rockwell support

i was very dissapointed today with rockwell the story goes;

thru one of our factories in the uk going bump we inherited a gas flushing machine who's heart is an slc150 coupled up with a tcat. we are a relatively small company with a total of 27 plcs altogether. Over the the weekend the 150 processor faulted and now the machine is dead as a dodo. when i spoke to our rockwell specialist he couldnt help me and put me onto his speicialist who then put me onto rockwell themselves. Their answer was basically "you should have thought about this scenario when YOU did the original code (ME) i can sell you the software ect but it is very expensive because we dont want anybody to have it (that is a quote) the best thing for you to do is change to a micrologix1500/slc500 and recode.
i have no eprom no idea how the machiine works ect and their telling me i should of thought about this problem years ago

i thought they may have been a bit more helpfull and here's me pushing my bosses togo with ab/rockwell even they are more expensive than most of the competition

whats your thoughts ? has anybody else had this scenario ?

If you are lucky, maybe the manual for the machine has a floppy inside it with the ladder for the machine (fairly common here in the oilfield). How do you do maintenance? Do you not have a laptop with the logic already in it? Can the fault be cleared? I would do my best to contact the people who built the machine for a backup copy of the logic. Good luck! I'm pretty sure Rockwell isn't helping much because they probably consider the SLC 150 long dead. Try getting help for Windows 3.1 from Bill Gates! Believe me, the smartest (read most evil) companies create the fastest obsolescence cycle they can without discouraging customers from investing in the equipment altogether.

Well maybe they could have been more helpful BUT they are a business and I doubt your company has maintained any support contracts for the device in question.

Technically they are correct. Your company should have realized that eventually parts fail, even plc's and at some point since it is no longer sold/supported (especially without a support contract) that preparation should be made to convert it.

Here's the deal, I am not saying YOU or anyone should have bought anything prior to this BUT you could have had the program and documentation ready to make a conversion to a newer AB or another brand. This is someone's job at even small plants.

I know the feeling though, I have ranted at AB quite a few times but in the end it wasnt their fault in most cases. More like very few cases. It just seems it is because these things happen at the worse possible time and we are the person that everyone is looking at.

As for obtaining software to work with the SLC 150 this link may give you some info:
http://www.ab.com/silver/slc100slc150.html

Another alternative is to find a system integrator that has SLC150 software and can extract the code plus assist you with doing the conversion.

The SLC150 is basically an obserlete product, that's why you are getting so much headach trying to get support on the unit. The Rockwell support guy should have given you some other alternatives rather than just ask you to upgrade the PLC or buy an obserlete software (That is over 10 years old and only runs on DOS...)
I would suggest that you try to contact any integrators around your area, that have worked on the SLC150 and see if they can assist you to get the unit up. And I know that there should be an area manager (From Rockwell) that looks after your region, he can also help you with your problem.

banghead

Did you expect him to conduct a seance ?

More helpful things the Rockwell rep could have said:

"Is the DC Power LED still on? Maybe the internal power supply fuse is just blown."

"We can send a man over with an SLC-150 Pocket Programmer to read the fault code and find out if the processor has actually lost it's program. Our service rate is XXX GBP/hour."

"I know a local service shop that can send a man over with the SLC-150 programming software to find out if the processor still has a program stored. The software is very obsolete and therefore quite expensive; it's better to hire somebody who already owns it. His service rate is YYY GBP/hour".

"Let's get a man over to upload programs out of any other controllers for which you do not have backups, and I'll help you select a modern controller to convert the program to in the future when those controllers finally fail."

"When precisely did you inherit this machine ? I'm just asking because it's sometimes comforting to know the exact date you should regret not thinking ahead from. Helps give you a sense of perspective, see."

hold on

People that know me, and have read my letters to the editors in the
US trade press know that I'm not exactly AB/R's biggest supporter
when it comes to support (haha), but, tell me again...

How is any of this Rockwell's fault?

And, as a follow up:

What does the expense of the PLC have to do with fixing this problem?

And, finally:

If I missed something in the story, help me out.

BTW, Eddie, you seem to knock AB for charging for coming out to
read the error code...do you work for free????

I'll see your link...

and raise you one.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1922741481

Sadly, eBay's become a way of life for these old dogs.

1745-PT1

That's a hand-held programming tool for the SLC 100's and 150's. Try to get your hands on one of those--it may be cheaper than software--maybe not. But you could view the code for conversion, at least--no tags--no descriptions--just addresses.

Good Luck!

Program Lost??

In the past with a A/B slc150 I have had fault or two come up. I have cleared this by one recyling the power and having the switch set to read (that is the switch located on the front of the unit). Switch is moved the the right hand side and then recylce power. If there is nothing more then a software fault it should clear ( assuming there is an eprom chip in it) If not, get someone ( as others have stated) to bring over a hand held programer and clear off the fault, there are a lot of these hand helds out there and I am sure that is your best bet.
Good Luck
GE

SLC 100/150 Manual

Here's the link to the manual almost 17 MEG'S long.

http://files.awdm.com/e-files/ra/1745/1745-um001a-en-p.pdf

... and tonight a Rockwell salesman fielded fourteen phone calls over a six hour period from 10 PM to 4 AM until a technician in a frozen-potato factory 500 miles away could find a defective (third-party) power supply in an SLC-500 system that was emitting noise onto a DH-485 network.

The good news was that this customer had already done extensive troubleshooting and had all of his backup programs and spare parts close at hand. Without those spares and backups, the machine would not be ready to re-start Wednesday morning for the first production shift.

Your Mileage May Vary.

Well, pardners, y'all know I ain't the biggest fan of Allen Bradley support, and this particular service rep could of been a little kinder in his response. These fellers all sure ain't as good or as helpful as Ken! Howesomever, I don' think this is A-B's problem. Yeah, they could offer better advice, and customer service isn't the A-B watchword, but they ain't really obligated to solve all the problems all the time, particularly on old equipment and customer applicashuns. They really couldn't solve this problem, cuz they ain't got the tools and equipment. The real culprits, if they is any, is the guy what sold the machine and the local distributor who could have offered, fer a fee, to do some on site assistance.

I still have the software/interface and it's still gathering dust on the shelf. I have a couple of old 150's still in use. They have been in their current location for over 9 or 10 years now. I have documentation on both, but I've decided I'm going to see just how long the little guys will hold out. Yea, AB can cause you to speak in tongues, but most of the equipment I've used from them works.
I trained on SLC100's in college, around 12 years ago....I guess I'm gathering a little dust also.

thanks guys

thanks for all your replys guys.

as i dont know the complete history of the machine in question and the nature the factory ceased trading, i can not answer any questions about support and backups ect.
i'm not suggesting this is in anyway A/Bs problem, more a undersight of the then engineering staff/management. you know the rest.

just a bit annoying when the production manager sayes something like "what that little box is broken, cant you stick another in there" but thats another story you probaly all know about.

to be honest im looking forward to revamping the machine nice little project over the next few weeks

cheers kev