MCCB not going to the off position

I’m not a huge hardware guy. The service to the control panel is locked up and I’m not able to move the local control panels MCCB out of he neutral position.

I can go to the ON position but it won’t stay, I can move he lever to the OFF position what so ever.

Does these type of MCCB need power on the load side to operate or be able to keep it in the ON position?

Picture attached.

A breaker can fail in this position. That is the "Tripped" position.

I would recommend you get a fully qualified electrician to check it out!!.

If you must proceed, 1st, be sure to remove the power feeding that breaker by operating the isolation device to the "Off" position and locking out the isolation device correctly . Then, disconnect all load wires or bars. 2nd, operate the the breaker handle to the full off position and it should latch or remain in the full off position. If it does remain in the full off position without "springing" back to the neutral position, then, you have most likely have successfully "Reset" the breaker. 3rd, with the power that feeds that breaker still "off" or "de-energized", see if the handle can be moved to the full on position and remain in that position. If it does, then the breaker "probably" is still functional. 4th, Verify all load wires or bars are still disconnected. 5th, with the load wires or bars disconnected and using the proper safety equipment, Re-energize the power feed that is going to that breaker. If the breaker remains in the "On" position, it is probably "Ok".

If any of the steps outlined fail, then the breaker "probably" needs replacing.

Also, test the load and wiring to determine why the breaker tripped in the beginning.

Snap25 said:

Does these type of MCCB need power on the load side to operate or be able to keep it in the ON position?

Picture attached.

Click to expand...

No. Have you checked the circuit on the load side to see if there is a reason its tripping? Some may require a cool down period too. Or its just plain bad.

Snap25 said:

Does these type of MCCB need power on the load side to operate or be able to keep it in the ON position?

Picture attached.

Click to expand...

I meant to ask if the MCCB needs power on the LINE side (not load) to be able to switch positions and stay without going back to the tripped position.

There may be a shunt trip or under voltage trip unit that is the breaker from being able to turn on.

jstolaruk said:

No. Have you checked the circuit on the load side to see if there is a reason its tripping? Some may require a cool down period too. Or its just plain bad.

Click to expand...

The control panel has never been powered up. I actually purchased this MCCB on Ebay to save thousands of dollars..

Our electricians ran the service to the control panel but still have the service locked out. I just haven't had time to go grab an electrician and ask him these questions.. I was laying in bed and just thinking about it now.

This is the same position the MCCB has been in since its arrived. I can push the level up (on position) but it doesn't stay. I cannot move it in the off position at all.

I was just assuming it needed power on the line side for it to function normally. Now I'm starting to worry a little.

Snap25 said:

The control panel has never been powered up. I actually purchased this MCCB on Ebay to save thousands of dollars..

Our electricians ran the service to the control panel but still have the service locked out. I just haven't had time to go grab an electrician and ask him these questions.. I was laying in bed and just thinking about it now.

This is the same position the MCCB has been in since its arrived. I can push the level up (on position) but it doesn't stay. I cannot move it in the off position at all.

I was just assuming it needed power on the line side for it to function normally. Now I'm starting to worry a little.

Click to expand...

If this panel has never been powered up, then, the breaker "could" have tripped from any number of things. Most likely though, the panel was dropped or handled roughly during shipment. It may require considerable hand pressure to "Reset" it to the "Off" position.

Edit:
Please re-read my post #2 a couple of times as I made some edits to it.

jrwb4gbm said:

If this panel has never been powered up, then, the breaker "could" have tripped from any number of things. Most likely though, the panel was dropped or handled roughly during shipment. It may require considerable hand pressure to "Reset" it to the "Off" position.

Edit:
Please re-read my post #2 a couple of times as I made some edits to it.

Click to expand...

I put a lot of force with trying to move in the OFF position when I mounted it to the sub panel. It wasn't budgeting. I did a little investigating by taking off the cover and looking at it; I didn't spend much time on it and had to move on to another task in the plant.

I do remember thinking a piece of plastic or something else was obstructing the lever from moving in the OFF positon. It didn't look like an abnormal part.. it looked like the piece that was not allowing it to move was supposed to be there is what I'm trying to say!

I was physically moved the trip bar internally and tried to push the contacts down. It was going but it was taking a lot of force and like I mentioned before, I'm not to knowledgeable on hardware and not familiar with the construction of the MCCB. I didn't want to break it.

I can easily call over an electrician but since there isn't any live power involved, I was trying to figure it out on my own. I'm new with the company and like solving my own problems without getting everyone involved! plus I don't want to look like an idiot if its something small!

g.mccormick said:

There may be a shunt trip or under voltage trip unit that is the breaker from being able to turn on.

Click to expand...

+1
It looks like there are two wires going into the left side of the breaker. I think this breaker has an undervoltage trip unit which will trip the breaker when deenergized and you won't be able to reset the breaker or turn it on.

mhammer214 said:

+1
It looks like there are two wires going into the left side of the breaker. I think this breaker has an undervoltage trip unit which will trip the breaker when deenergized and you won't be able to reset the breaker or turn it on.

Click to expand...

So how would you reset it or turn it back on if it ever went off? Is the undervoltage trip unit supplied by an external power supply?

Yes, something needs to supply power to the UV trip unit in order for you to be able to reset and turn on the breaker. There might be a label next to where the wires enter the breaker that will tell you what voltage and if it is AC or DC.
Are the white and yellow wires terminated anywhere or do they just come out of the breaker and are coiled up?

They are just coiled up.

I'll try to find a manual or documentation the MCCB to find out what voltage.

If you do not have any use for the UV trip I am sure an experienced electrician would be able to remove it. This should be possible since you can get field mounted UV trip units for the Eaton N-frame breakers.

Those two wires coiled up could be either a shunt trip connection that requires a power source or they could be simply connected to a small set of internal contacts that could be used by a plc input or signal lamp to indicate whether it is in the on position or not. I just don't know for certain. I looked at a .pdf document for that breaker and the picture showed an extension handle for the On-Off switch. I don't say to use excessive force but the extension handle should give one a hint as to how much force is normal to operate it.

Here is a link to a manual:
https://www.qualityswitchgear.com/ordersavantweb/Product/CUTLER-HAMMER/2132935-NGH312033EC

Just a comment... I don't like using the backplane as a ground conductor as seems to be happening in those pictures. You would be better bonding all of your power grounds together, either on a single through-panel mounted stud, or a bus bar.