OT: Business in Germany

We recently lost a quote to a big automotive manufacturer in Germany. Nothing strange about that you win some you lose some.
What was strange about this was the way we were treated. We have done a lot of international business over the years, but never in Germany and this experience was different.

The technical discussions were very good, but the experience with their purchasing department was different to anything I have ever experienced and we have dealt with many
big international companies before so we are not inexperienced in that sense.

Perhaps some of you can help to shed some light on this topic.
I have heard stories before that German companies are nationalistic and don't buy if you don't have a German office which we don't have

Do any of you have experience with this? Was this a dead end from the beginning?

I am quite surprised, especially as you are in Europe.

We have found the Germans to be fairly normal to deal with, they always spec Siemens or Lenze but that is to be expected.

I could of understood to an extent if you were based in the States (and no disrespect meant to our American cousins), but I am genuinely surprised as you are in Sweden.

In my personal experience.... well you've answered your own question. I bet they wanted a German PLC as well.

German auto industry is very nationalistic. They are hard on specs and always specify something german if possible.

Chris Taylor said:

I bet they wanted a German PLC as well.

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Correct but that could not have been the problem almost all parts where German Siemens,Sick,IFM etc and we met all their technical demands.
We also offered a very well proven solution we have already built 300+ machines of the same type which we have shipped world wide. I know for a fact that our competitor don't have that exact machine and need to design that to meet the customers needs.

I got the feeling that we offered the best machine to the lowest price but we still lost the order to a German competitor. So i was just curious if some one else had the same experience or that we just had the misfortune to meet the wrong purchaser.

TurpoUrpo said:

German auto industry is very nationalistic. They are hard on specs and always specify something german if possible.

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Its good to know then i guess our our best shot is to team up with a German partner if we want to try again

Bratt said:

Correct but that could not have been the problem almost all parts where German Siemens,Sick,IFM etc and we met all their technical demands.
We also offered a very well proven solution we have already built 300+ machines of the same type which we have shipped world wide. I know for a fact that our competitor don't have that exact machine and need to design that to meet the customers needs.

I got the feeling that we offered the best machine to the lowest price but we still lost the order to a German competitor. So i was just curious if some one else had the same experience or that we just had the misfortune to meet the wrong purchaser.

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Being german weigths a lot in german auto industry. Its just fact. There is a reason why its germany that had so big of a trade surplus...

janner_10 said:

I could of understood to an extent if you were based in the States (and no disrespect meant to our American cousins), but I am genuinely surprised as you are in Sweden.

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Maybe thats what happen to Volkswagen

It's not just Germany.
In the 80s I lost a huge PLC project (then ultimately my job) at Square D for a Swedish company, precisely because we did not have an office in Sweden. We had an office in Denmark that covered all of Scandinavia but Siemens had an office in Stockholm, so they got the project. All of the PLCs were going on fishing processing barges that were based in Seattle for the fishing fleet in Alaska, and we had distributors in Seattle and Anchorage with a satellite office in Dutch Harbor that specifically serviced the fleet, but the issue of an office IN Sweden was more important to them.

Later when I worked for Siemens, we were constantly struggling to break into the Automotive industry here in the States, where AB dominated. The only time we got orders was when equipment came from German OEMs and needed expansion.

Then later yet when I worked for an integrator in California, we built controls for Semicinductor Fabs and started out with AB PLCs, but when they all started moving to Asia, were told to switch to Omron. Out local representation for Omron was horrible, but that didn't matter.

It's just part of the favoritism game that EVERYOBE plays.

It makes perfect sense for me to get a supplier as close to my facility as possible, in the long run it makes for easier logistics, that being said i would not make that decision if it might affect the outcome and quality of the project.

I think its natural to try and get a support as close to your operations as possible.