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Old October 13th, 2003, 08:51 PM   #1
Tim
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Omron Vision Sensor

Alright, the time has finally come. My company is wanting me to install a Omron F-160 vision system. I've played with this thing for about 2 days now and I really had doubts at first, but now I really think this is a cool system. I know its probably been around for some time now, but this is my first look at it. I've tried to get them to look at using them in the past, but the cost at that time was too much.
Anyways, I thought I would post a topic on this, so maybe I could get some heads up on this, when I go to install it. My only concern right now is trying to protect the camera and the back lighting so the operator doesn't hit it while loading the machine with a part. Now, the last thing is what do you recommend when I'm at home sound asleep and I get that dredfull phone call because an operator has accidentally hit the camera and its view is out of range. Machine won't run because the veiw or focus points are now off. I'm going to be the main player in the new vision system and will probably be resonsible for it. I was thinking of just installing an overide switch on the HMI, so if the camera did take a dump, then the night shift crew could just overide, "Turn off the camera" and allow the machine to run without it. What would you do?
Thanks for any input.
Tim
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Old October 13th, 2003, 09:11 PM   #2
Eric Nelson
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I'd look into automating the loading process, and get rid of the 'un-camera-friendly' operator...

Seriously!...

beerchug

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Old October 14th, 2003, 07:18 AM   #3
Omronfaq
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Tim,

The omron vision systems are very robust. The hardware, and thus firmware is very reliable and not prone to typical PC related hangs etc. Unlikely to get early calls due to hardware failure.

As for camera focus etc, this is the most critcal part of the system. Ideally you want the camera light source fixed such that operator access is not possible. This can often be complicated but worth the effort if possible.

Lens attachments are also available with grub screws. These prevent accidental adjustment of the lens focus etc. Also well worth the investment. These may be after market???

We have many applications running which are mission critical, ie. inline error detection on assembly lines. Thus, uptime is very important. As for manual bypass if a fault was to occur, this is a good idea if no other solution is viable.

Good luck with your project!!
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Old October 14th, 2003, 03:34 PM   #4
Laurent
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Hi Tim,

I would first add a "hidden" target in the field (special shape/special place), driving an output "camera available" when properly detected. Then latch/unlatch your vision control with this information in PLCs, and record timestamped alarms on rising/falling edges. This way no operator is required to switch your system off from HMI. In a second time, perhaps move your camera and lamp with some basic linear axis. Allow your process to run when your camera is there, allow your operator to load/unload when your camera has been displaced.

Your post focuses on very interesting points concerning indirect costs of vision machines. Sold as easily configurable sensors, those tools can't run without very good and special lights (i.e see prices of LED panels), sensing areas with pretty good insulation from sunlight or other light sources, cautious - expensive - electric and mechanical integrations.

Regards,
Laurent
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Old October 14th, 2003, 04:42 PM   #5
stevez
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Not acceptable to switch off camera

We run a few machines that use vision systems for QUALITY CONTROL.
If there is a problem with the vision system we don't run the line until repaired.
Tim I don't know what product you are manufacturing but in our plant
(pharmceuticals) if the vision system is not okay the line doesn't run.
Can your plant risk running without the vision system?

Anyway good luck with the project.

Steve
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Old October 14th, 2003, 07:33 PM   #6
Tim
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Thanks everyone for there input, "EVEN YOURS ERIC"
The boss pulled me off of this today, but I will get back to it as soon as possible. I gotta go fix someone elses "DRIPPINGS" on another machine program. Anyways, thanks for the input.
Tim
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 08:21 PM   #7
Tim
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Ok guys,
I've got this vision stuff figured out. PRETTY COOL!
One simply question. I'm currently using a little 5" TV to hook up to the video output on the Omron F160 module. As you are aware, this is for my initial settings and to use to readjust the image in the future. Well, using this small screen really sucks. I want to use my Toshiba lap top as the monitor screen and would like to know if anyone else is doing this as well? I think I need to get a video input card, or something of that nature to get this to work. I just need a nudge in the right direction. I've done some research on this, but found a lot of different variations and specifications.
Someone at work said I need to make sure it has firewire capability or something like that, but heck who knows.
Thank You,
Tim
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 11:37 PM   #8
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Most laptops don't do what you want. Yes, you'll need some type of video adapter that will accept a composite input. Look into the hardware used to make your laptop a video editor. Maybe something like THIS? They claim 30 frames/sec. which should be fine. I would guess a firewire video adapter (if such an animal exists) should be faster.

I'm not familiar with the Omron stuff, but can't you view what the camera sees with the software? Or does Omron just use a handheld that plugs into the camera?

The DVT cameras I use don't have a video output (without additional hardware). You watch the camera image in real time (or close to it) through the ethernet connection.

Since you only need it for setup, why not just use a larger TV/monitor?...

beerchug

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Old October 24th, 2003, 06:58 PM   #9
Tim
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Eric,
I'm not sure if the software will show the image on the laptop screen. The sales rep said the software was really not needed because I could just use the hand held unit and a TV to do the programming.
You know, you brought up a pretty simple solution that I think I'm going to do. I'm going to drag out the big 27" TV from the office. That will surely be a better image. I think if we decide to use the vision system on more machines, I might be better off getting the video input adapter, or just mount that 27" on my toolbox.
Thanks
Tim
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Old October 25th, 2003, 12:34 AM   #10
Eric Nelson
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tim
I'm going to drag out the big 27" TV from the office. That will surely be a better image. I think if we decide to use the vision system on more machines, I might be better off getting the video input adapter, or just mount that 27" on my toolbox.
Tell the boss a 50" plasma screen would be easier to mount on your toolbox!...

beerchug

-Eric
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