I have to head to a customer tomorrow and upload from MicroLogix 1000 - PLCS.net

PLCplease · February 13th, 2020, 05:24 PM

What am I going to get? A program with rungs and instructions and absolutely no descriptions and comments?

There is no offline version of the program available. We are upgrading them to Compact Logix, I was just hoping I had a program to work with to reconstruct the logic.

I've never worked with anything prior to Micro 1400.

Any tips? Thanks for any insight.

the_msp · February 13th, 2020, 05:26 PM

Correct. Without a digital copy of the program, you won't get the comments.

You might be in luck and find a printed copy somewhere on site.

OkiePC · February 13th, 2020, 05:34 PM

On the bright side, the ML1000 only has 1K of memory, no floating point, no expansion I/O and many other limitations, so the amount of documentation you have to rebuild should be minimal. Look for electrical drawings while on site and take a lot of pictures.

diat150 · February 13th, 2020, 05:43 PM

yeah worst case you trace out the IO, on a micrologix 1000 that should give you a good head start.

kolyur · February 13th, 2020, 05:45 PM

We deal with this a lot when we have to work on purchased equipment where the OEM was not willing to provide a documented program. After uploading the logic, I usually go through and name all the inputs and outputs; this is easy if you have a schematic and just a bit more work if you don't. At that point you can usually make sense of an average sized program as long as the programmer didn't go nuts with his internal memory bits.

PLCplease · February 13th, 2020, 05:49 PM

That's what i was afraid of. Thanks guys

the_msp · February 13th, 2020, 05:57 PM

Note also there may be a password on the program so you might not even get that (easily anyway).

ASF · February 13th, 2020, 06:03 PM

If you have to reverse engineer it, spend at least a day onsite, online with the PLC, while the machine is running. Start by entering descriptions for all of the I/O, and then start commenting the memory bits based on the I/O comments and what you can observe of the machine operation and code activity. It's a bit like a crossword - it's tricky to start with, but the more pieces you fill in, the more clues you get to help you out with the rest of the unknowns.

I recently had to do this with a very large micrologix 1500 PLC, that had only very minimal (and mostly incorrect/misleading) documentation. Took a while, but like I say, you plod away slowly for a while and eventually hit a tipping point where you've documented enough that the remaining bits are easily worked out.

jstolaruk · February 13th, 2020, 07:29 PM

Its a right-of-passage for plc programming.

PLCplease · February 14th, 2020, 02:50 PM

Well, that went waay better than expected.

There were only 9 inputs, all prox's, and only 4 outputs.

The program looks ridiculous, though.

Raggedy old machine.

https://imgur.com/a/7FKxEs0

kolyur · February 14th, 2020, 04:06 PM

The OSHA inspector must have called in sick that day.

shawn_75 · February 14th, 2020, 05:25 PM

I had to look up poka yoke. What throws a poka yoke error in that machine?

geniusintraining · February 14th, 2020, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shawn_75

What throws a poka yoke error in that machine?

I am guessing... but when the lamp blows up and blows off the green cover the lamp, thats an error

February 13th, 2020, 05:24 PM	#1
PLCplease Member Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Indiana Posts: 22	I have to head to a customer tomorrow and upload from MicroLogix 1000 What am I going to get? A program with rungs and instructions and absolutely no descriptions and comments? There is no offline version of the program available. We are upgrading them to Compact Logix, I was just hoping I had a program to work with to reconstruct the logic. I've never worked with anything prior to Micro 1400. Any tips? Thanks for any insight.

February 13th, 2020, 05:26 PM	#2
the_msp Lifetime Supporting Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Northern Ireland Posts: 953	Correct. Without a digital copy of the program, you won't get the comments. You might be in luck and find a printed copy somewhere on site. __________________ Regards, Patrick G. B.Eng MIET Making the flashy lights flash since the 90's SCADA - Inductive Automation Gold Integrator \| PLC \| Control Panels \| Robotics \| Training Connect with Matrix Engineering

February 13th, 2020, 05:34 PM	#3
OkiePC Lifetime Supporting Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: ENE of Nowhere Oklahoma Posts: 10,798	On the bright side, the ML1000 only has 1K of memory, no floating point, no expansion I/O and many other limitations, so the amount of documentation you have to rebuild should be minimal. Look for electrical drawings while on site and take a lot of pictures. __________________ You can choose a ready guide in some celestial voice. If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice.

February 13th, 2020, 05:45 PM	#5
kolyur Lifetime Supporting Member + Moderator Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Wooster, Ohio Posts: 1,519	We deal with this a lot when we have to work on purchased equipment where the OEM was not willing to provide a documented program. After uploading the logic, I usually go through and name all the inputs and outputs; this is easy if you have a schematic and just a bit more work if you don't. At that point you can usually make sense of an average sized program as long as the programmer didn't go nuts with his internal memory bits. __________________ John

February 13th, 2020, 05:57 PM	#7
the_msp Lifetime Supporting Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Northern Ireland Posts: 953	Note also there may be a password on the program so you might not even get that (easily anyway). __________________ Regards, Patrick G. B.Eng MIET Making the flashy lights flash since the 90's SCADA - Inductive Automation Gold Integrator \| PLC \| Control Panels \| Robotics \| Training Connect with Matrix Engineering



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February 13th, 2020, 05:43 PM	#4
diat150 Lifetime Supporting Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Louisiana Posts: 1,365	yeah worst case you trace out the IO, on a micrologix 1000 that should give you a good head start.

February 13th, 2020, 05:49 PM	#6
PLCplease Member Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Indiana Posts: 22	That's what i was afraid of. Thanks guys

February 13th, 2020, 06:03 PM	#8
ASF Lifetime Supporting Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Australia Posts: 3,176	If you have to reverse engineer it, spend at least a day onsite, online with the PLC, while the machine is running. Start by entering descriptions for all of the I/O, and then start commenting the memory bits based on the I/O comments and what you can observe of the machine operation and code activity. It's a bit like a crossword - it's tricky to start with, but the more pieces you fill in, the more clues you get to help you out with the rest of the unknowns. I recently had to do this with a very large micrologix 1500 PLC, that had only very minimal (and mostly incorrect/misleading) documentation. Took a while, but like I say, you plod away slowly for a while and eventually hit a tipping point where you've documented enough that the remaining bits are easily worked out.

February 13th, 2020, 07:29 PM	#9
jstolaruk Lifetime Supporting Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Detroit, SE Michigan Posts: 3,539	Its a right-of-passage for plc programming. __________________ "You can live to be a hundred if you give up all the things that make you want to live to be a hundred." Woody Allen

February 14th, 2020, 02:50 PM	#10
PLCplease Member Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Indiana Posts: 22	Well, that went waay better than expected. There were only 9 inputs, all prox's, and only 4 outputs. The program looks ridiculous, though. Raggedy old machine. https://imgur.com/a/7FKxEs0

February 14th, 2020, 04:06 PM	#11
kolyur Lifetime Supporting Member + Moderator Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Wooster, Ohio Posts: 1,519	The OSHA inspector must have called in sick that day. __________________ John

February 14th, 2020, 05:25 PM	#12
shawn_75 Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: KY Posts: 420	I had to look up poka yoke. What throws a poka yoke error in that machine?

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