Motor and drive Question

gas

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Join Date
Nov 2005
Location
Erie, Pa
Posts
531
Not PLC but I know there are guys out there that can help with this.
We are replacing the controls on an old Tree CNC mill with a Yaskawa spindle motor and drive.
Old drive # VS626 MT3
Motor info:
UAASKA 04CA1
3.7/2.2 Kw
rpm 1500 / 8000
200 volt max
32 / 23 amps
An electrician here wired the motor direct to a 208 v line and it stalled and took out the breaker. Apparently it saturated and the current went ballistic.
The motor has since been checked by a motor shop.
What are we going to need for a drive (sensorless vector), and how do we set the parameters?
Any other observations would be welcome.
Thanks
 
Sounds like you may need a new electrician.
A standard sensorless vector drive will probably be fine.
You need to read and follow the QUICK START section of the drive manual for parameter settings and setup.
Every drive is different.
 
Thank you GT
My question really was: can I do this with an off the shelf drive?
Obviously I can.
The motor was down inside the machine and not visible. Our guy only wanted to bump the motor to see and hear if it ran or had bearing problems.
 
You absolutely do need to see the motor nameplate or know the motor specs to program the drive.
You need Motor:
Volts, FLA, service factor.
Aside from that you dont need access to the motor.

Does the motor have a brake on it?
 
These were very common servos in their time. I take it you don't have the original drive? It might work with SVC, but not likely perform as designed. As I recall, those motors and drives required encoder feedback to work correctly, but the encoder (magnetic) feedback signal was a little funky, not a generic optical encoder as we know and love them now. I have heard of people using high end FVC capable drives on them and having success, but not the inexpensive off the shelf little drives you can get for cheap.

But possibly CRITICAL, depending on how it is being used in your machine, the drives for these were LINE REGENERATIVE for dissipating braking energy. That alone is NOT something most off the shelf VFDs are capable of. So you will need to know EXACTLY what is expected of this drive and motor in your machine.
 
There should be a forum filter that automatically forwards all drive questions to you. You are like a Drive Encyclopedia :)

These were very common servos in their time. I take it you don't have the original drive? It might work with SVC, but not likely perform as designed. As I recall, those motors and drives required encoder feedback to work correctly, but the encoder (magnetic) feedback signal was a little funky, not a generic optical encoder as we know and love them now. I have heard of people using high end FVC capable drives on them and having success, but not the inexpensive off the shelf little drives you can get for cheap.

But possibly CRITICAL, depending on how it is being used in your machine, the drives for these were LINE REGENERATIVE for dissipating braking energy. That alone is NOT something most off the shelf VFDs are capable of. So you will need to know EXACTLY what is expected of this drive and motor in your machine.
 
+1 for the above. I was hoping he would comment.
I have seen jraef on other forums but could't remember where.
I do have the nameplate but it only gives the max voltage and not the Hz. That is what was confusing. Also 8000 rpm from a large dia frame.
It is a common spindle drive from from the stone age. We are going to run this as sensorless vector and forget the encoder.
 
If it were me....

I'd set up a standard volts/hertz drive with something like 50v/50hz, and slowly bring the voltage up running at 30hz or so, watching the current. This will get you in the ballpark of what the motor rating really is.

I'm assuming it's a 4 pole design, so max hz will be 267hz. What you don't know is what the voltage is at any other point along the way. That's what you need to figure out.

If, for example, the motor seems happy at 100v/50hz, then maybe the nameplate voltage at base speed (1500rpm (50hz)) is a little higher, like 120-140v.

It'll take a little playing, but I've done it, and it works. Once you get it running and have a motor map to work with, try to check it with a load to make sure you have decent torque. Then, you can use the new numbers to put the drive in Vector mode, and let it autotune....
 
Yaskawa still supports those servos, you can download the spec sheet from their site. But yes it is a 4 pole 200V motor designed for 50/60Hz (typical for Japan) with low inertia and high speed bearings rated for 8,000 ROM. The two current values represent the short time and continuous current. But as it was designed to only be powered by their matching servo drive, the drive has the connection for the motor's integral magnetic encoder. A drive guru I know in the Portland OR area who is an Emerson Control Techniques integrator says he has successfully used a Unidrive with it, but tried and failed to get it to work with a Hitachi standard SVC drive. When I used them it was only with the corresponding Yaskawa drive.
 
You say Servo. Is it a PM motor, not an Induction motor?

If it's a Permanent Magnet Rotor, all bets are off. You *may* be able to run it open loop.

I'm not familiar with the feedback device. I don't know if the Control Techniques M700 can use it, but I don't know of another drive that has more feedback capabilities.
 

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