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Old October 14th, 2020, 06:15 PM   #1
rajy2r
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BacNet to Contrologix - RedLion DA30

First project working with BacNet and not having any success.

Trying to read values into a Compact Logix PLC from a Kamstrup 603 Multical unit. I have a Redlion DA30 protocol convertor. I am using the same convertor for Modbus and is working fine.

On a different port, i have setup Bacnet Master to read valves from the Kamstrup. The wiring seems to be correct and i have the red and green flashing lights. The ID on the Kamstrup is set to 27, but when i try to read any values, i don't get any data.

Hoping for some help if anyone has dealt with either unit.
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Old October 14th, 2020, 06:42 PM   #2
Bullzi
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I just did this very thing using a Red Lion CR3000 HMI. Soon I will be adding a DA10 in a couple other buildings to get the info into the PLC. It was very easy to set up and went way better than I thought it would.

As for now the HMI only talks to one building and working great. So we just need to find out why it isn't working for you.

Questions:
  1. How are you connecting to the remote device? Ethernet or Serial?
  2. What driver are you using? I had to use BACNet UDP/IP Master as I had a Ethernet connection to the BACNet Controller.
  3. Are you doing the programming on the BACNet device too? If not the next couple questions are applicable.
  4. Are you sure that the ID is correct?
  5. Do you have the correct settings in the BACNet Controller for your communication?
I didn't set up the BACNet system that was done by the project's HVAC Contractor. He set up the IP and gave me the ID for each buildings controller. He also mapped data into user data areas so I could just read the data I wanted and not mess with his data.

One thing you can try is to create a tag using the IsDeviceOnline command in Crimson. Then set up an alarm if the tag is not true. That way you know if the device is not communicating at all or if you are reading the wrong registers or the registers have no data in them. It will help you move forward with troubleshooting.

Hope I was able to help.
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Old October 14th, 2020, 07:29 PM   #3
rajy2r
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullzi View Post
I just did this very thing using a Red Lion CR3000 HMI. Soon I will be adding a DA10 in a couple other buildings to get the info into the PLC. It was very easy to set up and went way better than I thought it would.

As for now the HMI only talks to one building and working great. So we just need to find out why it isn't working for you.

Questions:
  1. How are you connecting to the remote device? Ethernet or Serial? Serial (MSTP)
  2. What driver are you using? I had to use BACNet UDP/IP Master as I had a Ethernet connection to the BACNet Controller. Bacnet MSTP Master
  3. Are you doing the programming on the BACNet device too? If not the next couple questions are applicable.
  4. Are you sure that the ID is correct? Yes confirmed ID to be 27
  5. Do you have the correct settings in the BACNet Controller for your communication? If i set the COMM to 38400, the red and green lights flash, which my understanding is that it can see devices. If i change it to something else then the red light goes off.
I didn't set up the BACNet system that was done by the project's HVAC Contractor. He set up the IP and gave me the ID for each buildings controller. He also mapped data into user data areas so I could just read the data I wanted and not mess with his data. I have attached the data table from the vendor Kamstrup for reference, so i am just trying to read the value to the RedLion unit. https://products.kamstrup.com/docume...2de04cc393.pdf

One thing you can try is to create a tag using the IsDeviceOnline command in Crimson. Then set up an alarm if the tag is not true. That way you know if the device is not communicating at all or if you are reading the wrong registers or the registers have no data in them. It will help you move forward with troubleshooting.

I do have this setup, but it shows a value of 0, not sure why.

Hope I was able to help.
See comments and attachment.
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File Type: pdf BacNet Screen Shots.pdf (73.0 KB, 13 views)
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Old October 14th, 2020, 10:30 PM   #4
CLXlifestyle
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Before you spin your wheels any more, I just recently was recommended two invaluable tools:

1. RS-485/USB converter

I purchased this one, but there are many:

DTech 10 Feet USB to RS422 RS485 Serial Port Converter Adapter Cable with FTDI Chip Supports Windows 10 8 7 XP Mac
by DTECH Co.,Ltd
Learn more: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01AT1PUQI..._op7HFbE7F1E5K

2. Yet Another BACnet Explorer:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/yet...acnetexplorer/

This is freeware software. It will "whois" your BACnet MS/TP network and see what's out there. The "address" switches may not be what you're looking for. You likely need the "instance" number of the device.
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Old October 14th, 2020, 10:43 PM   #5
rajy2r
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CLXlifestyle View Post
Before you spin your wheels any more, I just recently was recommended two invaluable tools:

1. RS-485/USB converter

I purchased this one, but there are many:

DTech 10 Feet USB to RS422 RS485 Serial Port Converter Adapter Cable with FTDI Chip Supports Windows 10 8 7 XP Mac
by DTECH Co.,Ltd
Learn more: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01AT1PUQI..._op7HFbE7F1E5K

2. Yet Another BACnet Explorer:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/yet...acnetexplorer/

This is freeware software. It will "whois" your BACnet MS/TP network and see what's out there. The "address" switches may not be what you're looking for. You likely need the "instance" number of the device.
I have a Fireye EC485, i will try tomorrow. It is a USB to 485 Converter. What is an instance number ? The documentation of the vendor just says ID, which i have confirmed and changed on the meter just to make sure it's correct.
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Old October 15th, 2020, 10:25 AM   #6
Bullzi
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I noticed this from the documentation you linked to:
BACnet® MS/TP AddressingThe module can be addressed as master in the MAC address range 1-127 and as a slave when configured in the MAC address range 128-254.

Not an expert on BACNet but this seems to indicate that your address of 27 is telling this module that it is a master when it should be a slave. Try a address of 227 and see if things get better.
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Old October 15th, 2020, 11:22 AM   #7
rajy2r
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullzi View Post
I noticed this from the documentation you linked to:
BACnet® MS/TP AddressingThe module can be addressed as master in the MAC address range 1-127 and as a slave when configured in the MAC address range 128-254.

Not an expert on BACNet but this seems to indicate that your address of 27 is telling this module that it is a master when it should be a slave. Try a address of 227 and see if things get better.
I am not a BacNet expert either and that was the first thing i tried. Talking to RedLion and some other vendors, seems like that is not an issue and a Master can talk to a Master. I did change the address to a number greater than 127 and the flashing light on the redlion goes away. Wasn't able to communicate with the new address either.

Will try the Serial Convertor and the software and see if i can see something.
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Old October 15th, 2020, 04:47 PM   #8
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Ok so i tried the RS485 convertor with YABE and it can see the device and it does show with ID 27. I have attached a screenshot for reference.

On a site note, is there a Function Code 06 on RedLion Modbus TCP Master, as i only see Function Code 04, while the vendor documentation calls for Function Code 06 to write values.
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File Type: jpg Capture.JPG (177.7 KB, 39 views)

Last edited by rajy2r; October 15th, 2020 at 04:56 PM.
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Old October 16th, 2020, 08:46 AM   #9
CLXlifestyle
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Try putting 85327 into the "Device ID" for Dev1. 85327 is the instance number.
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Old October 16th, 2020, 04:19 PM   #10
Bullzi
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Quote:
On a site note, is there a Function Code 06 on RedLion Modbus TCP Master, as i only see Function Code 04, while the vendor documentation calls for Function Code 06 to write values.
Yes Function Code 06 is supported. See the snip from the Crimson Modbus manual.


As for your BACNet issue, have you made any progress on that?
The manual you linked to talks about a MAC Address. I have never heard of using the term "MAC Address" with serial communications so I am not sure if that is the Communication Address or what that is? On the last page in the manual they show a display of Menu #34 Bus Address. Is that where you are getting the number 27 from? Or from the last 2 digits of the Device Number which is what they call the Customer Number in the manual? Is there any chance that the MAC Address number and Bus Address number are different numbers?
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File Type: png Crimson Modbus snip.png (56.4 KB, 23 views)
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Old October 17th, 2020, 02:06 PM   #11
rajy2r
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Ok so i was able to get the communication working. I was under the impression that the Mac Address is what i need to use to make the communication work as "Device ID", but it turned out to be Instance Number. None of the documentation said anything about it, but it was the last 5 digits of the meter 85327 as CLXlifestyle suggested in his post above.

When i did a scan with YABE, it would actually name it Device 27 from the Mac Address. Quite poor documentation IMHO.

So it's all working now and there are four (4) meters on site.

I also had to setup Bacnet to TCP for another device. In that case too, all i had to do was use the Device ID (luckily that was given to me) and didn't actually need to use the IP address of the device. There was another post on PLCtalk which helped me set it up.

As far as the Modbus function codes go, i just disabled Code 16 on the RedLion unit for the respective protocol. Had very good help from RedLion too.

Here is a Bacnet basics guide online, that might help others in the future. Chipkin - Bacnet for Field Technicians

Thanks for the Helps guys.

Last edited by rajy2r; October 17th, 2020 at 02:09 PM.
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