Is There a Bible for RSLogix 5000?

Hey Guys,
I'm new to Rockwell Software and I am trying to find my way around RSLogix 5000.


I find the Software to be very quirky and poorly designed.


Many of the functions are vague or mysterious in their behavior.


Some of the features seem incomplete or even broken.


I come across various situations where I need to spend half of the day sifting through forums, knowledgebase entries, and help files to figure out how to handle them.


Does anyone know if a book exists that explains every detail of the software and how it operates?


So far, PLC Talk has been my best resource.


I want to know, besides years of experience, what are your best resources for working with this software?



Thanks

Are you looking for software navigation or programming help?

The software isnÂ’t setup as a teaching tool, you should understand programming and most instructions, if not, it will indeed be difficult to use.

If the software navigation is difficult what PLC software are you familiar with? The ladder logic editor is fairly superior among many other vendors, but the ST editor is extremely far behind.

IMO if you are familiar with PLC programming a YouTube academy should help you out with getting familiar with the software. Also what revision are you using?

Maxkling said:

Are you looking for software navigation or programming help?

The software isn’t setup as a teaching tool, you should understand programming and most instructions, if not, it will indeed be difficult to use.

If the software navigation is difficult what PLC software are you familiar with? The ladder logic editor is fairly superior among many other vendors, but the ST editor is extremely far behind.

IMO if you are familiar with PLC programming a YouTube academy should help you out with getting familiar with the software. Also what revision are you using?

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I come from a facility that was primarily Automation Direct. It was well structured and simple in design.


Most of my PLC's were of similar generations.


There was not a lot "jumping through hoops" to get things done.



The worst I had to deal with was firmware version compatibility.



My new company is all Allen Bradley with every generation from PLC-5 on up.


There were many different programmers in here so nothing is uniform. Some of them were computer programmers so their programming style doesn't translate well to old-school ladder logic.


I have some projects with very simple tag handling where others are a nightmare to follow.



I took the Rockwell Level I and Level II eLearning classes to get going but I come across a lot of strange situations that are outside of basic level.


With most of the issues that I have found, there has been somebody on here who has spent half a day figuring it out and they posted the details.


For example, searching for forces in a program sounds like it should be simple but you should see the thread on that.



From my boot-up screen it shows I have version 20.04 but that's not all you will need. You also need RSLinx and BootP. And when they can't do the job you need to install wireshark. If you are running windows 10 then you need to run compatibility mode Windows 8 and tweak your firewall. Gaaah!!!



I literally need to pull a rabbit out of a hat at least every other week.

Is There a Bible for RSLogix 5000?

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only in your dreams ...

I'm new to Rockwell Software and I am trying to find my way around RSLogix 5000.

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are you familiar with any other brand of PLC – and its software? ... not meaning to discourage you – but using RSLogix 5000 as an introduction to PLCs would NOT be my first choice ... if you're completely new to PLCs in general – and possibly just getting into "programming" too – I'd recommend that you start with something simpler ... analogy: take a golf cart for a spin around an empty section of the Wal-Mart parking lot – before you try an 18-wheeler in downtown traffic ...

I find the Software to be very quirky and poorly designed.

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if you're trying to start an argument – you'll need to change the subject ... many (most?) folks are going to agree with you on that one ... and what version (16, 20, 30, etc.) are you working with? ... secret handshake: it does NOT get easier – or better designed as you increase the version ... basically they just keep adding more features to work with (or curse at) as you go along ...

Many of the functions are vague or mysterious in their behavior.

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yes they are ...

Some of the features seem incomplete or even broken.

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yep ... you have to decide which ones you're going to use frequently – and which ones you're going to just simply avoid completely ...

I come across various situations where I need to spend half of the day sifting through forums, knowledgebase entries, and help files to figure out how to handle them.

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not meaning any disrespect (and this goes back to my earlier question) but here's a question ...

(A) are you sure that you KNOW what you want to get done – and are just looking for how to do it in RSLogix 5000? ... or ...

(B) are you trying to learn PLCs from square one?

Does anyone know if a book exists that explains every detail of the software and how it operates?

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no ... there is no such book ... if there were, it would be more like a set of encyclopedias ... and the instructions would change from one version to another ... one of the nicest things about retiring is that I no longer have to keep up with the new stuff ... the new stuff ... the new stuff ... the new stuff ...

So far, PLC Talk has been my best resource.

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and it is likely to remain so ... most (all?) of us here cannot imagine a life without it ...

I want to know, besides years of experience, what are your best resources for working with this software?

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get rid of your TV set (I haven't had one in my house for at least 15 years or so) ... sacrifice all social contacts ... spend every available hour fighting the beast ... it's sort of like learning to play the piano without a teacher ... there are only so many keys available ... just keep banging on the thing until you hear music coming out ...

another quick question for you:

are you planning to use this software for programming new control systems – or for troubleshooting equipment which has already been programmed? ... the skill set that you need are "somewhat" different in each case ...

Thanks

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you're welcome ... if you'll give us more detail (especially in the questions I've asked above) then we'll try to give you more detail in our answers ...

EDIT: I just noticed that you've added some detail while I was posting ... I'll take a look at your latest after breakfast ...

The biggest mistake people make when learning a new PLC system is to try to make the new system behave like the one you're already familiar with. RSLogix5000 is capable of doing a lot more than Direct Logic, but the learning curve can seem like trying to drink from a fire hose.

I literally need to pull a rabbit out of a hat at least every other week.

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Cool, could you post a youtube video of you doing that?

I understand what you mean. After a while it becomes second nature. AD is great for the simplicity but depending on the line lacks and “enterprise” aspect.

But honestly there is no bible that I know of. I’ve struggled with bootp and rslinx but once I’ve fought it I have 0 issues with it. A lot of Rockwell software tries to keep the legacy approach so old programmers can be familiar with new products. This does make things very bulky and unstable on the front end. An example that drives me insane is FTView. The graphics editor is literally just rsview32. I was hope for a new product, now it’s just an extremely bulky rebadged half legacy half new product.

But as our experience once it’s set up and running properly it will last forever.

The one that got me is that the system was programmed in part by computer programmers. There is a different outlook on the world from automation people and computer programmers. Mostly computer programmers dont generally think about someone coming after them. In the PLC realm you are always programming for your audience. Simpler is usually better because nobody thinks well at 3am. There are a lot of advanced tools in the Logix platform and the need to use them all is to be avoided. I think Ron expressed it right (as he usually does). This forum may be your best bet for sorting out those oddities. In the long run I think you will find RSLogix much better to work with than the AD stuff. Maybe just my preference but my cussibility factor goes down when I go from AD software to Logix.

PLCMentor said:

In the long run I think you will find RSLogix much better to work with than the AD stuff. Maybe just my preference but my cussibility factor goes down when I go from AD software to Logix.

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I do like the tag-based memory system and the ability to store documentation in the controller.


The one thing that bugged me about AD was when you extract a program from an unknown PLC you only get the logic.


Sometimes it was easier to write a whole new program rather than trying to translate what was there.

First,

Not every sentence.

Constitutes a new paragraph.

I'm a bit humored by the post and some of the responses. While I have years of experience on my side, I don't ever recall having issues with Logix/Studio 5000 IDE when I first started using it. Every PLC IDE I have used has quirks and issues. Most of the sour grapes people have of Logix/Studio 5000 is due to lousy programming or not understanding that the key difference between it and say Logix5/500 is structure. 5000 the programmer must create the structure they require, while 5/500 force the programmer into one.

If the program has bad structure, it's the programmer's fault, not the programming software's fault. Sadly, more often than not the structure is bad because of the migration from 5/500. It's why you still see programs with arrays of N[x], B[x]..etc in 5000 because old habits die hard and the concepts of UDTs and AOIs and creating STRUCTURE were completely new so programmers crammed the 5/500 structure into their 5000 programs OR they just made **** up as they went.


So you get a bunch of garbage programs out there whose's problems begin with horrible, or complete lack of structure.

I experienced this first had when I first touched a ControlLogix system. The Vendor's programmer was close to retirement and that program continues to be my reference point of how NOT to write a ControlLogix program. Had nothing to do with the IDE.

Steve Bailey said:

The biggest mistake people make when learning a new PLC system is to try to make the new system behave like the one you're already familiar with. RSLogix5000 is capable of doing a lot more than Direct Logic, but the learning curve can seem like trying to drink from a fire hose.



Cool, could you post a youtube video of you doing that?

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I'm used to learning different software and equipment.


However, most of what I've dealt with over the years had good resources for support (e.g. accurate manuals, free tech support, tech notes, etc).


I'm used to coming across something I don't know, grabbing a manual, skimming through the parts I need to know and moving on.



On the rare occasion I couldn't figure out a solution I could always lean on tech support.



Rockwell is a whole different world. You are on your own. Here are a few bread crumbs. Have fun.



I know it's a matter of time until I get a handle on it. I am just looking for a faster approach.


Anyway, I'm really glad you all are here.


These forums have helped me tremendously already.


I'm sure you will be hearing more from me.


Maybe I will get to that rabbit video after I make a video on how to correctly assign an IP address to a 1794AENT Ethernet adapter with rotary switches using BootP.

Rockwell’s support is actually not that bad. Once you figure out the website and search function. You need an account, free will offer some tech articles while paid will get you a lot more.

EJSControls said:

I'm used to learning different software and equipment.


However, most of what I've dealt with over the years had good resources for support (e.g. accurate manuals, free tech support, tech notes, etc).


I'm used to coming across something I don't know, grabbing a manual, skimming through the parts I need to know and moving on.



On the rare occasion I couldn't figure out a solution I could always lean on tech support.



Rockwell is a whole different world. You are on your own. Here are a few bread crumbs. Have fun.



I know it's a matter of time until I get a handle on it. I am just looking for a faster approach.


Anyway, I'm really glad you all are here.


These forums have helped me tremendously already.


I'm sure you will be hearing more from me.


Maybe I will get to that rabbit video after I make a video on how to correctly assign an IP address to a 1794AENT Ethernet adapter with rotary switches using BootP.

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So let me make sure I'm clear on this, your experience is with Automation direct, you're trying to figure out how to use/program a far more powerful PLC line "quickly" but its the software that is the problem not the programmer.

EJSControls said:

I want to know, besides years of experience, what are your best resources for working with this software?

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LITERATURE LIBRARY

For example, if one is looking for a "bible" of sorts:

Logix 5000 Controllers General Instructions Reference
Manual

Kind of old-school, though, these days.

Firejo said:

So let me make sure I'm clear on this, your experience is with Automation direct, you're trying to figure out how to use/program a far more powerful PLC line "quickly" but its the software that is the problem not the programmer.

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My job has always been "shoot-from-the-hip" problem solving.


I wouldn't call myself a programmer.


I get thrown various things at random and told "Make this work."


I don't have months/years to spend learning a quirky software package.


Therefore, I need to find the fastest resources possible.

I'll echo many here in saying that 5000 is far from quirky when you compare it to other IDEs. Most consider 5k to be the "king" of ladder. In fact, people get used to it doing all sorts of things for you automatically like converting floats to integers that they get frustrated when they have to work on another brand.

It's just different than what you're used to. It's to be expected that you'll have to learn a few things before you feel comfortable with it.

I've always had good luck consulting the built-in help pages for the various instructions. They usually provide detailed explanations with examples.