Fuel oil tank level - PLCS.net

tcarafi · July 10th, 2015, 11:10 AM

Good day everyone.

I have a pending project regarding tank level. This company wants us to set up a sensor for the amount of fuel oil in a single tank at any given time.
Our idea as a company was to install a pressure meter at the bottom of the tank, in order to find the height of the liquid, then the volume.
My question is the following: would a Siemens SITRANS P DS III sensor work for it, considering the liquid in question (fuel oil)? Would the sensor become corroded at all?

boneless · July 10th, 2015, 11:24 AM

When we have level transmitters for oil tanks, we usually mount them on top of the tank (non contact). As you state, depending on what oil you are measuring, there could be corrosion.

I think this is the one we have used in the past: http://www2.emersonprocess.com/en-us...ges/index.aspx

Tom Jenkins · July 10th, 2015, 11:45 AM

If you are measuring oil level with a pressure transmitter make sure you know the specific gravity of the oil. If you are worried about corrosion use an isolation diaphragm similar to this: http://www2.emersonprocess.com/en-us...ges/index.aspx

Bullzi · July 10th, 2015, 12:43 PM

What size is your tank? How accurate do you need it to be? Do you need to interface with a PLC or HMI?

tcarafi · July 10th, 2015, 04:04 PM

It's a 2.5 meter diameter, 5 meter long bunker C fuel oil tank.
I need an HMI, and the purpose is to calculate the volume of oil in the tank.
Is it a better idea to get an ultrasound sensor and set it on top instead?

danw · July 10th, 2015, 04:43 PM

Head pressure works for level, but the result is density/specific gravity dependent. Physical level (elevation) is a calculation: head pressure/specific gravity.

Say the level is constant but the density changes due to temperature. The indicated level (from the transmitter) will not change because the head pressure is the same, but the physical level will change due to the temperature related expansion or contraction.

Corrosion is unlikely, because Siemen's wetted parts are at least stainless steel.

Bullzi · July 10th, 2015, 05:10 PM

That is a small tank compared to what I am use to.

You should have a bunch of options for a tank like that. You an use Float, Pressure, Magnetostrictive, Ultrasonic and Radar. A lot will depend on how accurate you want to be, what is available in your area and the budget.

I would take a look around and see what you can get your hands on maybe call a local company that specialises in level measurement and see what they have.

a062549 · July 10th, 2015, 05:36 PM

How much do you have to spend??

I have used static pressure instruments in the lower part of the tank with good success. And you can make the display tell you how much is in the tank, and not have to HMI it??
John

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bullzi

That is a small tank compared to what I am use to.

You should have a bunch of options for a tank like that. You an use Float, Pressure, Magnetostrictive, Ultrasonic and Radar. A lot will depend on how accurate you want to be, what is available in your area and the budget.

I would take a look around and see what you can get your hands on maybe call a local company that specialises in level measurement and see what they have.

Bullzi · July 10th, 2015, 07:00 PM

One important thing: Make sure that you get a system that is rated for the hazardous environmental conditions of the material in the tank. If it is a vented tank you will need Class 1 Div.1 rated equipment if you will have any electrical connections on it.

keshik · July 10th, 2015, 07:31 PM

I've used ultrasonics for this sort of thing (tank level measurement) on a few different projects and it's worked well. Pretty simple to program and install.

milldrone · July 10th, 2015, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcarafi

It's a 2.5 meter diameter, 5 meter long bunker C fuel oil tank.

Is this a round tank with the axis horizontal?

keshik · July 10th, 2015, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milldrone

Is this a round tank with the axis horizontal?

That is a good question. My tank have always been vertical. An ultrasonic won't work as well on a horizontal tank.

Edmhydraulics · July 10th, 2015, 08:18 PM

Up here we use Titan Logix TD-80 Level Sensors on fuel and oil trucks, great mobile product, good temp ratings, also Class 1 Div 2 rated for explosion risk areas. It uses Radar and time of flight to measure the distance from the top of the tank to the fluid level, volumes are calculated by the unit with a strap chart. To connect to an HMI, the unit comes with a 4-20ma output and I convert that to distance, from there I have a strap chart in the HMI or PLC.

Unit runs on 12-24Vdc, I typically use 24Vdc as the 4-20 seems to react better. There are probably hundreds of thousands of these units in service around North America, most oil field tankers use them, but they can be used on all types of fuel and water/liquids. The in-tank components are all stainless.

Might look them up and see if that is what you need.

shooter · July 11th, 2015, 02:55 PM

be sure the tank has a pressure outlet on top, as otherwise you can measure wrongly with a pressuresensor.

July 10th, 2015, 11:10 AM	#1
tcarafi Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 2	Fuel oil tank level Good day everyone. I have a pending project regarding tank level. This company wants us to set up a sensor for the amount of fuel oil in a single tank at any given time. Our idea as a company was to install a pressure meter at the bottom of the tank, in order to find the height of the liquid, then the volume. My question is the following: would a Siemens SITRANS P DS III sensor work for it, considering the liquid in question (fuel oil)? Would the sensor become corroded at all?

July 10th, 2015, 12:43 PM	#4
Bullzi Lifetime Supporting Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,530	What size is your tank? How accurate do you need it to be? Do you need to interface with a PLC or HMI? __________________ There is never enough money to do it right but there is always enough money to do it again.

July 10th, 2015, 04:04 PM	#5
tcarafi Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 2	It's a 2.5 meter diameter, 5 meter long bunker C fuel oil tank. I need an HMI, and the purpose is to calculate the volume of oil in the tank. Is it a better idea to get an ultrasound sensor and set it on top instead? Last edited by tcarafi; July 10th, 2015 at 04:06 PM.

July 10th, 2015, 05:10 PM	#7
Bullzi Lifetime Supporting Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,530	That is a small tank compared to what I am use to. You should have a bunch of options for a tank like that. You an use Float, Pressure, Magnetostrictive, Ultrasonic and Radar. A lot will depend on how accurate you want to be, what is available in your area and the budget. I would take a look around and see what you can get your hands on maybe call a local company that specialises in level measurement and see what they have. __________________ There is never enough money to do it right but there is always enough money to do it again.

July 10th, 2015, 07:00 PM	#9
Bullzi Lifetime Supporting Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,530	One important thing: Make sure that you get a system that is rated for the hazardous environmental conditions of the material in the tank. If it is a vented tank you will need Class 1 Div.1 rated equipment if you will have any electrical connections on it. __________________ There is never enough money to do it right but there is always enough money to do it again.



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July 10th, 2015, 11:24 AM	#2
boneless Lifetime Supporting Member + Moderator Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: OKC Posts: 1,614	When we have level transmitters for oil tanks, we usually mount them on top of the tank (non contact). As you state, depending on what oil you are measuring, there could be corrosion. I think this is the one we have used in the past: http://www2.emersonprocess.com/en-us...ges/index.aspx

July 10th, 2015, 11:45 AM	#3
Tom Jenkins Lifetime Supporting Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 6,217	If you are measuring oil level with a pressure transmitter make sure you know the specific gravity of the oil. If you are worried about corrosion use an isolation diaphragm similar to this: http://www2.emersonprocess.com/en-us...ges/index.aspx

July 10th, 2015, 04:43 PM	#6
danw Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: midwest, USA Posts: 3,268	Head pressure works for level, but the result is density/specific gravity dependent. Physical level (elevation) is a calculation: head pressure/specific gravity. Say the level is constant but the density changes due to temperature. The indicated level (from the transmitter) will not change because the head pressure is the same, but the physical level will change due to the temperature related expansion or contraction. Corrosion is unlikely, because Siemen's wetted parts are at least stainless steel.

July 10th, 2015, 07:31 PM	#10
keshik Lifetime Supporting Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 408	I've used ultrasonics for this sort of thing (tank level measurement) on a few different projects and it's worked well. Pretty simple to program and install.

July 10th, 2015, 08:18 PM	#13
Edmhydraulics Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Beaumont Posts: 173	Up here we use Titan Logix TD-80 Level Sensors on fuel and oil trucks, great mobile product, good temp ratings, also Class 1 Div 2 rated for explosion risk areas. It uses Radar and time of flight to measure the distance from the top of the tank to the fluid level, volumes are calculated by the unit with a strap chart. To connect to an HMI, the unit comes with a 4-20ma output and I convert that to distance, from there I have a strap chart in the HMI or PLC. Unit runs on 12-24Vdc, I typically use 24Vdc as the 4-20 seems to react better. There are probably hundreds of thousands of these units in service around North America, most oil field tankers use them, but they can be used on all types of fuel and water/liquids. The in-tank components are all stainless. Might look them up and see if that is what you need.

July 11th, 2015, 02:55 PM	#14
shooter Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: duketown Posts: 2,711	be sure the tank has a pressure outlet on top, as otherwise you can measure wrongly with a pressuresensor. __________________ shooter@home.nl skype shooter paul.deelen Computer Shooter Paul Deelen J. Wassenaerstraat 29 NL 5224 GG 's-Hertogenbosch +31653300739

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