You are not registered yet. Please click here to register!


 
 
plc storereviewsdownloads
This board is for PLC Related Q&A ONLY. Please DON'T use it for advertising, etc.
 
Try our online PLC Simulator- FREE.  Click here now to try it.

---------->>>>>Get FREE PLC Programming Tips

New Here? Please read this important info!!!


Go Back   PLCS.net - Interactive Q & A > PLCS.net - Interactive Q & A > LIVE PLC Questions And Answers

PLC training tools sale

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old November 28th, 2017, 10:45 PM   #1
kalabdel
Member
Canada

kalabdel is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Ontario
Posts: 351
What are:Single-Rotation and Pole-Changing motors?

Hello everyone,

In the attached motor wiring there are three different types of motors shown, being: 1-Single-rotation motors, Pole-Changing motors and Dual-Voltage motors. Dual voltage I understand, the other two I don't.

Single rotation means I can not change the motor direction of rotation by switching two of the phases?
Also in the wrining shwon isn't the single-rotaion motor also dual voltage Wye and Delta?

Pole-Changing changes the motor speed? How does that work?


Edit:

One more question, what is temperature monitoring or rather how is it implemented in the motor? There's a small terminal block in the junction box that is marked R1 and R2 where do they connect to inside the motor and how are they used in c control circuit?

Thanks
Kal
Attached Files
File Type: pdf MotorWiring.pdf (168.0 KB, 55 views)
File Type: pdf CurrentMonitoring.pdf (192.0 KB, 35 views)

Last edited by kalabdel; November 28th, 2017 at 11:20 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2017, 03:46 AM   #2
Rob...
Supporting Member
United Kingdom

Rob... is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Manchester
Posts: 142
Single rotation motor, from what I can see on that drawing is just a normal 3 phase squirrel cage motor. You can change the direction by swapping 2 phases.

Pole changing motors, from what it looks like and what I've worked on before, dependent on how you wire the motor at it's terminals dictated how many poles the winding have. So effectively its a duel speed motor.

R1 and R2 will be wired to some form of thermistor embedded in the motor winding's. Wire to a thermistor protection relay, this will trigger when the motor winding gets hot. If wired into the control circuit properly, it should stop the motor before irreversible winding damage has happened.
  Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2017, 07:16 AM   #3
kalabdel
Member
Canada

kalabdel is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Ontario
Posts: 351
Thanks Rob.
  Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2017, 08:07 AM   #4
jrwb4gbm
Lifetime Supporting Member + Moderator
United States

jrwb4gbm is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: NC
Posts: 2,225
Single rotation motors may be referring to a motor with a mechanical device built into it to keep it from rotating in the opposite direction. An example might be a large deep well pump motor with threaded shaft couplings.
  Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2017, 08:42 PM   #5
kalabdel
Member
Canada

kalabdel is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Ontario
Posts: 351
Thanks jrwb4gbm.
  Reply With Quote
Old December 4th, 2017, 04:37 PM   #6
shooter
Member
Netherlands

shooter is offline
 
shooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: duketown
Posts: 2,653
single rotation means, only one speed, but two directions,pole changing means the number of poles can be changed, meaning it has more speeds.
dual voltage means it can run on two voltages with same power.
wye is running with only 1/3 of power. .
__________________
shooter@home.nl
skype shooter paul.deelen
Computer Shooter
Paul Deelen
J. Wassenaerstraat 29
NL 5224 GG 's-Hertogenbosch
+31653300739
  Reply With Quote
Old December 5th, 2017, 01:08 PM   #7
kalabdel
Member
Canada

kalabdel is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Ontario
Posts: 351
Thanks shooter. I emailed Lenze tech support and below is what they had to say. Has anyone ever needed to wire a motor so that it can be used with both high and low voltages?

Me:In one of your motor manuals I read a reference to a single rotation motor (see attachment) but I couldn't find a explanation as to what it actually is. I would appreciate a description of the function of a single rotation motor.

Lenze: Single rotation motors means that it can only run off low (208/230/265V) OR high voltage (400/480V) at a time. To change between low and high voltage, you will have to change the dog bones bridges in the terminal block connection as shown in the diagram in the attached document.

Me:

Thanks. These are the motors I'm familiar with but I take it that means that there are motors that can be wired to be used for high and low voltages? Do you have a manual or product catalogue of those motors?


Lenze: Lenze only offer single rotation motors in our current portfolio. We do not offer pole changing motors or dual voltage motors anymore.






  Reply With Quote
Old December 5th, 2017, 04:09 PM   #8
ASF
Lifetime Supporting Member
Australia

ASF is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,668
I suspect that demand for dual speed/dual voltage motors is dwindling rapidly these days. There's quite a lot of control circuitry involved in making one work, and with the price of VSD's getting ever lower, there's probably very few applications where it's worth the effort.
  Reply With Quote
Old December 6th, 2017, 11:10 AM   #9
Mara
Member
Finland

Mara is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Finland
Posts: 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by ASF View Post
I suspect that demand for dual speed/dual voltage motors is dwindling rapidly these days.
Don't know about dual voltage motors but pole change motors are still very common in crane applications.
  Reply With Quote
Old December 6th, 2017, 04:24 PM   #10
ASF
Lifetime Supporting Member
Australia

ASF is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,668
That's true - probably one application where they'll hold onto relevance for a while longer.
  Reply With Quote
Old December 7th, 2017, 02:57 PM   #11
just the cowboy
Member
United States

just the cowboy is offline
 
just the cowboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Pa
Posts: 264
Reduced voltage

Quote:
Originally Posted by kalabdel View Post
Thanks shooter. I emailed Lenze tech support and below is what they had to say. Has anyone ever needed to wire a motor so that it can be used with both high and low voltages?

Me:In one of your motor manuals I read a reference to a single rotation motor (see attachment) but I couldn't find a explanation as to what it actually is. I would appreciate a description of the function of a single rotation motor.

Lenze: Single rotation motors means that it can only run off low (208/230/265V) OR high voltage (400/480V) at a time. To change between low and high voltage, you will have to change the dog bones bridges in the terminal block connection as shown in the diagram in the attached document.

Me:
Thanks. These are the motors I'm familiar with but I take it that means that there are motors that can be wired to be used for high and low voltages? Do you have a manual or product catalogue of those motors?


Lenze: Lenze only offer single rotation motors in our current portfolio. We do not offer pole changing motors or dual voltage motors anymore.
The dual voltage motor is Wye/delta reduced voltage starting motor. It uses wye connections for starting then switchs over to delta connection for running
__________________
Work safe, have fun, don't die
  Reply With Quote
Old December 7th, 2017, 03:39 PM   #12
kalabdel
Member
Canada

kalabdel is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Ontario
Posts: 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by just the cowboy View Post
The dual voltage motor is Wye/delta reduced voltage starting motor. It uses wye connections for starting then switchs over to delta connection for running
Oh, I see. That makes sense.

Cheers
Kal
  Reply With Quote
Old December 9th, 2017, 10:53 AM   #13
shooter
Member
Netherlands

shooter is offline
 
shooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: duketown
Posts: 2,653
A normal dual voltage has 6 windings, instead of 3 so it just has more connections.
And yes there are also motors that run with only 3 windings, however this is not really dual voltage as the voltage must be root 3
__________________
shooter@home.nl
skype shooter paul.deelen
Computer Shooter
Paul Deelen
J. Wassenaerstraat 29
NL 5224 GG 's-Hertogenbosch
+31653300739
  Reply With Quote
Reply
Jump to Live PLC Question and Answer Forum

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:26 PM.


.