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Old October 16th, 2018, 03:10 PM   #31
bert123
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Originally Posted by JordanCClark View Post
Unfortunately, the majority of the "homework posts" fall into the "just show me the code" category, without displaying any hint of what they have tried. I see in your original post that you had some extra information there than what we normally see, so to you, my young friend, I say bravo!

You'll also notice that we tend to derail threads away from the original context, but don't hold that against us. It also happens when we see something shiny.

For future homework questions, let us know it's homework, give us what you think the answer is (or show what you've done so far, if it's a program question), and we'll be happy to point you in the right direction.
Oh okay, I understand. Next time I have a question on PLCs and it's linked to homework I'll be sure to point that out. Thank you all for the help.
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Old October 16th, 2018, 08:50 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by bert123 View Post
Oh okay, I understand. Next time I have a question on PLCs and it's linked to homework I'll be sure to point that out. Thank you all for the help.
I've spent a lot of time learning what I know and I have several reasons why I won't "give it away" to someone in school but the main reason is I don't want someone out in the automation world who doesn't know what they are doing. It's not fair to those of us who have put our time in and more importantly it's dangerous.

The point of it is that most of us are very happy to help someone learn whether or not they are a student but when someone just wants the answer so they don't have to do the work then that's where most of us will draw the line. We get nothing out of it nor does the person looking for the short way out. If they want to cheat on their homework I'd rather they go work at McDonalds and leave the PLC programming to someone who really knows what they are doing. Having said all of that, if you have a question that is homework related then yes, tell us that is what is going on and show us what you have done so far. Everybody needs help but not a free ride.
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Old October 16th, 2018, 09:07 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by busarider29 View Post
Okay, so in three posts, you went from they are all still here and supported, no problems and what am I talking about, to now just the 5/05 (Ethernet) is here and going?? Make up your mind, are the SLCs available and fully supported or not?? If its just the Ethernet (5/05), then say that. And if you say "for a long time" how long is that? Next year or two?? And No, I won't stop. The SLC platform is systematically being obsoleted. Take a look at their Product Life Cycle page and type in "1746". Almost all products listed are either at the end-of-life or "mature" and newer product available, aka CompactLogix. And what about the software - RSLogix500? Is that still supported and available, and for how much longer?

https://www.rockwellautomation.com/g.../overview.page
What geniusintraining is saying (and rather clearly) is that while there are some of the SLC products that are obsolete and others that are "mature" that doesn't equate to "the SLC platform is obsolete and no longer supported by AB". He is correct in saying that it is simply not true. You can say the same thing about the MicroLogix, CompactLogix and and ControlLogix lines. They all have products in them that are obsolete and in "mature" status but the lines themselves are still around. Rockwell is very careful in retiring products and if the SLC5/05 is still on the available list then itís not going anywhere any time soon.
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Old October 16th, 2018, 09:54 PM   #34
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Interesting link, https://www.rockwellautomation.com/g.../overview.page
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Old October 17th, 2018, 03:48 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by geniusintraining View Post
Yes we do. (a lot)
What your talking about has nothing to do with SLC 5/05's, ControlLogix are not SLC's
I have not idea what you are talking about
The quote below is quite encompassing stating that Ethernet is here and to be supported and I presented a situation where it isn't.
Yes, the conversation is about SLC's, but Ethernet comms doesn't mean that all of a sudden everything with an Ethernet port will work together.

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All the older protocols are going away but Ethernet is here for a long time and will be supported and sold
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Old October 17th, 2018, 03:57 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by cardosocea View Post
I have a CLX with Ethernet... I can even buy ethernet cards for it too and guess what?? I can't use Point IO (an Ethernet based Field IO) with it.
Why? The CPU firmware can only be upgraded to version X, but Point IO is only available from X+2 or something like that.
Not being an expert in Ethernet/IP and not wanting to derail this thread, but...
Cant you import an EDS file into the configuration of the 'old' PLC to work with the 'new' IO ?
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Old October 17th, 2018, 07:49 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Firejo View Post
What geniusintraining is saying (and rather clearly) is that while there are some of the SLC products that are obsolete and others that are "mature" that doesn't equate to "the SLC platform is obsolete and no longer supported by AB". He is correct in saying that it is simply not true. You can say the same thing about the MicroLogix, CompactLogix and and ControlLogix lines. They all have products in them that are obsolete and in "mature" status but the lines themselves are still around. Rockwell is very careful in retiring products and if the SLC5/05 is still on the available list then it’s not going anywhere any time soon.
No, it was not entirely clear what he was saying until his second or third post. But I get it, you AB guys (Good Ol' boys?) gotta back each other up through and through.

Now, what you are saying here in your post IS very clear. It appears I misspoke in my original post. The SLC is still available and supported by AB, although only the 5/05 processor for sure. Anything on 5/04, just curious as we have several of those here in our shop? Still, for a new system, its just downright silly to spend $3k-5k for outdated technology that is, yes IS, on its way out. Besides the outrageous cost and outdated technology, the SLC platform is low performance compared to many modern controls system platforms in the same class. I'd buy one of those cheap *** P2000 PLC's from Automation Direct before I went with a new SLC. Although my preferred choice would be something from Beckhoff as I'd be more than willing to spend a bit more money for what they have to offer.

Like his vague statement in claiming that the SLC will be around and available "for a long time", yours is just as vague where you're claiming "its not going anywhere anytime soon". What does that mean? Is that a year....two....ten....what?? The answer is - No one knows for sure, not even AB. Also, the question still stands - What about the software, RSLogix500?? All in all, stacking it all up, its just not worth it (money, low performance, and risk) to invest in the SLC at this time in its life. Just my opinion of course.

Last edited by busarider29; October 17th, 2018 at 07:56 AM.
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Old October 17th, 2018, 08:03 AM   #38
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The fact of the matter is that there are a TON of SLC500's still out there. Yes, the hardware is expensive because it isn't produced anymore, but when it comes down to spending 3500 on a processor vs having to have a controls engineer update your entire system for 50k or more, what are you going to do? Of course, you are going to replace your part and move on.

Every brand has theirs ups and downs, and there is no AB "good ole boys" club. It is all about what platform you can economically complete the job with. Also, that cheap P2000 happens to be a pretty robust platform with great software and support.
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Old October 17th, 2018, 08:26 AM   #39
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The fact of the matter is that there are a TON of SLC500's still out there. Yes, the hardware is expensive because it isn't produced anymore, but when it comes down to spending 3500 on a processor vs having to have a controls engineer update your entire system for 50k or more, what are you going to do? Of course, you are going to replace your part and move on.

Every brand has theirs ups and downs, and there is no AB "good ole boys" club. It is all about what platform you can economically complete the job with. Also, that cheap P2000 happens to be a pretty robust platform with great software and support.
For an existing system, yes, in most cases, it makes more sense to spend $$$ on a replacement part and move on. Of course, AB knows this, and that is just one way on how they rape you with the cost. Because they know you'll pay it to keep your line up and running. Heck, they could charge $10k for a SLC 5/05 processor and 9 out 10 companies would pay it to keep their line running. Probably the only reason AB doesn't charge that is in order to not cross that proper ethics boundary. They ride all the way up to the hairy edge of that boundary though. Charge as much as possible without crossing the boundary. This is about a new system though, not an existing. Give me one very good reason why anyone would spend the money and put forth the risk on a new SLC platform for a new machine/production line?? Why??

I'm sure the P2000 system is a robust system, even though I've never worked with one. But that's just my point, I'd go with one of those for a new system before I invested in a new SLC. Again, give me one very good reason to go with a new SLC over a new P2000 from Automation Direct? I posed this question straight up to three Rockwell Automation sales guys when we were looking at the Beckhoff platform. Why do I need to go with the AB platform (ControlLogix) in lieu of Beckhoff? They sat there for about 3 seconds with these blank looks on their faces and then all they had to play was the "support" card, claiming they had more support. Well, needless to say they lost that sale, which in the end cost them a boat load of $$$ in sales because we standardized to Beckhoff with all new machine builds after that.

Last edited by busarider29; October 17th, 2018 at 09:12 AM.
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Old October 17th, 2018, 09:49 AM   #40
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My point was and is you can't just put a general statement like below because its wrong period.

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Originally Posted by busarider29 View Post
As others have stated, the SLC platform is obsolete and no longer supported by AB. I hate having to invest in old technology but in a lot of cases, changing platforms is not an option.
From your last post maybe you should of just wrote "I hate Allen Bradley and you should use anything but" then I would not of even said anything
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Old October 17th, 2018, 10:03 AM   #41
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From your last post maybe you should of just wrote "I hate Allen Bradley and you should use anything but" then I would not of even said anything
I don't hate AB but they surely are never my first choice for a myriad of reasons. I can provide a list if you care to see know. But you being an AB guy, I'm sure you don't care to see or hear anything knocking your precious AB. Stick your head in the sand and all is good, right? Look, like many of us here in the states, I was brought up on AB and taught "AB is King" of all. But then I did my own research, performance comparisons, price, etc...to other platforms and to my shock, I learned that all that was taught to me was not true at all. AB is not the best. Not by a long shot.

So again, third or fourth time now.....for a new system, why would one go with the AB platform in lieu of "X-platform" that is in many cases better performing and lower cost (much lower cost)? The Rockwell sales guys had no good answer. Maybe you do?
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Old October 17th, 2018, 10:31 AM   #42
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But you being an AB guy, I'm sure you don't care to see or hear anything knocking your precious AB.
Can I ask why you think I am a AB guy? I sell every brand under the sun on our website... I could care less what the name is, I have wrote programs and troubleshoot every PLC made, you really need to think about your statements before you say them and back to my first point, you made a statement that was wrong and I point it out, if you said it about any brand and it was wrong I would of still told you that you were wrong
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Old October 17th, 2018, 10:42 AM   #43
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Can I ask why you think I am a AB guy? I sell every brand under the sun on our website... I could care less what the name is, I have wrote programs and troubleshoot every PLC made, you really need to think about your statements before you say them and back to my first point, you made a statement that was wrong and I point it out, if you said it about any brand and it was wrong I would of still told you that you were wrong
Just a guess by the products and services on your site and also because of this statement - "From your last post maybe you should of just wrote "I hate Allen Bradley and you should use anything but" then I would not of even said anything"

But okay, maybe I was wrong. Regardless, I still think you're an AB guy. Hey nothing wrong with being an AB guy. You're in good company as there are of lot of them around. Okay, since you have such vast experience with all platforms and you've worked with every PLC ever made, again......what's the better platform to go with, AB ControlLogix or Beckhoff CX??? And why? Please list your reasons. Maybe you have better answers than Rockwell because the only answer they could muster was "better support". Which by the way, later proved to be false. I'll wait...
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Old October 17th, 2018, 10:48 AM   #44
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AB of course their support is great (kidding)

To me, I dont care... I will install or sell whatever the end users want, I have found that all the support I need is either on Google, this site or in the user manuals, I have said it many times a PLC is a PLC
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Old October 17th, 2018, 10:50 AM   #45
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Just a guess by the products and services on your site and also because of this statement - "From your last post maybe you should of just wrote "I hate Allen Bradley and you should use anything but" then I would not of even said anything"

But okay, maybe I was wrong. Regardless, I still think you're an AB guy. Hey nothing wrong with being an AB guy. You're in good company as there are of lot of them around. Okay, since you have such vast experience with all platforms and you've worked with every PLC ever made, again......what's the better platform to go with, AB ControlLogix or Beckhoff CX??? And why? Please list your reasons. Maybe you have better answers than Rockwell because the only answer they could muster was "better support". Which by the way, later proved to be false. I'll wait...
You're bound to have a long wait... ultimately there is no best brand. There may be a best brand for an application and even that will depend on the perspective of everyone involved.
What irks me, and apparently, you too is when people don't acknowledge a platform's shortcomings when they are very visible to all.

By the way, Rockwell's support is dreadful. Sure, they get back to you quickly... but the answers are extremely poor. The "best" answer I received was when asking why I had to remove FlexEx from a live backplane to reset the modules and their answer was to go and buy a UPS.
But hey... out of 5 calls, one was spot on. Perhaps that is the limit at which Rockwell sets their top service threshold at.
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