Need Control Logix Help

Maverick 250

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M
I am being sent to another plant to help out. All their help left. They have a new huge assembly line that is in startup. It has problems with the Device Net. It is controlled by Control Logix. I am not an Allen Bradley trained person. I have not used or even seen Device Net or Control Logix. As close as I can tell, there is no documentation, no manuals, no support from the local distributor (hardware was bought out of state). There may be software on the laptop, maybe not. I don't know if control logix is PC based, plc, or ?

I can probably find the program and access it if it is in the laptop. If not, I'll probably have to wing the whole repair. We had some Six net plcs in our plant, with no access to the program, and no documentation.

Are there any basics that I need to know? Is it like conventional ladded logic? Does it do anything special?

I am expected to go in, have a laying of the hands, and all will work. I am lost, and do not have a clue were to start. I am not even allowed to look in the door until the morning I am to report. I told them that this is utterly ridiculous. Their reply was "are you saying that you are declining your assigned work assignment". Does anyone need a clarification on what that means?

Thanks for any advice. There is no internet access allowed at that plant. Actually, not much IS allowed there.

M-250
 
Start Here

http://www.ab.com/logix/controllogix/

The Laptop will need RSLogix 5000 for control logix (demo available here - http://www.ab.com/en/epub/catalogs/12762/2181376/2416247/360807/1837528/tab4.html)

For Devicenet http://www.ab.com/networks/devicenet.html we use RSNetworx for devicenet

For Controlnet http://www.ab.com/networks/controlnet.html we use RSNetworx for Controlnet

You will also need RSLinx

But i think THEY (Your Employer) would need to get someone in and PAY to sort this one out !

Why did All their help leave ?

Why is there is no documentation, no manuals, no support from the local distributor ?

Even if the hardware was bought out of state surely you would still have support ?
 
Wow, I feel for you. Are you a outside consultant or an employee of the same company that work in another plant? You need a new job anyway if you are an employee and they treat you like that. Where is your boss ?!

You might still be able to get Rockwell support if the software is new and registered to your company. However, they can not do a startup for you.

--sounds like they got *other* problems than just a non-functioning control system.

Also, tell us what experience you do have in PLC and control network.
 
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Wow, Maverick, that's not a great sounding assignment. My recommendation is to treat it like a on-the-job-training project and not like a startup, because it's not. Startups have planning, tools, and technology involved, and this sounds mostly like it has panic and stupidity. Don't let those be your guide.

ControlLogix is a PLC-type controller; you'll have CPUs, and network cards, and I/O card in modular chassis. As previous posters have mentioned, you're going to find RSLogix 5000 programming software, RSLinx communication driver software, and RSNetworx network configuration software.

Since the plant doesn't have Internet access, get out the phone book and start looking under "R" for Rockwell.... you're going to need the help of your local Rockwell office to get through this. It won't be cheap, but they have guys (like me) whose living is made fixing other people's control system engineering oversights.
 
One hurdle you are going to have to overcome is internet access. AB has an excellent online library and the fact is you are going to have to have access to it. Even if you had all the printed manuals you are going to encounter problems where you will find the solution in the online tech notes. If the management cannot see that then I'm afraid your task is going to be rediculously difficult, and they (the management and the entire company) will suffer. They have to understand that it will cause compounding delays that affect the bottom line and it is in their own best interest to equip you with the tools you will need, and that means access to the internet.

The controllogix is a great platform, but it does some things differently from what you are probably used to. Right off the bat you'll encounter tag bassed variables instead of addressed data registers. You do not assign an address to internal tags, you just give it a name and data type and the compiler does the rest. You'll have four different programming languages at your disposal. And you will be able to create custom data structures. I suggest you have a look at the links that 504bloke gave you.

Good luck.
 
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Sounds like you're going in cleaning up after a battle.

First thing I would do is inventory for the tools you need and what tools you need to get.

1. Are there hardware drawings? Do a floor check and collect any drawings that have changes marked up on them.

2. What devices exist that need programming support? HMIs, PLCs, SMCs, etc.

3. Is there anyone left in the organization that has any knowledge of the equipment? Make sure they are available when you have questions.

4. Try to be as thorough and organized as you can, even if it takes a little extra time.

5. Try to avoid knee-jerk reactions when problems arise. This will set the tone for others on how you work in the future.

Good luck. I have to say I don't envy your situation.
 
Sheesh!! If things turn out the way you describe this job has one monstrous red flag pinned on it! Just a few months ago I was caught out badly on a job where I was subcontracting to a global supplier who needed some local assistance for about 10 days. Due to a total disconnect between the customer's expectations and those conveyed to me by the supplier I finished up feeling rather badly treated at the end of it.

In a nutshell I would strongly advise that you negotiate upfront and in writing the terms you determine will be reasonably require to get your assignment done effectively. Anything less will rebound on you. Over and again us technical types get suckered into agreeing to "save the day" but the consequence in the real world in that we finish up doing ourselves no favours.

Even though I know Contrologix and Devicenet very well, the circumstances you describe raise my eyebrows.
 
Here's the 'Marvin the paranoid android' take on the situation.

It sounds like you're being set up to take the fall for a project gone sour. You can quit now and spare yourself the aggravation or beat your head against a wall for a few weeks and then get fired.
 
I'm with Steve. Especially if 'they' is your boss.

If I heard that from my boss I'd probably feel the way I felt the first day at work following the drunken Christmas party...
 
I wish that I could do something more constructive for you than just write pessimistic postings on PLCS.net. In a nutshell; you are so far beyond screwed that the light from screwed won't reach you 'til July. You're being asked to learn a new controller, a new network and application code in a day; that can't be done and you should tell your management that it can't (in writing). Go onsite, give it your best shot (it could be as simple as a loose contact, I'm never that lucky but you may have led a blameless life) but set everybodys' expectations low. On the upside; ControlLogix code is, to a limited extent, self-documenting in that the names of the data areas are downloaded to the CPU. As long as whoever wrote the code used meaningful names....... On the downside; there may be no ladder code at all in the application, it may be SFC, FBD or ST.

Ken's advice is really sound; get Rockwell involved. It's not their fault but they've got the product knowledge which will make life a lot easier. It won't be inexpensive (neither would any other PLC company) but if you're cost measuring versus lost production then it'll be cheap.

Good luck and best wishes.
 
Maverick 250 said:
Their reply was "are you saying that you are declining your assigned work assignment".

M-250

Steve is exactly right. I watched this happen to a peer of mine who hadn't structured himself to compete politically in the envoirment we were in. Who would think you could just go in, do your job, not play any games and leave?

You are in, what is called "a Fork".

If you are an honorable man:
In the next 6 mos you will be fired for incompetence because you didn't perform per their schedule and budget...or
Insubordination for
Maverick 250 said:
"declining your assigned work assignment". M-250

If you are not an honorable man:
There may be more than 2 tines on your fork and they will never see it coming.
 
Get us your information as you can and we can help you. Call 402-990-5311 (me, David Gulick) when you are in front of it and describe what you have, AND what the actual problems you are facing in this situation. I will help you as I can. I am currently on a Factory Acceptance Test, with a little extra time, so I might be able to give you the help you need.


If it is the devicenet network, then there are ways to determine what is wrong without having to be online with the PLC.

Good Luck

David
 
got your resume polished up? ...

first of all, I don't mean to discourage you ... but my carefully considered advice is:

RUN! ... RUN LIKE THE WIND! ...

seriously ... all of us will help you as much as we can ... BUT ... if you can't communicate with us on a timely basis, then there's not much that we'll be able to do for you ... but we'll still try ... be sure to give us actual catalog numbers, etc. and as much detail as possible each time you post ...

this is sort of like a bad movie where a passenger takes control of the plane and the tower talks him through a landing ... only thing is, the guys in the tower aren’t going to be able to talk to you (no Internet access) ...


several respected members have encouraged you to enlist the local Allen-Bradley people ... you've already mentioned that the equipment was purchased outside of their service area (comment aside: that's NOT a good plan folks) ... even so, Rockwell (one level up from the local distributor) does have field reps available for a $PRICE$ ... find out what (if any) budget is available for that type of resource ...

please register (it will be much easier to post attachments, etc.) and then keep us updated on how this turns out ... frankly (with all of the handicaps you're facing) I don't see how you're going to come out the hero on this one ... but I sincerely hope that I'm wrong ... good luck ... you'll need it ...

and by the way ... where (just in general terms) is this nightmare job located? ...

PS edit: and I just thought of something else ... print this thread and show it to your local taskmaster ... maybe it will at least help him understand what's involved in this project ...
 
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NOP said:
You're being asked to learn a new controller, a new network and application code in a day

. . . and likely new hardware, wiring that may not be wrung out, components that may not be specified and/or installed correctly, documentation that may not exist, etc.

NOP said:
that can't be done and you should tell your management that it can't (in writing).

As said by others in this thread, document what you are being asked to do and your realistic expectations IN WRITING before you go onsite and try to work miracles. Give them the worst case scenarios ("I've never seen any of the components so I may not be familiar with them. They may have been selected, installed, and maintained improperly. I've never seen the code in the processor, it may not be usable. I've never worked with this hardware, so I will likely need extensive access to outside experts . . .), and then close with something like "but I'll do my darndest to do what is best for the company . . . "



Then get your resume up to date.

Good luck,

Marc
 
Maverick,

There's good news and bad news. The good news is that my work suddenly seems so much easier after reading your post. The bad news is that you're in the poo.

My advice would be to just do your best. No-one can blame you for anything if you've at least given it your best shot.

I wish you all the luck in the world with it, but remember that it was poor management both in attitude and deed that got THEM into this mess. This nightmare isn't your doing.

All the very best mate...

JT

PS. There is another bit of good news... in your situation, you couldn't have stumbled across a better website. The guys (and galls) on here have dug me out of many a hole over the years...
 

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