S7 - ProTool and Laptops

As usual, last week's visit to the customer produced the usual collection of mods and "can we have"s. On the Wish-List this time, amongst other things, is a Laptop to be used as a second OS as well as for maintenance and commissioning purposes. In both cases communication with the PLC is to be via the existing Ethernet LAN.

As far as the commissioning aspect is concerned, I reckon this can be handled adequately using XP's inbuilt remote control facility, (how to implement that is probably the subject of another Thread!), since the only part of the HMI S/W which is necessary is the Module Test page, which can be scaled to fit on the Laptop screen OK. I assume that for this, I can use the OnBoard Ethernet Interface - is this a correct assumption?

For the second OS, however, they will need the full HMI capabilities. Doing this via remote control of the main HMI PC is a non-starter, because the ProTool screens are all designed for 1280 x 1024 so they wouldn't fit on the Laptop screen and the Operator would have to be continually scrolling to access the Buttons. The only alternative seems to be to design a subset of the main HMI system adapted to the Laptop's resolution of 1024 x 768. This wouldn't be too much of a problem, because this OS would only be working with 2 of the 21 Modules, so a lot of unnecessary junk could be left out. As far as I can see, ProTool can only communicate with the PLC via a CP - in this case presumably a CP1512. Am I right in this assumption, or is there some way of getting ProTool to work with the Onboard Ethernet interface?

In either case, are there any peculiarities or pitfalls to watch out for when running ProTool on a Laptop (apart from abysmal performance due to typically weak Laptop graphics card)?

Hi again Roy.

Protool can convert to other resolutions, with automatic scaling of the graphics. It works, but some of the scaled graphics may look a bit awful.

As of version 6.0 SP2 can Protool work via ethernet. You will need to get at least an Ethernet Softnet S7 LEAN 6GK1704-1LW61-3AA0 (this is for v6.1 - check the type number for the latest version 6.2).
I have not done this myself yet (but I shall in a couple of months actually).
You will have to configure a number of Protool HMI stations in the S7 project.
You do not have to get a special Siemens ethernet card. It should work the regular built-in Ethernet card.

I have run Protool an a laptop via CP5511 at 1.5 Mbps with excellent result.

Good Morning Jesper!

Protool can convert to other resolutions, with automatic scaling of the graphics. It works, but some of the scaled graphics may look a bit awful.

Click to expand...

That's a bit of an understatement! On simple screens its OK, but on more complex ones the result is a total disaster!

You will need to get at least an Ethernet Softnet S7 LEAN 6GK1704-1LW61-3AA0 (this is for v6.1 - check the type number for the latest version 6.2).

Click to expand...

I've got the Simatic Net S/W, is this the same thing, or is this something extra? Looking through the CD catalogue, the order nr. brings up a Simatic Net component, but in the SIMATIC menu on the PC I only find SIMATIC NET -> Industrial Ethernet -> SOFTNET Industrial Ethernet -> OPC Scout.

That's good news, though, that I don't need a CP.

As far as configuring ProTool HMI Stations in the project is concerned, I'll come back to you again on that one, because I must admit, I'm completely in the dark about what is, or is not, necessary there.

Is this something that should be done using the Component Configurator, because I haven't managed to fathom out what that's all about either, yet!

About the "missing" extra Simatic Net components:
I think that all the various Softnet packages are exactly the same.
The only difference is what is on the yellow floppy. The CD contains the same software and it is the same that gets installed (at installation time you can select specific drivers, but if you dont interfere they will all be installed).
You will see if you open up the Configuration Console (dont know what it is called in the german version) and open the OPC components that you can select them all. But the installed license will decide if you get a nagscreen or not.

About the Kompenenten Konfigurator:
This is a confusing name for what is really the setup dialog for the "virtual rack" that will have to be installed on the PC. In this "rack" will be the various software components that has to talk internally with each other (like an OPC server, the Ethernet driver, the Protool HMI software, Win AC).
When the virtual rack has been setup, then you can download the settings from the Hardware Configurator in STEP7 - just like you would do with a "real" rack. It can be very confusing that you have to "download" settings from STEP7 on the PC, to some other software on the SAME PC.
Because Protool cannot speak directly with the PLC over Ethernet as it can with MPI or Profibus, you will have to set this up. Lets look into it together when we get to that time

Lets look into it together when we get to that time

Click to expand...

I'll definitely take you up on that offer Jesper!

I got as far as understanding the basic concept of the Komponenten Konfigurator, but as you say, I found the whole business pretty confusing and abandoned it till some time in the future (when I can no longer put it off!)

I don't know if I've just not come across the Configuration Console yet, or whether I'm just not recognising the German name - whereabouts do you find it?

When I open up START .. SIMATIC .. SIMATIC NET, I get this menu:

edit: It took a number of tries, but at least now I know how to upload images on the new forum !

Why cant you set the laptop to use 1280x1024? My IBM 300MZ can be set to that resolution so I am sure a newer model could easily be set to that.

The Compaq I used at the printing plant I had to run CAD at 1600x1200. I will admit that on a 15" screen it does make things small.

The Laptop was purchased by the supplying company without any consultation and as "hired help" I've got to live with their decision. It's a Fujitsu - Siemens C-Series Lifebook and the maximum resolution is 1024 x 768.


I must admit, I thought that the 15" screen would be too small even if 1280 x 1024 resolution were available, but I've just tried it on the 17" monitor I'm using for Internet access and although some of the pictures are very full, the results are not as bad as I would have expected.

I think I'll see if I can talk them into swapping the Laptop for one with 1280 x 1024 resolution.

@Jesper

That menu is completely different in its structure to my German one! I wouldn't have expected them to change that sort of thing between language versions! However, looking at them both, it looks as though it's "PC-Station einstellen" in the German version.

Now I can go through the throes of learning to post pictures in the new forum!



I see what you mean Jesper - that took me four attempts!

Wonders never cease!

I think I'll see if I can talk them into swapping the Laptop for one with 1280 x 1024 resolution.

Click to expand...

I did ask and they agreed!

Well, I've got my new toy and very nice it is too! However, like most laptops nowadays, it has neither a Floppy Disk nor a Serial Port, so all communication with the PLC is going to have to be via Ethernet.

I thought that this thread would solve my problems, but something seems to be missing. After a bit of trial and error selecting various possibilities amongst the 11(!) possible interfaces which S7 had automatically configured when it was installed, I fairly quickly got to the point where I could communicate with the CP343-1IT, however, when I search for available partners, only the CP shows up, not the CPU.

If I've understood S7Guy's comments in the above mentioned Thread correctly, it shouldn't be necessary to create a PC-Station in NetPro to go online (which raises the interesting question, when is it necessary?), so the only thing I can think of is that the problem is that the Laptop's static Ethernet address is incorrect - which leads to the first question, how do I check and modify the address? If somebody can provide the answer for the German version of XP, that would be even better!

The other possibility is that although I can talk to the CP, maybe the interface I've picked is not suitable for going online with. I'm using ISO for Industrial Ethernet at present, but there are also a few TCP/IP versions as well, which I haven't yet tried.

spoke to siemens today , and they said that Protool 6.0 sp2 installed with S7 5.3 should pick up S7's inbuilt ethernet driver - but try as I might , I can't get it to do it . I have a silly situation where the customer - despite having a perfectly good profibus network to connect the MP on wants to connect it via ethernet and a 343-1 . I can write all of the software and test it , but without Simatic Net , I can't create the connection to the MP - any ideas ? I forgot - the siemens guy said to point the access point for S7 to ethernet , then protool should be able to see the driver ( it still didn't work).
I have never bothered creating a station in netpro - though it looks nice , so long as the PG is on the same subnet as the PLC , it doesn't matter , you can download an new config to the 343 via profibus to get it on the same subnet , then use ethernet coms direct to the 343 .

Roy,
I only have an S7 315-2 PN/DP with the builtin ethernet port.
And it is true that I dont have to set it up in NetPro to get online. Maybe the fact that you are using ISO on TCP is related with your problems, try to use S7 protocol, or try to insert the PG in NetPro (and download the application to the station).
You definetely need the three first groups in the IP address to be the same.

"unregistered".
There are numerous places where the requirement for "additional software" is mentioned when talking about Protool and Ethernet.
I think that the support guy is wrong.

According to siemens , you should use no other driver but standard TCP/IP , not ISO - if the subnet mask is 255.255.0.0 then the last 2 nets can be different - I think .
I agree that protool documentation mentions that simatic net is required , though the support guy said no - however if you create a protool application for PC , then you don't need Simatic net - the window for ethernet config is available in protool in this case , so the driver is there , just hidden . I'll try and paste a PC application into an MP370 one and see what happens

My original attempt was before I remembered that I hadn't loaded Simatic Net onto the PC. This I have now done, but it hasn't changed anything.

I've now tried all the interfaces created by S7 and the only one which finds the CP is ISO Industrial Internet. The manual for the Cp343-1IT explictly states that unlike the GX11, the GX20 (which I have) does not support ISO (if I've remembered that correctly) so figure that one out! As far as I can see, I have nowhere where I can choose the protocol, (only the device) so I can't change to S7 communication.

The other problem is that I don't know how to change the PCs Ethernet address under Windows XP. I created a PC-Station after loading Simatic Net (using PG only mode, i.e. not "projektiert") and it shows me a completely different Ethernet address in the first two fields - I suspect this may be my problem, but I don't know how to change it! The mask is set to 255.255.0.0.

RMA there are a couple of ways to setup the IP on your XP system. Goto Start>Network Places then view Network connections, right click you network connections then choose properties. This will open the Network configuration screen, hilite TCP/IP then click properties and another window will open allowing you to set the IP
BUT
When you get to the View Network Connections screen you can right click it and disable it then create a NEW connection with a different name and set the IP etc the way you want it. This option will allow you to switch between the 2 anytime you want/need by enabling/disabling.