HMI suggestions

Hello,

I am looking to improve our company's HMI systems. I would love some suggestions on how to do this. We use a number of different PLC's. Here's my estimate of the PLC's that we use:

-Rockwell Control/CompactLogix: 75%
-Siemens/Omron/Mitsubishi/GE/Misc.: 25%

We currently use GE iFix frequently and also frequently use rockwell HMI's. Sometimes we develop panelviews and sometimes we develop on a PC.

So, as you can see, we are kind of all over the place. My objective is to develop more modern looking HMI systems that are cost effective and will work with our systems. We usually have around 300 tags on our HMI and our PLC code is usually pretty simple. We usually require data history and recording.

It would be really cool if we could develop on a large tablet with touchscreen capability. Maybe something like a Microsoft Surface tablet? It would be really cool if I could develop screens using web design skills, instead of within' a prepackaged HMI development software. Is this possible? Has anyone done this? Wireless capability would be a plus too.

I'm looking for any suggestions and/or examples that you have to modernize and standardize our HMI approach. Thanks for your help!

You have to provide more details about what you REALLY need to achieve.

For example
Are the local HMIs part of autonomous machines or processes ?
Or are the local HMIs only there to provide info and interact with local items that are otherwise part of a larger process.
If it is the 1st, you probably will need to keep having local HMIs and probably made from a known Brand.
If it is the second, you could consider a common SCADA, combined with either traditional panels or webserver functionality for the local access to the process. If you have a large process, rather than many small processes or machines, I would consider Ignition which is entirely web-based. That would allow you to use any tablet with touch functionality to access the process anywhere in the plant.

minerman said:

It would be really cool if we could develop on a large tablet with touchscreen capability. Maybe something like a Microsoft Surface tablet? It would be really cool if I could develop screens using web design skills, instead of within' a prepackaged HMI development software. Is this possible? Has anyone done this? Wireless capability would be a plus too.

Click to expand...

Although I´ve never developed for it there is a new "Industrial" tablet available now from Samsung (http://www.eweek.com/mobile/samsung-intros-galaxy-tab-active-rugged-business-tablet.html)

Its only 8 inches but there are probably others available. I know that you can view FT View Studio screens via an iPad using a PV+ with extended features. Not sure exactly how it works but we did it a couple of times here in work.

My company uses mostly Rockwell controllers but occasionally Siemens and other embedded devices that use Modbus protocol.

We have largely standardized on Indusoft Web Studio for most of our HMI projects.

IWS gives us the ability to do medium-size (4000 tags or so) projects on PC terminals, as well as little Windows CE touchscreen projects, using the same software. I have one machine right now with five CE boxes and a big 23" touchscreen as the main HMI and it's great to not have to switch toolsets to work on different applications.

We use mostly Advantech hardware, with a handful of Dell whiteboxes.

While I adore Ignition's vector graphics, platform independence, tight SQL integration and near-limitless expandability, we keep encountering Microsoft-specific needs that are difficult or impossible to do with a Java-based system.

For example, that machine with the big 23" touchscreen has a cutting tool that's buried down deep in the mechanism. We put a compact gigabit IP camera and some lighting down there and have an ActiveX object that goes onscreen and gives the operator the ability to look right at the machining surface. The ActiveX object plunks right down into the Indusoft application and we get all the hooks into it that we need to stop, start, adjust, and record the video.

There are certainly bugs and quirks and features I don't like about IWS. Their communications diagnostics are poor, and their tag database integration with ControlLogix is clumsy.

I have not used their mobile and web-access features, but I do like the ability to quickly and easily deploy objects and edits from your "Studio" computer to the runtime computer.

JesperMP said:

You have to provide more details about what you REALLY need to achieve.

For example
Are the local HMIs part of autonomous machines or processes ?
Or are the local HMIs only there to provide info and interact with local items that are otherwise part of a larger process.
If it is the 1st, you probably will need to keep having local HMIs and probably made from a known Brand.
If it is the second, you could consider a common SCADA, combined with either traditional panels or webserver functionality for the local access to the process. If you have a large process, rather than many small processes or machines, I would consider Ignition which is entirely web-based. That would allow you to use any tablet with touch functionality to access the process anywhere in the plant.

Click to expand...

We develop a wide range of systems sometimes. They are usually stand-alone systems that integrate very little with other factory equipment. Some processes run 24/7 and are usually just monitoring systems with very little daily interaction, others are more production type machines that require a little more operation and monitoring.

I guess I am imagining an HMI system that is easy to use, is feature rich and can be beautified to look modern and be a selling point for our systems in the future.

I just think it would be great if I had an hmi system that could include a lot of the features that my phone has for example. It would be nice to hover over an object with my finger and have it display additional information. It would be great to have animations that you might see on a modern webpage. Such as transition effects when you switch between views, embedded instructional videos, animated gifs... abilities to easily link out to web pages.

I just want to overhaul what we do and really add some visually appealing and increased functionality.

I will have to check out Ignition. Thanks.

Also if anyone has specific hardware recommendations that would be great too.

Hello,

PeakHMI might be a good solution.

By the way. My company is an OEM. I'm looking at Ignition and it looks really great. It's too bad that you have to pay per server license. I think we would require a server license for each project that we have.

Edit: I just noticed the ignition prices. I was really hoping this software would be a possibility, but I don't see how this would save us any money, as an OEM.

For hardware based HMI you would be hard pressed to find a PLC that a Red Lion HMI can't talk to. And the hardware and software are great, very flexible, capable of a few things a windoze system can do like email and SQL updates. Productivity is outstanding too with Crimson 3.0, you will really notice how fast and responsive everything is compared with FTView and its slow hardware.

+1 on Indusoft.

Not perfect but the best bang for your $$$ IMHO.

I'll add my endorsement for Ignition, however let me add that software choice is just one part of good HMI design. The best software in the world isn't going to overcome a poor HMI strategy

I suggest you get the book Effective Console Operator HMI Design. The book is more detailed, but if you are balking at spending the money then look at this link and this link for some white papers on the subject of HMI design. The material at the links barely skims the surface of what the book covers, but it may start to change the way you're thinking about HMI design.

TConnolly said:

I'll add my endorsement for Ignition, however let me add that software choice is just one part of good HMI design. The best software in the world isn't going to overcome a poor HMI strategy

I suggest you get the book Effective Console Operator HMI Design. The book is more detailed, but if you are balking at spending the money then look at this link and this link for some white papers on the subject of HMI design. The material at the links barely skims the surface of what the book covers, but it may start to change the way you're thinking about HMI design.

Click to expand...

These links are really great information. It's making me rethink some of my strategies. Thanks!

Here's the book the two white papers reference - http://www.amazon.com/The-High-Performance-HMI-Handbook/dp/0977896919/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_y

Ignition gets my vote every time.

minerman said:

By the way. My company is an OEM. I'm looking at Ignition and it looks really great. It's too bad that you have to pay per server license. I think we would require a server license for each project that we have.

Edit: I just noticed the ignition prices. I was really hoping this software would be a possibility, but I don't see how this would save us any money, as an OEM.

Click to expand...

I think you're miss-understanding the license cost.

The BEST part of Ignition licensing is that it is SERVER based and not CLIENT based. The power of Ignition comes when you centralize your projects, if you keep everything fragmented, stand-alone then you'll pay $$$ no matter who you go with.

After re-reading your post. If all you do is shell out stand alone systems, you could do the 1 client license super cheap.

Automation Directs CMORE EA9 series touch screens have a ton of capabilities you are looking for. The software is only $100. Screens range from $500 to $2000 depending on size. It may very well be worth your while to check them out.
Jim