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Old February 28th, 2003, 08:30 PM   #1
Ken Roach
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TI-505 CPU models and history

I know we have some TI-505 enthusiasts out there, and here's your opportunity to show a thing or two to an A-B diehard who has spent the past week getting a crash-course in TISoft.

I've surfed the Siemens website to get some info, but frankly I'm tired of the exclamation points.

Can somebody explain for me the basic differences between 545 and 555 models, and which CPU's came before the -1105 and -1106 ?

What I am mostly interested in is the Profibus DP capability of these controllers. I know you can add a DP scanner to the -1105, and one is built in to the -1106 (built in differently? Or just included?).

Can any of these onboard Profibus DP ports act as DP slaves ? Can DP ports be added to earlier CPUs ?
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Old February 28th, 2003, 10:03 PM   #2
Peter Nachtwey
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Why worry now?

These are models that I have.

TI525 TI999x
TI535 TI999x
TI545 68020
TI555 68030
TI565 Haven't looked in side. This looks like a big boat anchor.
As far as I know, these are of the TI525 and TI535 vintage
TI575 68020 VME based.

I don't keep track of the models such as 1105 or 1106.

TI 545 and 555 were later outfitted with Profibus DP. This happened in about 1998.

We upgraded our TI545 to have Profibus DP. The early models had a little board that can be plugged in. I think this was a temporary solution until the Profibus DP could be built in.

I have not tried making our TI's into DP slaves so I have no idea whether that is possible. I could find out given some incentive.

TI505's are a thing of the past. Why the questions now? I can't believe you would find them competition for a Contrologix.

You should have asked before the weekend. At the office I could give far more details.
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Old February 28th, 2003, 11:15 PM   #3
rsdoran
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I made a more intense post but somehow it got deleted, hopefully this short version will help. I have to agree that the 505 is a thing of the past, its one of my first to deal with the programming part thereof. I can only hope my familiarity with the Siemens support site is beneficial for your needs.

505 and Profibus

Which tools do you need to create a PROFIBUS configuration with a SIMATIC TI 505 controller?

You need the following two tools for the configuration:
A current version of Tisoft or Softshop, to program the 505 controller and to import the PROFIBUS binary files.
You can also use APT, but there are certain restrictions with regard to this tool.
If you want to use this tool, please get in touch with the "Support Line" of the SIMATIC Customer Support.
A current version of COM-PROFIBUS to generate the binary files of your PROFIBUS configuration.

If you need the master files for the 1105/1106 go here:
http://www4.ad.siemens.de/csinfo/liv...y=505+profibus The file is Si0022ax.exe

Another link that may be of help, the 505 when used with Profibus is by default seen as a MASTER so to use as a slave a coupler is needed:
http://www4.ad.siemens.de/csinfo/liv...y=505+profibus

Ken if you need any more info I will be glad to assist if I can.
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Last edited by rsdoran; February 28th, 2003 at 11:18 PM.
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Old March 1st, 2003, 09:27 AM   #4
Terry Woods
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I have a TI555 with TISoft 6.1. How Sweet It Is!

Just yesterday, at work, I was exploring the possibilitity of upgrading from TISoft 6.1 to 7.1

I recently designed some code for a "Speed-Trap" and "Off-Set Positioning". I used a mSec Timer in the Speed-Trap and another mSec timer in the Off-Set Positioner. All went well until I was reminded that there is this one very special case where the speed is veeeeeery low. In that case, the Index time far exceeds 32000-mSec.

Not a problem... I use "Bump-'n-Roll" when the timer expires. I log the fact that the timer timed-out ("Bump") and then Reset the timer ("Roll") using the appropriate "Current Value" (actually, because of timing issues, it is a little more complicated than that). Internally, not a problem. Anyway, the process was ulimately working with "differences", not explicit values.

So, anyway... in the course of going through all of this, I explored some algorithms that involved adding and/or subtracting Long Numbers.

Darn... aw, Heck...

TISoft 6.1 does not allow for direct addition, subtraction, multiplication or division of Long/Long Numbers (as in, Long/Long = Long).

However, those operations can be developed through data-manipulations (great case for a Sub-Routine).

All of the Long Numbers can be handled in the program.

OUCH! Another Gotcha! My HMI (CVU, Control Vision Unit) does not like Long Numbers!

Oh, Dear Me! What to do???

I could break-up the Long Numbers and display them as partial values... (36,485 = 36-Thousands, 4-Hundreds, 8-Tens and 5-Ones)...

That makes for a lot of extra code...

AH-HA! The CVU can handle REAL Numbers! So... how to convert my Long Number into a Real Number? Again, TISoft 6.1 doesn't provide for this. hmmmm.....

I could "Roll-My-Own" Real Number! That would mean going through the pains of manually converting the Long Number to a Real Number by determining the Radix, Mantissa and Exponent and then assembling the Real Number... Another great case for a Sub-Routine. Is there any other way?

TISoft Special Function Programs can work with Real Numbers! In fact, where necessary, they take Integers as Input parameters, convert them to REAL, do the specified operation, and then save the result in the specified form: Integer or Real.

Bummer... The Special Function Program can read-in Integers or Reals... not Long's! After a call to Johnson City, Tenn., (Siemens FREE Technical Support - and Great support, I might add) I found out that they were aware of that issue and had incorporated a solution into TISoft 7.1. GREAT! I just happened to have that upgrade sitting in my drawer! (I wondered why I didn't install it when I got it... over a year ago?)

Back then, I was looking to incorporate PROFIBUS into the system. The plan was to have "satellite" S7-PLC's operating and controlling various sub-sections of the over-all process - thus relieving the 555 of many duties. The code for the particular sub-sections would be moved to the satellites. The satellites would then handle their particular duties, respond to "commands" from the 555, and then make "reports" to the 555.

The whole idea was to speed-up local response time at the satallite stations, and off-load a lot of code from the 555, thus making more ladder memory available in the 555 for new-stuff.

So... Why didn't that happen?

The 555 I have is an -1103 version. This version does not include the Math Co-Processor! From what I remember, the -1103 could be made to handle PROFIBUS but the performance would be considerably less than could be provided by the -1105, which does have the Math Co-Processor. There were, as I remember, a lot of hoops to jump through to make the -1103 work. Including installing TISoft 7.1 (7.1 handles PROFIBUS better than 6.1).

I decided to wait until I had an -1105. In the meantime, I ordered TISoft 7.1. It's been sitting in my drawer ever since. Since then, I've acquired an -1105. It's sitting in the box.

LONG NUMBERS
So, TISoft 7.1 will provide the Long to Real conversion that I'm looking for... but only if an -1105 is installed. So now, at the first opportunity, I'll install the -1105.

Anyone looking for a perfectly good 555-1103?

TISoft 7.1 provides some interesting new features. The one that is most interesting to me is that you can write a Special Function Program which is capable of doing Real-Math, call for that Special Function on a rung of code in the same way that you would call a sub-routine, and then, have the result available immediately for the next element in the rung! The Special Function Program is executed through compiled code (machine code - VERY FAST, Up to 1000 times FASTER than LADDER!) - not an interpreter - and not through time-slicing (as would be the case in normal, queued Special Function Routines).

That's REAL Results in REAL Time (relatively speaking).

What this means is... all (or at least, the more complicated sections) of Ladder Math (Integer Math) can be re-written as REAL MATH in Special Functions and executed hundreds of times faster!

Now, That's Entertainment!
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Old March 1st, 2003, 10:15 PM   #5
RRobbins
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The 555 - 1105 & 1106 have a math co-processor builtin and has Profibus built in. You would have to use Softshop to use the "advanced" features in the processor.
The 545 - 1106 comes with Profibus built in. The 1105 comes without Profibus, but can be added. It is a daughter board.
The TI processors can be a Master on the Profibus network only.
I've said it before here. The 545's and 555's were ahead of their time. I think they have the best PID and special function programming available! Tisoft was always unkeyed, DOS based, no special programming cable needed and good, FREE support. What a concept!
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Old March 2nd, 2003, 12:44 PM   #6
Ken Roach
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T-Shirt

I was thinking of Terry's long TI-rave posts while I was learning about some of the neat data management and function block things that these controllers do. I admit I am beginning to see how the simple memory layout of these controllers was appealing.

rsdoran's post led me past the flag-waving on the Sales site and into the meat of the Siemens support site. Some of the publications there are necessarily out of date; the 545 System Manual doesn't mention the 545-1105 and 545-1106 processors, for example. I acquired a 2001 manuals-on-CD disk from Siemens that has some more updated manuals, but those manuals don't mention the 545-1102 !

I'm interested mostly in how this family of controllers works with Profibus-DP. Here's what I've figured out:

545-1102 No Profibus DP available
545-1103 Profibus DP Annex Card available
545-1104 Profibus DP Master built-in
545-1105 Profibus DP Annex Card available.
545-1106 Profibus DP Master built-in.

555-1101 No Profibus DP available.
555-1102 No Profibus DP available.
555-1103 Profibus DP Master built-in.
555-1104 Profibus DP Master built-in.
555-1105 Profibus DP Master built-in.
555-1106 Profibus DP Master built-in.

It looks the the main difference between the DP Master capability of the annex card and the built-in ports is capacity; the Annex can run 32 slaves, the built-in 112. Speed probably differs, too, but I found no info about that.

None of these DP Master ports can be configured to act as DP slaves; for that you need a DP/DP Coupler as RSDoran mentioned, or a 3rd part Special Function module from Control Technology called the 2577. It acts as a DP slave and fits in the I/O chassis with the TI-545 CPU.

As far as I can tell, configuration of the Profibus master ports and slaves is done entirely in COM Profibus and imported into TISoft using a Binary file.
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Old March 4th, 2003, 12:22 PM   #7
Ken Roach
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Why 545? Why now?

You probably guessed why I'm working on 505 series controllers at all; we're replacing them one at a time with ControlLogix.

This particular client is actually adding new machinery with ControlLogix, and it needs a very fast interlock and reference interface to existing TI545 controlled equipment. We're using an SST Profibus scanner card for ControlLogix, and a Profibus DP Slave module from Control Technology in the chassis with the TI545.

It's been a challenge; four vendors, four software packages, and no evidence that anyone has ever put these particular devices together before. There's a lot of potential for finger-pointing, and the customer themselves have no Profibus or ControlLogix experience, so I was dispatched to make the whole thing work together. It took three days of head-scratching before I threw away COM Profibus and just used SST's configuration utility and got all the lights to turn green.
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Old April 25th, 2008, 09:07 AM   #8
LogicON
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I am working on getting a TI545-1106 to commuicate to a CompactLogix via profibus. I have to order a profibus module for the compactLogix and was going to order this one.
http://www.prosoft-technology.com/pr...us_dp/ps69_dpm

What module did you use on your project and is it a successful project.
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Old April 25th, 2008, 10:43 AM   #9
rdrast
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *******
I am working on getting a TI545-1106 to commuicate to a CompactLogix via profibus. I have to order a profibus module for the compactLogix and was going to order this one.
http://www.prosoft-technology.com/pr...us_dp/ps69_dpm

What module did you use on your project and is it a successful project.
I'd suggest you start a NEW topic about this, as this topic is 5 years old and dead.
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Old April 26th, 2008, 12:53 AM   #10
Kev77
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If you need to talk to a CLX, use ethernet CTI 2572-a. It is 10/100 baseT and works well. Let me know if you want any more information.
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