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Unread November 7th, 2019, 11:54 AM   #1
nehpets
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1756-L61 upgrade

A long story,



I require some clarification and I'm hoping the Allen Bradley experts on this site can help.


A while ago I asked about upgrading my 1756-L61 processor V16.22 to a 1756-L73, due to filling up the memory - but owing to possible compatability issues with the running system, I decided to go for a 1756-L63 (i know they are obsolete).


When the new (brand new) 1756-L63 arrived I had asked for it to be flashed with V16, it came with V16.24 (I can't find V16.22 anywhere on Rockwells website).


The program was loaded and run up in production, no problem, however, after around 3 days the processor faulted with the red LED on solid and I was unable to access it to find out why.


It was sent back to the supplier who some how got it running again on their test rig, so they sent it back, I then placed it in my test rig, loaded the program and run it up, again no problem, until around 5 days later where its done the same thing, solid red LED and totally bricked.


They are now saying that it the program doing this, because when the program is loaded into the L63 a dialog message appears, and says do you want to convert the program from L61 to L63 and that there may be some instruction issues between the two. (this just seems to be a general message because of a processor change)



What do you think? is this possible or are they having a laugh?


Steve
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Unread November 7th, 2019, 12:14 PM   #2
collinsd70
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Would it not be possible for you to lookup the major/ minor faults in the controller during run time?

This could at least give you some idea of the function or program area that maybe generating a controller fault.

If you are "what you are looking at", feel free to post pictures of the controller tabs whilst online.



Regards

Daniel.
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Unread November 7th, 2019, 12:32 PM   #3
Ken Roach
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There were a handful of performance differences between the L63 and the L61/L62, but those would not cause a hard fault (steady red LED).

My guess is that this controller is not new, but rather should have been remanufactured or replaced several years ago.


Since the 1756-L1 in 1998, ControlLogix CPUs come out of the box with v1.x boot firmware only and need to have runtime firmware in them. If your 1756-L63 arrived with v16.x firmware in it, then it is aftermarket or gray market. If someone delivered it in a box with factory sealing tape, then that tape is counterfeit.


For several months in 2006 and 2007, there were a substantial number of CPUs and network modules manufactured with backplane chips with a high defect rate; something like 1 % of the modules built with that batch would fail in just a few hours or days of service. This is referred to at Rockwell as the "Atmel 64 issue".

Most of these modules were located, returned to Rockwell, and remanufactured or destroyed. But some of them are surely still out there on shelves as spare parts, or in the gray market.


There were actually a couple of related issues like this during that era; I assure you it was almost as much fun for us in Rockwell field offices as it was for our customers.

The RA Knowledgebase document for those product service advisories are Document 40149.

Even if your controller doesn't turn out to be from that era, a solid red OK LED is not a user program bug; the module definitely needs to be replaced.
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Unread November 7th, 2019, 12:43 PM   #4
Ken Roach
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A general note: the "OK" LED on a 1756 ControlLogix indicates the general state of the operating system.

It's normally steady green, and flashes red when there is a recoverable major fault. These might include user program faults, like indexing off the end of an array.

But a steady red LED means the operating system has halted, usually because of a serious hardware watchdog or diagnostic failure. The controller can't communicate with anything when its OS is halted.
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Unread November 7th, 2019, 03:28 PM   #5
nehpets
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Thanks Ken, the solid red LED being a hardware fault was my thinking too,
the L63 was purchased from a reputable company and was new stock, I asked them to flash to V16 (save me a job).
The document 40149 is very interesting though, i'll have to check the processor


Again many thanks


Steve
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Unread November 8th, 2019, 02:10 AM   #6
nehpets
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I checked the processor its manufacture date is 2009 and doesn't have the cipset as mentioned in the PSA document, so thats out.


However, I tried the processor again this morning and this time it fired up, the 'ok' LED turned from solid red to flashing green. The processor was completely clean, no program, no status major or minor faults, it's like it's straight out of the box.


Any thoughts as to possible cause?


Thanks
Steve
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Unread November 8th, 2019, 04:57 PM   #7
Ken Roach
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A controller with an intermittent hardware defect can recover, and it would be in the condition you describe: the user program would be cleared and the controller would be in PROG mode waiting for a download.

Even if the controller is outside that 2007 chipset problem era, it's evidently got an intermittent hardware problem.

If it were mine, I would blow it out with clean air and inspect it carefully for contaminants or loose bits of conductive material or wire strands, and run it in the test bench for a few days.

If you can't do that or the application is critical, insist on a replacement.
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Unread November 9th, 2019, 05:24 AM   #8
nehpets
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"the user program would be cleared and the controller would be in PROG mode waiting for a download."


This is exactly what's happening, so on that basis I have asked for a replacement.


They have tried to say it's the program causing it (a program that has been running in a L61 for 7 years without issue) which I dispute.

I have programmed a simple counter and downloaded into a test rig and left it running, i'll just have to wait and see now.




Thanks for interest,
Steve
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Last edited by nehpets; November 9th, 2019 at 05:35 AM.
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