Wireless valves

I have been asked to look into putting a system in place that will 'wirelessly' control three valves from a small touchscreen.

The touchscreen will allow the operator to manually turn the valves on and off. The valves will obviously have power routed to them but I want to avoid running the control cables (the valves are situated about 200 metres from the touchscreen) so I wondered if it is possible to wirelessly control these valves?

The only wireless experience I have is with setting up a wireless computer network so any help/advice would be appreciated.

Cheers

JT

Need a few more details:
Will the touch screen have I/O, or will it be attached to a PLC? If a PLC, what brand?

I've had good results using wireless I/O, but that was via a PLC. Wireless I/O could also be used with a hard wired control panel. I've saw advertisements for "new" touch screen/plc in one units, but have not actually seen one yet.

Just do a google search for wireless I/O and you should find something to get you started.

Ken

I have absolutely nothing set in stone yet. I can use whatever I need to do the job. I thought it would probably need a PLC and then some sort of wireless bolt-on, but I'm not really sure how to go about it. I will need some remote I/O because I want to be able to send back the state of the valve (open/closed) to the touchscreen.

Thanks for the advice, I'll have another look on Google and see if I can get further.

Cheers

You can install PLC near to your valves. I mean PLC with internal I/O's. Remote I/O's and networks need of course more HW. There are screens with ethernet-connection and you can connect touch screen to wireless ethernet. Cause I know Mitsubishi HW, my suggestion is E-terminal E410 & e.g. Mitsubishi FX-PLC and external ethernet module. You also need 2pcs wireless Lan access points. When using PLC near I/O's it is possible to use wireless RS-communication??

Tmu

JT,

Just saw an ad for Moore Industry that looks like it may be what you are looking for, see Wireless Link Module . No experience with this product but have had no problems with Moore products in the past.

A system integrator I know recently mentioned he was having good luck with some Phoenix wireless transmitters so this might be another avenue to check out.

Mike

Thanks for the info. I'll give Moore a call in the morning. It looks ok, I just need to discuss how it would connect to a touchscreen and also the price of the units.

Cheers

JT

Ken Moore said:

Need a few more details:
Will the touch screen have I/O, or will it be attached to a PLC? If a PLC, what brand?

I've had good results using wireless I/O, but that was via a PLC. Wireless I/O could also be used with a hard wired control panel. I've saw advertisements for "new" touch screen/plc in one units, but have not actually seen one yet.

Just do a google search for wireless I/O and you should find something to get you started.

Click to expand...

Hi Ken

I am very interested in hearing more about your wireless IO project. Any chance you can post up what exactly you did and how far your apparatus was from the PLC?

Im with TimeFluxCap. Can't wait to hear about it. Did do a similiar thing sometime ago. We ran 62.5u fiber to a secondary comm. closet on the main plant floor. We put all wireless access points up in the ceilling and hard wired with Cat5e. Let the IS (IT) boys/gals do the rest as their old 100Mb/s MANAGED switch sucked.

You have distance issues.

Johnny

and what are those valves doing? are they going to be on the safety circuit (actuators)?

The three valves haven't been bought yet. The idea of the system is to put three wireless valves into three separate water mains that feed the factory. The factory has a main gatehouse that is always manned, that's where the touchscreen will be mounted.

The furthest valve from the touchscreen is about 200 metres. The person in the gatehouse will be able to shut off the water to the factory if needed.

I'm not sure at the moment if the touchscreen will have I/O or be attached to a PLC because I have no idea what the best way to tackle this is. I'm going to phone Moore Industry today and see if they have any advice for me.

The valves will probably be 240Vac and there is no problem running a small panel out to the valves that can contain the power and a contactor / overload etc. I'm assuming the panel will also need some sort of remote I/O because I need feedback as to whether the valve is open or shut.

If anyone has had experience with this type of product and can offer any advice then let me know.

Cheers

Hi Ken

I am very interested in hearing more about your wireless IO project. Any chance you can post up what exactly you did and how far your apparatus was from the PLC?

Click to expand...

In my application I used the Elpro 905 series (900 Mhz spread spectrum) LINK They are based out of Austrailia, so that may be an added benefit for you.

I bought a gateway, and connected it to a AB SLC via DF1, they also have Modbus, Profibus, Ethernet I/P, and many other protocols. The gateway can connect your PLC to many field wireless units. I believe the Max line of sight distance was 15 miles, but repeaters can be used to get more distance. I have one unit about 1/2 mile away that is transmitting 6 analog signals from a remote skid mounted compressor.
I have another unit about 1 mile away that is sending/recieving discrete signals. The units can be set up to only send a signal if there is a certain delta, or after a preset time duration, I believe the fastest time was around 1 second, so they are not ideal for "real time" control.

You can also use them as peer to peer units, a device wired to input-1 on unit-1, will cause output-1, on unit-2 to change state, analogs can be configured the same.

The local Rep. was great, he brought out two demo units and we did testing of the actual locations I needed. One gotcha is Pine trees, I was told that pine needles are almost the exact length of the radio wave and can cause major headaches.

The max. distance through metal buildings is much less, I don't remember the exact distance, but it was around 2000 feet. I overcame this by mounting my antenna outside the building.

The units require low voltage power, 9 - 30VDC / 12 - 24VAC
They sell a solor powered unit that uses standard 12-Volt car batteries as a back up, and will send a low voltage alert.

Ok I'm sorry, I only just caught this post.

Surely I can't be the only one who thought the subject "Wireless valves" referred to "Thermionic tubes in a radio set"?

Ken

Remote valve op

Couple thoughts
1. How large are the valves?
2. What kind of water do they control (city, cooling, etc etc)
3. Do they really need to be turned off so quickly?
4. What is cost of remote control vs cost of bicycle (600 meter one way is a pretty good hike)

Dan Bentler

leitmotif

I'm not sure on the size of the valves yet. I was meant to get those details today but the bloke hasn't sent them, I should hopefully know by tomorrow.

The water is drainage water, so in effect the valves would block all the fresh water drains.

They don't have to operate particularly fast at all, speed isn't really an issue.

It definitely has to be via remote link ie wireless, because otherwise it would require digging up a lot of road, this is out of the question. It is also out of the question to run the cable at high level. Therefore wireless is the way to go (I assumed).

I'd probably get 3 DL05 PLC's with ethernet cards one 6" EZ-Touch screen with an ethernet card and then a set of the wireless ethernet bridges running with the screen end as the AP and the PLC ends as the remotes. I figure about $275 per PLC end and $750 for the screen end.

You could buy the industrial grade wireless ethernet modesm from Automation Direct for about $1200 per radio (4 of them), but with what your looking at you might get away with a LinkSys AP and 3 LinkSys WET11 bridges...