Off Topic: Rant about degree programs

Greeting!

After doing some research through Google, this forum and others, I am ready to announce this observation. A bachelor's degree in EET isn't really that much different that an EE degree. I have searched and searched and really tried to make a distinction between the two and when it comes right down to it, electrons are still electrons.

After reading such opposition to the EET, I started looking at programs. The programs at Devry, Purdue and Milwaukee University of Engineering all show the appearance of educating a student in the field. They appear just as in depth as an EE degree.

I know, I know, the old complaint is: EET degrees are not calculus based. I find that to be disingenuous. All of the above programs cover the major topics in calculus. The Devry program in EET gives the student the opportunity to take classes that are equivalent to Calc 3 and Diff. Eq. if they wish. Although the timing of the material maybe different. The EET degree puts you in the action from the very beginning of the curriculum. (By the way the Devry program is ABET accredited.)

I can see how an EE degree gives you a theoretical approach to the field, but how many here on a daily basis are really forging new territory in the field. I mean some new theoretical energy supplying device, etc. A look on youtube and Itunes brought forth a series from MIT on Circuits and Electronics. In that series, I forget which lecture, I can find it if you wish. The professor said out right he would rather a student solve problems with their intuition rather than perform calculations based around a differential equation. By that, I mean analyze and build circuits based on gut feels instead of the tortuous math. This is MIT mind you. What am I suppose to feel? I think most of the EET program is built around intuition.

Furthermore, I had a professor here at my local small university say that Ohm's Law doesn't change from one school to another. He was a graduate of MIT also. The laws of Physics are the same whether you are at Cal Poly Tech or the University of B.F.E.

When I was a much younger man, I attended martial arts classes. I learned many different styles. I moved from one teacher to the next learning all I could. One constant thing shined through every time I tried a new style. They all said, "they had the best system." I got caught up in that train of thought. After years, I finally came to this conclusion. Its not the system that gives you the tools to defend yourself. For they all had plus' and minus', but it was how well you learned and applied yourself. Learning how to give a swift kick in the groin will put any man down, no matter what the system.

I guess, what I am trying to say is; don't judge a book by its cover. I feel that EET graduate and a EE graduate will be able to do the same job. Correct me if I am wrong.

Regards

plc_user1973 said:

I feel that EET graduate and a EE graduate will be able to do the same job. Correct me if I am wrong.

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Possibly.

I would say that it depends on the job (and on the graduate). I have always seen an EET degree as more of a hybrid of an EE degree and a tech school certification. It has been my impression that a graduate with an EET degree will have more hands-on experience than someone with an EE degree, but that will come at the expense of the in-depth theoretical material.

All things being equal, an EET degree would probably be more practically useful for an engineer working in my industry (manufacturing). I can't speak for other industries, but I suspect that there are a number of places where a concentration on the theoretical aspects is more important (i.e. circuit board layout/simulation/design, microprocessor design, etc.).

In the real world though, things are not equal. There can always be the perception that the EET grad was not smart/determined enough to make it through the tough EE classes. That view of the EET grad may hinder his ability to advance his career. It may make a difference in promotions within a large company. It can definitely impact the canditate's ability to get into a graduate school program for law or business administration.

There is a lot to consider (short term and long term) when deciding which program to chose. I decided that an Electrical Engineering degree was the best for me. I have known and worked with a few EETs who were great engineers as well.

Yes there are jobs that both EETs and EEs could both do well. There are jobs that both EETs and Electricians could do well. There are jobs that both EEs and mitre saws could do well. I've met many individuals with far less education than I (EE) that can probably do my job better than me.

A professor of mine told our class that he didn't think the subject matter itself was important - what was important was that we prove that we could learn it and apply it if we were ever required to. If we could do that, then he promised that the school would stamp a piece of paper with our name on it, and that we would get to keep the piece of paper.

The most important difference between the EET and EE is the perception that they are different - whether or not they actually are.

Sinc_green said:

The most important difference between the EET and EE is the perception that they are different - whether or not they actually are.

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I think this really sums it up. After that, once you have landed the position, it's the individual.

Is there a valuable and objectively quantifiable difference between an EE degree and an EET degree?

Heck if I know.

Steve (EE).

A professor of mine told our class that he didn't think the subject matter itself was important - what was important was that we prove that we could learn it and apply it if we were ever required to.

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I think that about sums up my Electrical Engineering experience. EE training is to prove that you can learn certain theroems, mathtmaticsal techniques, and solve problems. Once we get out of EE school, most of us use about 10% of what we were taught, and probably could have learned that in a 6-months on-the-job apprenticeship training program. School is another way to prove yourself in the real world of hard knocks.

You can switch the the term EET/ET with MD/PA/NP too.

We had similiar rant on college vs high school too. The point is the more difficult degree (in getting it) gives you more OPTIONS. Grad school, medical school, dental school, MBA, etc... Since most of us doesn't do what we studied in college anyway. This is a vastly important point to drill into the head of kids who are now making that choice.

plc_user1973 said:

Greeting!

After doing some research through Google, this forum and others, I am ready to announce this observation. A bachelor's degree in EET isn't really that much different that an EE degree.

....

I guess, what I am trying to say is; don't judge a book by its cover. I feel that EET graduate and a EE graduate will be able to do the same job.

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OK, but it isn't about what you feel, it's about what the hiring manager feels. In most cases, an EE has more options for employment than an EET. Is it right - don't know.

There are lots of people (on this site and not) that can program a PLC that will make most EEs heads spin. There are plenty of guys (without degrees) that can troubleshoot and fix a complicated control circuit. My point is that there are plenty of smart people out there who didn't get a BS degree. There are also plenty of guys with EE degrees that don't understand how to design an electrical system - because it wasn't taught in schools.

OK now to my point - IF you want to get a degree and If you have the opportunity, I would suggest getting a BSEE degree from an accredited university. It will open more doors that a EET from Devry.

College is too expensive for what you get.

brucechase said:

There are lots of people (on this site and not) that can program a PLC that will make most EEs heads spin.

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You are looking at it all wrong.
A framer can pound nails much faster than the architect but you don't want the framer designing your house.
A hammer or PLC is a tool. Tools become obsolete. Now one can get nail guns. That levels the playing field a lot.

OK now to my point - IF you want to get a degree and If you have the opportunity, I would suggest getting a BSEE degree from an accredited university. It will open more doors that a EET from Devry.

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The difference is that in high school or a community college you may big the big fish. In a university you will find there are other fish just as big or bigger.

College is simply too expensive. I wonder where all the tuition money goes.
Knowing what I know now I would have a much different approach.
1. I am the customer.
2. I am the customer.
3. I am the customer.
get it.
For all the money you pay you should get something more than regurgitated info that can be found in books or on the internet.

When I went to OSU the freshmen engineers took physics, calculus and chemistry and the purpose was to weed out the small fish. Classes were MUCH smaller when we go to the sophomore year. Then the instructors finally make an effort to learn your name.

Competition lets you know where you stand.

You know what, now that I thought more about it... looking back with my many years of <cough> wisdom, there are a lot more reasons on why I would recommend a good university over a tech school.

btw. this is a complete change of mind for me since I was in high school; I recall having a conversation with another guy who worked in this fast food place with me.. he was ranting about how if he didn't have to pass all those useless humanity courses he would have a college degree instead of working at..

1. It takes much more than technical skill to suceed in life. Life is more than just your career. Believe it or not, taking Art History and American Popular Music from a cool professor is a treat of a lifetime.
2. Very few people know exactly what they going to do at 20 years old, I still question my career decision. Part of a well rounded college education is to let you explore your interest.
3. Even if automation is all you want to do, there's a lot more to it than just programming a tool (PLC). Process control, advanced process control, fuzzy logic, etc... require more advanced math than those taught in Technology program.
4. and I already mentioned options. A well rounded education give you options and views of the big picture. I am already on my 4th job doing automation "related" job that doesn't necessary involve PLC at all. I can say for certain that I can't do this without a BS degree (nope, I'm not EE).