.

Can you all suggest any websites or affordable books to help me learn basic use of the Logix 500 and 5000 software? I am familiar with PLC hardware and ladder logic, but until now I have done very little programming or "logic troubleshooting" on the AB's. (I worked with Foxboro ladder logic.)

I am currently working with the SCP instructions trying to coordinate equipment speeds, and I am having trouble knowing what I can change online and what requires program mode...etc.

Any suggestions would be great. Thanks in advance.
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Old April 11th, 2006, 02:30 PM   #2
Tom Jenkins
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You can do online editing with either package. Load the progam, connect to the PLC, and make your changes. You have to test, accept, and download the revised code, and it will take immediate effect.
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Old April 11th, 2006, 02:34 PM   #3
Ron Beaufort
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Quote:
I am currently working with the SCP instructions trying to coordinate equipment speeds, and I am having trouble knowing what I can change online and what requires program mode...etc.
in order to answer your question correctly, we need to know more than just the software ... some AB processors which use the SCP allow "online" edits ... others do not ...

do you have an SLC-5/03 (or up)? ... or MicroLogix? ... etc. ? ...

one more thing ... is it safe to "play" with this machinery while it's running? ... if so, we can offer some experiments that will probably help you learn the ropes ...

and welcome to the forum ...
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Old April 11th, 2006, 02:36 PM   #4
TConnolly
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Before doing any online editing with AB plcs, please do a search and review Ron Beaufort's advice on the subject.

edit: Is see Ron's already here, already beat me to it. I must learn to type faster.

I suggest you also look at this thread as it has got lots of good stuff from Ron on the subject.

Last edited by TConnolly; April 11th, 2006 at 02:43 PM.
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Old April 11th, 2006, 03:23 PM   #5
Ron Beaufort
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and here’s a technique that our new member might be interested in ... this approach comes in very handy when you’ve got to “hunt-and-peck” for the best set of values ...

first let's look at the "problem" ...

notice that this rung uses “hard-coded” numeric values for the parameter settings ... this is the way it’s normally done ... (and most would agree that it’s the best way to leave things once the “experimental stages” have finally been completed) ...








now this next rung is a lot easier to work with if you’re in the middle of a “hunting-and-pecking” session ...







by using the variables, you can just click on the values shown by the little “indicator” arrows and type in a new number to try out ... this technique can save a LOT of time - especially if you’re working with a platform (ex: MicroLogix 1500, etc.) that forces you to go offline - make edit changes - and then download the altered program back to the processor ...

and thanks, Alaric, for the kind compliments ...

PS edit ...

and to answer Rallywagon’s specific request, here are the best two little books to get started with ... these usually ship with the software, but if you don’t have a copy handy, you can click the links for a download version ...



Getting Results with RSLogix500



Getting Results with RSLogix5000
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Last edited by Ron Beaufort; April 11th, 2006 at 03:51 PM.
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Old April 11th, 2006, 03:36 PM   #6
10BaseT.
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I could listen to you for hours Ron !

All the things we take for granted because they are second nature now , all those little "tricks"

One thing to be said with much of the older AB range is that it can be picked up for next to nothing on ebay - whilst it may be overkill for some , I also purchased a S7 317 DP/PN and a little single phase drive , add a bit of I/O and there is very little we can't simulate for real if that makes sense ?
I have a little ML1500 with some I/O and RS view , so I am fortunate that I can do the same thing with AB.
I wish I had the ability to teach properly , it is all very well knowing what you are doing , but particularly in my line of work , the clever bit is to conduct the training course .
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Old April 12th, 2006, 07:13 AM   #7
Rallywagon
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Thumbs up Thanks - I have a 5/03...

Ron,

You hit exactly on my issue...some of the "scaling factors" are constants and some are memory locations. I discovered exactly what you said...I have to go offline to implement my edits of the constants. This is not a danger, just a big hassle when tuning values.

So, thanks for confirming what I think I was learning. And thanks for the book recommendations...I need a basic overview.

This group is great! Thanks to all of the repliers.

Scott
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Old April 12th, 2006, 10:10 AM   #8
Ron Beaufort
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Greetings Rallywagon,



I’m glad that we were able to help ...



but going further, you said:



Quote:
I have to go offline to implement my edits of the constants.




no, not exactly ... with an SLC-5/03 (or higher) you can actually make this type of change “online” ... specifically, you do NOT have to: (1) go “offline” - (2) make the changes - (3) stop the system - (4) download the altered program - (5) restart the system ...



the type of changes that you’re describing can actually be done without stopping the system at all ... this can be incredibly important if you’re trying to keep the bo$$ happy ... important note: other types of “bigger” changes (example: adding ladder files, increasing data file size, etc.) will, however, require that you still jump through the “offline-modify-stop-download-restart” hoops ...



first things first ... the SLC-5/03 that you have DOES indeed allow “online” edits ... now the next question is this: does your version of RSLogix500 software allow “online” edits too? ... that’s right ... there are different flavors of RSLogix500 ... if you paid about US$500 for your copy, then you probably have the “starter” version which will NOT do “online” edits ... this software version is a good fit for MicroLogix systems because these processors generally don’t offer “online” edits either ... on the other hand, if you paid about US$1,100 for your RSLogix500, then you’ve probably got the standard version ... this one WILL allow “online” edits (at least for SLC-5/03 - and up - systems) ... so if you didn’t spend enough money, then what I’m about to say won’t work for you ...



and now let’s just make sure that we have our definitions straight ... “online” actually means that your programming computer IS “communicating” with the PLC processor ... conversely ... “offline” means that your programming computer is NOT “communicating” with the PLC processor ... a LOT of people think that “online” means that the processor is “up-and-running-and-controlling-the-system” ... wrong answer ... you can be “offline” (NOT communicating with the processor) and the processor can still be happily and busily “up-and-running-and-controlling-the-system” without you and your programming computer anywhere in the picture ... if you have any questions about this, post them and we’ll nail it down even more ...



next ... let’s say that the keyswitch on the front of your SLC-5/03 (or higher) processor is in the “REM” (Remote) position ... hint: if you leave the key all the way over in the “RUN” position, then you can’t make the types of edits that I’m going to cover next ... and let’s say that your processor is in the “Remote Run” mode ... and so ... the system is up and running ... the boss is happy ... the sun is shining ... the birds are singing ... life is lovely ...



and now you’ve decided that you want to make a change to one of the “constant” values in your SCP ... for an example, suppose that you want to change the “Scaled Minimum” entry from “32” to a new value of “0” ... I’m just going to quickly run through the steps ... post again if you have questions after you play around with these ideas ... note: there are “mouse click” icons to do these steps ... but in this post I’m going to use the “right-click-menu” approach because it’s easier to explain using straight text ...



(1) right-click the “rung number” in the left margin of the SCP rung ...

(2) from the menu, select “Start Rung Edits” ...

(3) on the “e” rung which pops up on your screen, make the change from “32” to “0” for the Scaled Minimum value ...

(4) right-click the “rung number” of the SCP rung ...

(5) from the menu, select “Accept Rung Edits” ... secret handshake: this step SENDS the new “modified” rung over to the processor ...

(6) right-click the “rung number” of the SCP rung ...

(7) from the menu, select “Test Edits” ... secret handshake: this step tells the processor to start scanning/executing/using the new “modified” rung - and to ignore the old rung which still exists in the processor, and which is also still shown on your screen ...

(8) when the pop-up message asks “are you sure?”, take a deep breath and THINK! ... if you’re sure that you really and truly DO want the processor to start controlling according to your new instructions (for-better-or-for-worse-for-richer-or-for-poorer-etc.” then grit your teeth, and cross your fingers, and click the “Yes” button ...

(9) now suppose that everything works fine and you like what you see ... right-click the “rung number” of the SCP rung ...

(10) from the menu, select “Assemble Edits” ... then THINK! and say “Yes” to the “are-you-sure?” popup message ... secret handshake: this step nails down your edits/modifications/changes by removing the old rung and cleaning up those confusing “I” and “R” indicators on your screen ...

(11) now tell your bo$$ that he’s really lucky (I prefer to say “blessed”) to have a highly-skilled individual of your caliber on his payroll ... specifically, someone who can make necessary changes to the PLC program without having to shut down the plant to do those “offline” edit/download steps ...



now I know that this sounds like a lot of steps ... but once you get good at it, it only takes a few seconds to whip through the whole procedure ... in fact it can become so repetitious that some programmers forget to THINK! before they just shoot from the hip and pull the trigger on this particular gun ... try to fight that ... remember that when you do this type of operation, the processor is ACTUALLY CONTROLLING THE PLANT! ... if you’ve made a mistake somewhere along the line, you could be setting yourself up for a LOT of trouble ...



finally, thank you, 10BaseT. for the kind compliments ... but be careful ... according to a lot of people, “listening to me for hours” can be a pretty “intense” experience ...
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