Micrologix 850 programming experiences

williamlove

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Jul 2007
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My company is considering using the Rockwell Micro 850 for our machine's controller. Can you give me a candid assessment of this controller? (Especially from the programming and program troubleshooting perspective.) I am an old hand with Logix 5, 500 and 5000 experience but not the Connected Components Workbench software used for this. I have concerns about this (possible) decision but I am trying to keep an open mind.
 
Keep in mind, it is NOT a MicroLogix 850. It is a Micro850. I haven't used it yet, but don't confuse the MicroLogix family with the Micro family. Different beasts.

OG
 
I haven't used one yet, but we have considered them. You can download the free software, install it and take a look. I wouldn't expect the hardware to be anything other than as advertised.
 
The Micro800 series is not an Allen-Bradley product. It is a product that Allen-Bradley bought from another company and slapped their logo on. But CCW is nothing like Logix 500. The instructions are different, the memory addressing is different, everything is different. It's more different than the difference between the SLC and Logix platforms. It's as different from a SLC or Logix processor as a Fanuc or Mitsubishi controller is different. It's basically a "forget everything you know about AB Programming" scenario. It doesn't look the same, feel the same, or function the same.

CCW, like with most things, is free for a reason. Personally, I am not fond of the software. The user interface doesn't make sense, and it's constantly getting major updates (it's gone up five major revisions in the last couple years), which personally I think is a hallmark of a poorly-executed software release. Good news is that it's FINALLY getting to the point where it's decent, but it's not something I'd dive into personally.

The other issue is the longevity of the platform. Call me a cynic, but I quite honestly don't see the Micro800 platform being around in 10 years. The whole thing reeks of Allen-Bradley experimenting and trying to spread into too many markets. They're trying to compete in the "guy-in-a-garage-control-panel-builder" market, the "OEM-non-mission-critical" market they've historically occupied, and the "building automation/mission-critical" PAC market against Honeywell/GE/Modicon/etc. all at the same time. I personally just don't see the long-term support for these controllers being there when you're going to need it.

When I'm doing a job that calls for a PLC, the absolute lowest I will go is a Micrologix 1100. Personally, I wouldn't standardize on anything less.
 
The Micro800 series is not an Allen-Bradley product. It is a product that Allen-Bradley bought from another company and slapped their logo on. But CCW is nothing like Logix 500. The instructions are different, the memory addressing is different, everything is different. It's more different than the difference between the SLC and Logix platforms. It's as different from a SLC or Logix processor as a Fanuc or Mitsubishi controller is different. It's basically a "forget everything you know about AB Programming" scenario. It doesn't look the same, feel the same, or function the same.

CCW, like with most things, is free for a reason. Personally, I am not fond of the software. The user interface doesn't make sense, and it's constantly getting major updates (it's gone up five major revisions in the last couple years), which personally I think is a hallmark of a poorly-executed software release. Good news is that it's FINALLY getting to the point where it's decent, but it's not something I'd dive into personally.

The other issue is the longevity of the platform. Call me a cynic, but I quite honestly don't see the Micro800 platform being around in 10 years. The whole thing reeks of Allen-Bradley experimenting and trying to spread into too many markets. They're trying to compete in the "guy-in-a-garage-control-panel-builder" market, the "OEM-non-mission-critical" market they've historically occupied, and the "building automation/mission-critical" PAC market against Honeywell/GE/Modicon/etc. all at the same time. I personally just don't see the long-term support for these controllers being there when you're going to need it.

When I'm doing a job that calls for a PLC, the absolute lowest I will go is a Micrologix 1100. Personally, I wouldn't standardize on anything less.

Who is the real producer of that hardware? It looks a lot like the panasonic FX line to me.
 
The Micro800 series is not an Allen-Bradley product. It is a product that Allen-Bradley bought from another company and slapped their logo on. But CCW is nothing like Logix 500. The instructions are different, the memory addressing is different, everything is different. It's more different than the difference between the SLC and Logix platforms. It's as different from a SLC or Logix processor as a Fanuc or Mitsubishi controller is different. It's basically a "forget everything you know about AB Programming" scenario. It doesn't look the same, feel the same, or function the same.

CCW, like with most things, is free for a reason. Personally, I am not fond of the software. The user interface doesn't make sense, and it's constantly getting major updates (it's gone up five major revisions in the last couple years), which personally I think is a hallmark of a poorly-executed software release. Good news is that it's FINALLY getting to the point where it's decent, but it's not something I'd dive into personally.

The other issue is the longevity of the platform. Call me a cynic, but I quite honestly don't see the Micro800 platform being around in 10 years. The whole thing reeks of Allen-Bradley experimenting and trying to spread into too many markets. They're trying to compete in the "guy-in-a-garage-control-panel-builder" market, the "OEM-non-mission-critical" market they've historically occupied, and the "building automation/mission-critical" PAC market against Honeywell/GE/Modicon/etc. all at the same time. I personally just don't see the long-term support for these controllers being there when you're going to need it.

When I'm doing a job that calls for a PLC, the absolute lowest I will go is a Micrologix 1100. Personally, I wouldn't standardize on anything less.
Thanks for the review. We've been debating on getting one to play with.
 
I have produced eight machines using the Micro 830 controller, the 48-point version.

If the controller were just brand-labeled, the first couple of firmware and software revisions wouldn't have been so troublesome ! It's a native A-B product, but built by the RA Singapore division that is also in charge of FLEX and POINT and the other distributed I/O products.

Because the software has become quicker and more intuitive, and I've become more familiar with the product, my negative opinion has softened a little.

If you go in not expecting it to be like the A-B platforms you are used to, you won't spend as much time comparing it unfavorably to RSLogix and the other A-B controllers. Once you understand that it runs PLCOpen function blocks and take some time to read about the Tag databases, the execution model, and the data types, it won't seem so strange.

We had a lot of heartache about the speed of the software; we would jab at the keys repeatedly because it was taking 20 or 30 seconds to do what would have been a blink in another software packages. Despite having a native USB connection between the controller and the software, online monitoring was always lagging behind what we were trying to see in the editor.

The Visual Studio-based environment is clumsy and very bloated; the download is in the 1.5 GB range !

It was nice to be able to buy them from my A-B distributor, and I've had no trouble with their reliability or availability.

I will reconsider them for very simple systems or systems where I needed to reduce cost a lot, and for which the customer preferred Allen-Bradley. Any machine that is for R&D or has less than ten planned units, I would not use the Micro 800.
 
I am just getting into the Micro family. AB is pushing these things hard on me. I use a lot of 1100 & CompactLogix. I like the challenge of learning a new platform.
I agree with Ken about them being AB built units. AB is spending a lot of time and money on these units for them to not be around. I needed some drawings of the plug in modules so I called AB. The guy was super cool and seemed to have some knowledge on the product line. They have a lot of specialty cards coming out before to long. DNET , encoder, possibly CNET.

My 2 cents is AB is targeting Automation Direct with the price point.
I do plan on keeping an 810 on the service truck with an LCD keypad as a timing relay replacer. Quick and dirty to drop in and run.

The 850 talking to Ethernet drives is something I still don't like until they come out with implicit I/O. Currently it looks like it is only explicit I/O. I just don't like controlling dives where they could run away with loss of comms.
 
MICRO850 and Ethernet

My Apologies if this is in the wrong place.

We have been asked to integrate the Ethernet port of the Micro850 to a Parker/SSD 6053 Ethernet Module. The Controllogix Platform does this very easily: Add a Generic Ethernet Device add the Instance of 100 and 150 give it 18 words and add a 1 in the Control word. (also add the IP address). Once programmed 18 Words X 2 open up in the Tag Data base and when you enter the numbers they appear inside the drive. Very easy.

Along comes the Micro850 complete with Bloatware as 2 days later we are still scratching our head. You would think that someone has a document that would allow 3rd party devices to be connected easily and not convoluted as this processor requires. What should be easy is not!.

Now don't get me wrong this is the first AB processor with Ethernet I/p under $ 300 (Micro820) and all I am trying to do is send over a couple of integers and read a couple of integers.

The Manufacturer (PARKER/SSD) when called told me they had some issues with the way the Micro850 behaved but could not elaborate.

If there is anyone out there that knows how to connect this http://www.parker.com/literature/SSD Drives Division North America/Manuals/HA468030.pdf (page15) to a Micro850

Please send me some info I would appreciate it.

Today I will try the Modbus TCP method.

Regards

Ron
 
The 850 does NOT do implicit I/O like a contrologix it is like a slc or micrologix explicit messaging only.
I have not done his yet. You should be able to do explicit read and writes to the drive. I would call AB and talk to them about it or you can reverse engineer what they have done for the 525 drives. AB does have some documentation on the comms swtip between the 850 & 525.

Again I have not done this sk it is all conceptual
 
I would go for a 1100 or 1400... I like both of them very much

I have a lot to say about the 800 series but nothing good o_O

Last time I spoke to Kipper on the phone he said the software was much better... I don't think they could of made it worse if they tried, I spent hours/days on them and never will again, even worse I built a couple trainers with them and had to spend even more time supporting them and in the end... giving them their money back

Did I say I like the 1100 and 1400...
 
I stock 1100 and 1400 on my service truck!!!

I do have a few 830 at the shop but I don't carry them with me.
 
I'm just getting into the Micro 850 and I want to write a program and then test it using the CCW (Connected Components Workbench) software. I just can't seem to figure out how to test the program. It doesn't seem to have a simulation mode. The only option seems to be to load the program on to the PLC and run it. Am I missing something?
 

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