1756-RIO Firmware issue

Normally I have been able to read the forum or AB literature and resolve and issue, but on this one I'm stumped.

I am not on Techconnect or a Integrator. I have not been able to find any issues similar to mine on the web. Have also read the manuals and still unable.


Software
Logix5000 ver 18.02
RS Linx Gateway OEM ver4.0
PC Windows 10

Hardware:
CLX L63 located in 0
1756-ENBT---1
1756-RIO ver 3.1/B---2

My intent is to setup the RIO as an adapter to monitor PLC5/40E io. However, I am having an issue with firmware upgrade when trying to set the module up as adapter through the 1756- Remote IO configuration tool. It throws up an error Incompatible Hardware/Firmware I have attached the jpg files.

I verified that I do not have an ST chip so im sure that is not the issue.

Any help from you guys would be appreciated.

Thanks
John

OK, as you appear to be attempting a firmware flash to the 1756-RIO module, you probably already know that the 1756-RIO must be at firmware revision 3.3.1 or later to be used as an adapter with a PLC5 processor?

Also, the Add-On Profile (AOP) for the 1756-RIO module, installed for RSLogix 5000 v18.02, may need to be updated.

What firmware revision are you attempting to flash to the module?

What AOP version is currently installed?
To check this - open the module properties window for the 1756-RIO.
Click on the box in the most top left corner to display the pull-down menu.
Choose "About Module Profile".
Note the "software version installed.............................???"

AOP v2.04.03 is the latest available from Rockwell.

Regards,
George

Thanks George for quick reply

That is correct The module CLX light is green.

LED states "Firmware Update Required"

Went back and re downloaded RIO drivers for Series B 3.xx.xx

Verified Software version in Module properties
version 2.04.3.0
Compatibility v17 & Later

With RS5000 shut down unpackaged module and pressed MPsetup it went through its Initialization and stated that either media is installed or will be doing a downgrade.

I have checked HD for other instance of 56 config files and only have one RIO file in RS5000/module profiles

What am I missing?

John

I don't have much time to keep replying after only single suggestions or questions so I'll throw all this up now that I have a "minute or two"...

Just to rule things in or out - is the controller in Program Mode when you are attempting to change the module's mode?

Which OS are you using - 32-bit or 64-bit?

Let's be sure your AOP is installing correctly...

Note: You are probably doing this but I recommend you always unpack (extract) any downloaded compressed packages before attempting to run executable files from inside the package, such as MPSetup.exe in this case. Once unpacked, run the executable from within the extracted folder.

Hub639 said:

...I have checked HD for other instance of 56 config files and only have one RIO file in RS5000/module profiles...

Click to expand...

By "56 config files" and "RIO file" I assume you mean the "56RioCfg..." files installed by the AOP?

Are you saying you only see one of those files in the Module Profiles folder, such as "56RioCfgScan.exe"?

There should also be "56RioCfgAdpt.exe" among others...

32-bit OS: These files should be present under ...Program Files/Rockwell Software/RSLogix 5000/Module Profiles/RA 1756 RIO Comms

64-bit OS: These files should be present under Program Files (x86)/Rockwell Software/RSLogix 5000/Module Profiles/RA 1756 RIO Comms

Along with those two important files, there should be 50 or so files installed to that folder by the AOP...



If those files are present then next...

A quick test that both modes are working at the software level is to open the 1756-RIO module properties in RSLogix 5000 and on the General tab open the "Change" dialog box. In here change the module from Scanner to Adapter mode. Then go to the Remote I/O tab and press the Configuration Tool button. Depending on which mode is selected, either "56RioCfgScan" or "56RioCfgAdpt" should be displayed at the top of the window that should open.

If something is not working at this level then the issue is likely still with the AOP installation.

Also, you should be selecting Adapter mode under the General/Change tab before running the Configuration Tool. When you change to Adapter mode and press "OK", make sure to "Apply" the change before going to the Remote I/O tab.

Also, having read a little more...

In the Install Notes, for the latest AOP v2.04.03, it states...

Module / Device Revision Information

Catalog Number / Series
1756-RIO

Minimum Module / Firmware Revision
3.2.1

Minimum RSLogix 5000 Software Version
V17.00

This suggests that the latest AOP v2.04.03 comes with firmware revision 3.2.1 and this is the firmware revision that the Configuration Tool will attempt to load into the module, whether selecting Scanner or Adapter mode.

Also, in the Release Notes for AOP v2.04.03 (June 2013)...

Table 1 - Corrected Anomalies with Firmware Revision 3.2.1, AOP Version 2.4

This also suggests that firmware revision 3.2.1 is provided with the latest AOP v2.04.03.

So, even if you do get this latest AOP and Configuration Tool working, it is still not flashing the required firmware revision 3.3.1 that I mentioned earlier is apparently required to use a 1756-RIO in Adapter mode to a PLC5 controller.

To double-check what AOP v2.04.03 does try to load...

When you run the Configuration Tool, and execute Tools>Set 1756-RIO Module Scanner/Adapter Mode, and select your mode and path, you should then get the Firmware Update Confirmation popup. Under the Warning in the popup, which firmware revision does it state the 1756-RIO module currently has loaded and which is it about to attempt to load? Also note whether they are 1756-RIO-SCAN or 1756-RIO-ADPT.

In this technote article they mention the existence of a "special" firmware revision 3.4.4 for the 1756-RIO module but apparently it is not publicly available to download...

118003 - 1756-RIO firmware history
Access Level: TechConnect

That is also the technote where I found the info on requiring firmware revision 3.3.1 to support adapter mode to a PLC-5. The technote specific to this is also linked in there...

591082 - 1756-RIO module as an adapter to a PLC-3 or PLC-5/250
Access Level: TechConnect

But even this is confusing? Note the title says adapter to either type of PLC but inside it states - When a 1756-RIO is used as an adapter to a PLC-3 or a PLC-5/250 as a scanner you must have 1756-RIO firmware revision 3.3.1 or later

This "appears" to be saying 3.3.1 is required for adapter mode to a PLC-3 or scanner mode to a PLC-5. Hmm, so maybe you don't require 3.3.1 specifically for adapter mode to a PLC-5? Hopefully that is the case as I don't know where the heck you can get it? The latest AOP v2.04.03 seems to only go up to firmware revision 3.2.1.

I think for now you should concentrate on getting whatever firmware version AOP v2.04.03 does have into the module and then take it from there.

This is certainly a case of "Reckwell" at their confusing best.

G.

George, if you did that in a "minute or two", you are a better man than I am.....

Just to add to your last point,

PLC-5/250 as a scanner

Click to expand...

, was the 5/250 not a different beast altogether - very different from the PLC5?
I used them in the early 90s as a PLC3 replacement to get the memory, but cannot remember all the details of how different they were.

Hub639 mentioned jpgs but I cannot see them..

JohnCalderwood said:

George, if you did that in a "minute or two", you are a better man than I am...

Click to expand...

Hi John,

That's why I used "inverted commas" - it took a "little" bit longer than that (about an hour on and off during a usual busy day).

JohnCalderwood said:

...Just to add to your last point, , was the 5/250 not a different beast altogether - very different from the PLC5?
I used them in the early 90s as a PLC3 replacement to get the memory, but cannot remember all the details of how different they were...

Click to expand...

I don't like talking about them in the past tense as there are actually some still in operation today.

The PLC-5/250 is the Daddy of the PLC-5 family. With its much greater resources than the average PLC-3 and PLC-5 processors, it was designed to be a high speed central data concentrator when used in a Pyramid Integrator System. Separate modules are used to handle the individual processing requirements...

The Resource Manager (RM) modules are used to handle backplane, external DH/DH+ and serial communications (built-in ports), system configuration, fault handling and programming interfacing. They have their own memory independent to the processor (5130-RM2 = 384k words).

The Logic Processor module (LP) is used to execute programs. You can have up to four LP in one Pyramid Integrator chassis, all executing separate programs or tasks, if required. This is equivalent to multi-tasking in a single Logix 5000 processor. The largest LP module (5250-LP4) provides 2048k words of memory, which is huge in the PLC-5 world.

The DH/DH+ communication modules (KA) add further communications capability to the built-in ports on the RM module. The RM module's memory handles the KA I/O module's data transfers as the KA has no on-board memory of its own. The KA may also be used as a programming interface.

The RS modules, or Remote Scanner (RS), provide RIO communications with 1771 Remote I/O or other RIO capable devices (1756). These I/O scanners have their own I/O image memory and also handle their own block-transfer data.

It would be one of these Remote Scanner (RS) modules in a PLC-5/250 Pyramid Integrator System that the technote would be referring to communicating with a 1756-RIO module in adapter mode and using firmware revision 3.3.1.

Allen Bradley Remote I/O is pretty generic, whichever PLC it is being used with. There may be a few differences in settings on the hardware, etc., but a 1756-RIO module should be communicating in pretty much the same way to any of the PLC-5 family processors supporting Remote I/O. So my intuition says that firmware revision 3.3.1 may be required to use the RIO module in adapter mode with any PLC-5 processor. But we still cannot say with certainty that there wasn't special firmware developed for the 1756-RIO just to run in adapter mode with a PLC-5/250 RS module, specifically.

So again, I would park these thoughts for now and concentrate on jumping the first and maybe only hurdle.

Regards,
George

George Thanks again for the reply and the detail you laid out. It is really appreciated!

Windows 10 64bit

The files have been extracted and running MPsetup from that file

I have tried this puppy upside down and backwards....Even tried to revert to older firmware. Both A and B each time uninstalling v18 reloading and have had no success. The only thing I have not tried is loading xp on virtual.. Maybe for another day.

So I coughed up and purchased another 1756-RIO with 3.4 Firmware and disk with drivers....And finally gave in and signed up for techconnect....

I cannot thank you enough for the advice and the manner in which you laid it out.

John

Hi John,

You're most welcome. That is interesting? Even at firmware revision 3.4 the 1756-RIO will not allow you to change from scanner mode to adapter mode?

It sounds more like a conflict at the software level. Possibly even the OS, as you're surmising (xp on virtual). There was a reason I asked you which OS architecture you are using...

hub639 said:

...Windows 10 64bit...

Click to expand...

There is a known issue with the 1756-RIO Configuration Tool not launching correctly when the AOP is install under a 64-bit OS. But the error message is more related to the 56RioCfg file not being found, rather than hardware incompatibility like your getting. This other error happens because the AOP files are installed under the ".../Program Files (x86)/..." folder under a 64-bit OS. The Configuration Tool executable is designed to reference the AOP files under the ".../Program Files/..." folder, which of course is the norm under a 32-bit OS.

The workaround is to run the necessary 56RioCfg file manually from within the 64-bit structured folder.

Are you able to get as far as the 56RioCfgAdpt window opening and its only when you attempt to use the Tools/Set... command you run into trouble? I can't quite remember the sequence of events?

But it could still just be some other Windows 10 or 64-bit specific issue. I'd be very curious to know if a virtualized XP session works.

Do let us know how it all fairs out and good luck.

G.