Component IDs

Rson

Member
Join Date
Jun 2017
Location
Michigan
Posts
517
Just curious - for those of you who do handle drawings - How do you decide your component IDs?

I'm smack in the middle of the automotive world - but we have been doing more watewater treatment facilities and other industries lately. Typically I always use a ladder diagram and the ID for the component has the page #, line # in the Id such as 1105CR - which would be page 11 line 05 Control Relay.

Most of the 'electrical cad software' allows IEC like schemes where you just use CR1, CR2, etc - and just start at #1 for the wire and go up to whatever number. I've thought of switching to this simpler style to make labels / etc easier to print & read, but I'm not sure how common it is VS page & line numbers.

I understand the thought process behind using the page/line # to quickly look up the issue in the prints - but we typically do small machines with no more than a few relays or push buttons - so the simpler numbering scheme is attractive.

I'd love to hear your 2 cents.

Also - I'm very pro using the I/O address as the wire # and component ID - such as Q5.0CR - where output 5 bit 0 is the control relay's ID. This makes it possible to open the program without looking at the schematics and quickly find I/O points. My colleague insists on using the page/line number scheme even for I/O points, but doesn't really have an argument to back it up - but I've seen both used.
 
I use Page# line# for wire numbers, then I/O address.
If an output runs to a relay that output number is that wire number. But the device ID is the page/line #
This is for new print sets.

For integrations i follow what is being used already.

I just looked at another machine today that used 200 - 450 for all wires and I/O and the print set was not complete so, it reminded me about how much i hate it.
 
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I use the an abbreviation prefix like outlines in Nfpa 79, Then a 4 digit number, mostly as you described.

For example CR1015
CR = control relay
Page 10
Line 15

A counter argument to your point on addressing. For me, referencing the program is last line of defense. An issue is most likely to be handled by a tech with a print set than a programmer with software. I can explain to a tech in about 1 minute how to reference components on the machine.
 
What is even worse is the people who put the terminal number on the end of the wire so a panel with 20 relays would have 20 A2's but a different number on the other end of each wire. It is a nightmare to trouble shoot.

Alan.
 
I use page number and line number for devices and wire numbers unless it is a retrofit where a different method was used. If the device is connected to a PLC input or output, I will label the appropriate wires with the I/O address. I have worked on some machines that used the I/O numbers for devices, but you still had to find the page in the index (if it had one and the index had good I/O descriptions) or worse yet, search through every page. I always try to make it as easy as possible for anyone to work on my equipment. If they know how the numbering system works, then they can find the devices on the prints.
 
I would kill to have CR1105 / I/O addresses / logical wire numbers again.

Switchgear is the worst. Everything is grey SIS (24vdc, 125vdc, 110AC, CT/PT wiring, Jumpers, EVERYTHING) every component is the IEC schemes ala 1,2,3,4,5, wire numbers are either just randomly assigned sequential numbers starting at 100 or 1000 or whatever, no rhyme or reason to the sequences or you get point to point style labeling, where one wire is labelled two different things on each end (unreliable)

Hell, half the time it takes an act of congress to convince someone to wire out their spare card I/O to terminal blocks versus leaving it bare.

its a nightmare.
 
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Thanks for all of the replies so far.

I can kind of see the point on using Page / line for the I/O points. I tend to be program-centric - so when I had to troubleshoot a colleague's machine recently, I found it tedious to have to pull out the prints rather than knowing the address of the device. I suppose electricians find it just as tedious to not know what page/line the device is on in the prints.
 
I would kill to have CR1105 / I/O addresses / logical wire numbers again.

Switchgear is the worst. Everything is grey SIS (24vdc, 125vdc, 110AC, CT/PT wiring, Jumpers, EVERYTHING) every component is the IEC schemes ala 1,2,3,4,5, wire numbers are either just randomly assigned sequential numbers starting at 100 or 1000 or whatever, no rhyme or reason to the sequences or you get point to point style labeling, where one wire is labelled two different things on each end (unreliable)

Hell, half the time it takes an act of congress to convince someone to wire out their spare card I/O to terminal blocks versus leaving it bare.

its a nightmare.

I had to do 1 military job like this. All grey wire, large spade-terminal terminal blocks, etc. They did allow us to use page/line # however.
 

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