Using Point I/O with a CompactLogix 5370 controller

I'm using Point I/O expansion I/O with a CompactLogix 5370 controller, part # 1769-L16ER-BB1B. Specifically three Point I/O modules: 1734-IB8, 1734-IE2C & 1734-OE2C.

When I add the modules (I'm using RSLogix5000 V20.01.00 (CPR 9 SR 5)), it asks for the Series and Revision of the modules. The IB8's paper label says it's Series D revision 3.22 but in the software, the only series available to me is Series C. Is this important? I'm told that if I use the 'compatible module' option for the Electronic Keying setting that it will work fine. Is there a way I can get the software to give me the option of correctly specifying a series D rev 3.22 module in the configuration?

I'm quite sure the series doesn't matter that much for digital input module. Also, you can try to upgrade your V20 to V20.04 as pointed out by a prior thread.

http://theautomationblog.com/rslogix-5000-version-20-04-released/

I'm told that if I use the 'compatible module' option for the Electronic Keying setting that it will work fine.

Click to expand...

Exactly correct.

There were some issues with very old pre-Series C modules and the 5370 family controllers or the 1734-AENT Series B, but for the Series C and Series D modules you are concerned with, just select Compatible Module and they will work.

technolog said:

...the only series available to me is Series C. Is this important? I'm told that if I use the 'compatible module' option for the Electronic Keying setting that it will work fine...

Click to expand...

That would be good advice...

509513 - Cannot add 1734-IB8 series D module to I/O configuration
Access Level: TechConnect

For the module's you've listed, and many others, RSLogix 5000 V20.01 installs and uses Add-On Profile v7.00.2578.0. This AOP does not support some of the newer series of modules, but with this AOP you can configure the 1734-IB8 Series D as a Series C if you use Compatible Keying and it should work just fine. This can also be said for many of the other newer series of modules defined under this AOP.

technolog said:

...Is there a way I can get the software to give me the option of correctly specifying a series D rev 3.22 module in the configuration?

Click to expand...

AOP v7.00.2578.0 is installed up as far as Studio 5000 v23.00. Studio 5000 v24.00 introduced its successor, namely AOP v8.01.1.0, which has been available since 2013. This AOP provides native support for the newer series modules.

You can download this AOP and many others by going here...

Software Downloads

...and selecting "RSLogix 5000 Add-On-Profiles".

You may have to log in and if you don't currently have an account it's free to register.

Search the list for "1734-IB2/4/8 / 8.01.01 / 2013/10/08".

If you install this AOP then you should be able to use Exact Match for these modules in RSLogix 5000 v20.01.

Regards,
George

Thanks all but especially George for that detailed answer. I'm at home at the moment but will try your solution tomorrow.

I followed the procedure - downloading the suggested module profile, extracting the files then executing the MPSetup.exe file.

Unfortunately now, in the Module Properties dialog, I've lost any mention of the series of the module (other than the label "Series:". When I click the Change... button the series information is missing completely - not even the label remains. I've attached a screenshot.

I closed Logix5000 before performing the upgrade and I've subsequently rebooted but the problem remains. I didn't run MPSetup.exe as administrator. Could that be the issue?

Can anyone offer a solution to my botched 'add-on profile' installation?

I've tried running the MPSetup.exe again, this time with administrator privileges but it won't let me re-apply the same update. Also the uninstall option is grayed out.

Well, does it work now? Does the label show up for other cards, if so, it may not matter.

I've just realized that it's only the 1734-IB8 modules that are missing the series information. These are the one that are series D revision 3.022. If I were a betting man, I'd say the add-on profile (8.01.001) I applied doesn't include these recent revisions. Going to have a bit of a dig on the Rockwell site...

OK my friend,

With some experimenting done, here is what I have found...

I had originally said that the older AOP v7.00.2578.0 does not support some of the newer modules. This is partly correct in that it does not provide you with the newer Series selection under a module's properties. However, this is not really important. What is more important is that it supports the newer module's firmware revisions, if you want to set Electronic Keying to Exact Match. For this, it does.

The Series of a module defines hardware specific changes only. This could be a change in a component used inside, or better electrical insulation, or better noise immunity, for instance. It is not relevant to the Electronic Keying. This is more firmware dependent.

If Electronic Keying is set to Exact Match, then the firmware revision of the module must match the firmware revision set in the module's properties in RSLogix 5000/Logix Designer.

I have RSLogix 5000 v20.01 installed on one of the programming workstations. It still has the original AOP v7.00.2578.0 for the 1734 Discrete I/O modules. I also have on the desk a 1769-L16ER-BB1B Ser B and a 1734-IB8 Ser D Rev 3.22, which is similar to your setup.

I have added the 1734-IB8 module to the I/O Configuration in a blank project for the L16ER. In this AOP version I can see the Series and it is C. Series C is the only option, no Series D. This is what you could see before upgrading the AOP.

The default under the General tab when you add the module is Series C Revision 3.1 with Electronic Keying set to Compatible Module.

With Electronic Keying set to Exact Match, and the program downloaded to the controller, the module shows with a Yellow warning triangle under the I/O Configuration.

When you open the module's properties, you will see at the bottom of the General tab...

Status: Firmware Updating

Because Exact Match is set, and the firmware revisions do not match (3.1/3.22), it is trying to automatically update the module's firmware to the correct revision. If you go to the Connection tab you will see, under Module Fault, two toggling fault messages...

(Code 16#fe10) Automatic Firmware Update failed. Firmware file not found.

...and...

(Code 16#fe116) Electronic Keying Mismatch. Major and/or Minor revision invalid or incorrect.

These will just keep toggling as it continuously attempts to update the firmware.

Notice how it just refers to the firmware revision being a mismatch. It does not care about the module's Series being mismatched.

Now if you go back to the General tab and select Change and increment the revision from 3.1 to 3.22 and apply the change. You should now see the Status at the bottom saying Validating...Connecting...and then...Running. This can be too fast to see sometimes, but it will end up at Status: Running. The Yellow warning triangle should also disappear for the module under the I/O Configuration.

The firmware revisions are now an Exact Match and all is well. It is still showing as a Series C, although it is actually a Series D, but it does not matter to the Electronic Keying.

This is a before and after configuration for Exact Match Keying for a 1734-IB8 under AOP v7.00.2578.0...



So in hindsight, you could have used Compatible Module, as we advised you to earlier, or for Exact Match, you could have set the firmware revision to 3.22, while still using the old AOP.

You need not have upgraded the AOP just to use Exact Match, as I had advised you to do at the end of my last post. However, it is no harm that you have upgraded to AOP v8.01.1.0...

Now that you know that the Series does not matter either way you can ignore the fact that the Series is not even listed under this AOP version. So similarly, just use Compatible Module, or set the firmware revision to 3.22 for Exact Match.

But why is the Series missing for this newer AOP?

From the installation notes for AOP v8.01.1.0...

Rockwell Automation 1734 Point
I/O Configuration Profile Installation Release Notes

......

Revision History

......

12/2012 (8.01.001)
• Removed series

......

Click to expand...

...and also here...

635967 - 1734-IB8 Add-On Profile without the series information
Access Level: TechConnect

I'm sorry Rockwell, I have to post this...

Question

I have installed the new AOP ( Add-On Profile) for the 1734-IB8 series D module. And the Series tab has disappeared.

Environment

RSLogix 5000 V20.01

Answer

The Point I/O Discrete and Analog Add-On Instruction revision 8.01.001 has removed the series information for the modules.

The 1734-IB8 module (series C and D) is managed by AOP rev. 8.01.1.0 as well as by rev. 7.00.2578.0 in 'Compatible Module'.

.......

Comments (1)
CARLES
09/28/2015 08:48 AM
I can't find the AOP rev. 8.01.1.0

Click to expand...

Rockwell, they make it hard to like them, but easy to loathe them...

AOP v8.01.001 and v8.01.1.0 are one and the same. The technote is badly worded. It suggests that 8.01.001 removes the Series and that to use the 1734-IB8 series C/D modules you must use v8.01.1.0, implying it is "something else".

Really what they are saying is...

1. AOP v8.01.001 (v8.01.1.0) removes the Series completely.

2. AOP v8.01.001 (v8.01.1.0) will handle the 1734-IB8 Series C/D, as will AOP v7.00.2578.0, regardless of point 1.

3. AOP v7.00.2578.0 will only handle the 1734-IB8 using Compatible Module Keying (which is not correct as I have proven that you can use AOP v7.00.2578.0 with Exact Match Keying if the firmware revisions are matching).

So, it appears at this version of the AOP they decided to remove the reference to the Series altogether?...

Hmm, maybe this was a good move, right?...

If the Series only relates to hardware changes and is not relevant to the Keying, and seems to add so much confusion and annoyance to the perfectionists, then why have it there at all?...

OK, that all seems to make sense?...

But that's not the end of it...

AOP v7.00.2578.0 was used all the way up to Studio 5000 v23.

AOP v8.01.1.0 was released with Studio 5000 v24, which introduced the "no Series" feature. For anyone who has v24 as their highest installed software version, they "should" not have a Series displayed for any modules defined under this AOP.

I have v24 installed, but it is not the highest version. I also have v26 and v27. I actually have all Studio 5000 versions installed. For me, when I open a v24 project and add a 1734-IB8, I DO have a Series displayed.

Why?...

Because Module Profiles (AOP) are global to your programming workstation and not individual to the different versions of software. So this means my v24 projects use whatever AOP is currently installed and not what it originally installed.

So what is installed for me and why have I got a Series again?...

At Studio 5000 v26 they released yet another newer version, AOP v8.02.4.0. This is still in use through to v27 (latest at time of writing). The v26 installation upgraded AOP v8.01.1.0 to AOP v8.02.4.0. This version "seems" to have reinstated the Series and wouldn't you know it, it is still only available as Series C, no Series D. This is why my v24 project will display the Series.

But why the heck did they remove the Series for one AOP version, under one Studio 5000 version, and then reinstate it at the next version, and not even include the newer Series as a selection to keep the perfectionists happy?

I just cannot figure this one out? There must have been some anomaly or they had to make a u-turn in their thinking?

Anyway, all that is somewhat academic as we know that whether you want to use Compatible Module, or Exact Match, the Series is not all that important (except to the perfectionists!).

So my conclusion on the above is that whatever Series you are, or are not seeing for a module's properties, should not matter to the Keying. Only the firmware revision should be considered.

Another small point to make before I go...

technolog said:

I've just realized that it's only the 1734-IB8 modules that are missing the series information...

Click to expand...

Different groups of modules, or types of modules, use different module profiles. The 1734-IB8 falls under the group "RA DIO Discrete". The AOPs v7.00.2578.0, v8.01.1.0 and v8.02.04.0 are all versions of packaged AOPs which define all the modules that fall within the "RA DIO Discrete" group. For your 1734-IB8 discrete module, you currently have AOP v8.01.1.0 installed. The installation notes have specifically stated that the Series has been removed for this AOP version.

Your other two specific modules, the 1734-IE2C & 1734-OE2C, are analog modules and fall within the "RA DIO Analog" group. The AOP used for these modules will be different to the one used for the "RA DIO Discrete" group. The latest available for this analog group is AOP v7.01.14.0. Its installation notes make no reference to the series being removed at any stage for this AOP version.

So at your current AOP versions, your POINT I/O Discrete modules should have no Series displayed, whereas your Analog modules should.

There are many, many different module profiles installed with each version of RSLogix 5000/Logix Designer. They are all at different versions to each other and may have different settings for similar features.

You should try to bear this in mind when thinking about differences you are experience with modules and their properties.

Regards,
George

Sometimes someone's generosity of spirit takes your breath away. I can't believe you went to that amount of trouble for a complete stranger. Thank you very much!

So basically, I can carry on regardless, everything's fine?

One last question on this topic (and I'm fairly confident of the answer); so to set the revision to 3.022, I set the major revision to 3 and the minor revision to 22 and not 220?

You are very welcome, but as much as it was to help you, it was also to help myself. The equipment on my desk is for an actual project and your issue tweaked my interest as to what was actually going on here. I would have just used Compatible Module and not worried about Exact Match, as I normally do, but me being me I do like to get to the bottom of things, when I have the time.

I was curious as to whether, by Studio 5000 v27, they had provided an AOP or AOPs that actually allow you to select the current Series, such as D, or give you multiple options. They have not. Even if they just gave users a "dumb" selection to keep them happy, it would then allow them to get on with their day's work.

It appears as though they decided to remove the Series at v8.01.1.0 altogether, but you would think this would mean all references to it? You can still see the text "Series" on the General tab with no actual info, which is just more confusing to users.

Anyway, I'll not spend any more time on this one.

technolog said:

...One last question on this topic (and I'm fairly confident of the answer); so to set the revision to 3.022, I set the major revision to 3 and the minor revision to 22 and not 220?

Click to expand...

The major revision is fixed at "3" for the 1734-IB8 so you can only change the minor revision, or at least that's how it is for me. If it's somehow different for you then do let me know?

In the older AOP v7.00.2578.0 the minor revision field does not use leading zeroes and has a range of "1 - 255". So for the default of "3.001" you will see the minor revision set to "1". This then displays as "3.1" back on the General tab. For "3.022" you would set it to "22" and then it will display as "3.22".

In keeping with the proper firmware revision numerical representation they made a slight change...

For the newer AOPs, v8.01.1.0 and v8.02.04.0, the leading zeroes were added to the minor revision to make the appearance of your selections reflect the same as you would see on the module. Example "FW 3.022". So now you have a range of "001 - 255". So for the default "3.001" you will see the minor revision set to "001". If you set "220" this would be minor revision two hundred and twenty, or "3.220", which is of course a highly unlikely number to ever be reached. So for minor revision 22, under the newer AOPs, you would set "022". This is then displayed as "3.022" back on the General tab, which matches the firmware number exactly as it is on the hardware.

p.s. I also noticed my embedded Dropbox link is not working above so here is the shared link instead...

https://www.dropbox.com/s/256pzyree39xthu/Series_Not_Relevant_To_Electronic_Keying.bmp?dl=0

That example is using the older AOP v7.00.2578.0 and so you do not have the leading zeroes.

Regards,
George

Here is an example of the leading zeroes using Studio 5000 v27 and AOP v8.02.04.0...

Here is an example of the no leading zeroes using RSLogix 5000 v20 and AOP v7.00.2578.0...