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Old December 12th, 2006, 10:30 AM   #1
lawebster
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Training in Baton Rouge area

anyone aware of any plc training classes in the south La. area?

I have many questions..
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Old December 12th, 2006, 12:11 PM   #2
Ron Beaufort
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personally I'm not sure about any classes in your area ... but then I don't get around as much as some of the other members do ...

Quote:
I have many questions...
why not post them here? ... we have many answers ...

the best way to get started is to give us a COMPLETE and DETAILED list of all of the hardware and software you have available ... then start playing (working/learning/experimenting) with your system ... when you run into something that just does NOT make sense, then describe your problem, post the question, and ask for help ...

one other approach ... tell us what would be on your personal "wishlist" of topics to be covered IF (big IF) you could find the IDEAL training course in your area ... specifically, what do you want to learn? ... in many cases, we can direct you to specific links on the forum (and to other resources) where the information you're looking for can be found ...

good luck with your career ...
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Old December 12th, 2006, 12:57 PM   #3
lawebster
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Beaufort
why not post them here? ... we have many answers ...
I don't want to ask so many questions that I become an annoyance to everyone and maybe labeled lazy. I am new to PLC programming and just started working for this eng firm. We get different projects, and usually different hardware every project. I just need to do a couple of projects to get an understanding of how it works and sometimes I don't know how to ask what I'm thinking

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Beaufort
the best way to get started is to give us a COMPLETE and DETAILED list of all of the hardware and software you have available
My current project is programming a AB ENHANCED PLC5/20 using RSLogix 5. The HMI interface is a standalone Wonderware 9.5 node

I have a couple of questions pertaining to the HMI and how it changes info in the PLC. For instance:

Changing a valve mode from manual to automatic. Is it right to have the HMI change the auto/man bit in the PID, in this case N32:0 Word 0 bit 1 = 0 AUTOMATIC/1 MANUAL, block directly or should it go through a different data point to do this? What would the code look like to control it from the HMI?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Beaufort
specifically, what do you want to learn? ...
The right why to code from scratch and have a comfortable understanding of how it is done

Thanks for all the info!
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Old December 12th, 2006, 02:26 PM   #4
Ron Beaufort
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Quote:
I don't want to ask so many questions that I become an annoyance ...




without questions, what good would the forum be? ... we’d all go home - and try to find some other richly rewarding and satisfying hobby ...



now here’s a question about the project you mentioned ... is the Wonderware station the ONLY way that the operator has of changing the system back and forth from MANUAL to AUTOMATIC? ... or is there also a physical button located on a panel somewhere out in the field? ...



some things to consider before you answer:



suppose that one day the Wonderware computer goes “belly-up” ... so now we’ve got a perfectly good (industrially hardened) PLC just sitting there - twiddling its electronic thumbs and waiting for instructions from a regular (office grade) computer ... what happens to the company’s “bottom line” while we’re waiting around for a new computer to arrive and be set up? ... if the answer is “let’s make SOMETHING - ANYTHING in the manual mode” then you need to consider how the operator is going to control the PLC without using the Wonderware station ... here’s one common method that allows a “last-vote-wins” type of setup ...







the last rung sort of answers one of your questions ... specifically, many (most?) programmers would NOT aim the HMI directly at the PID’s Auto/Manual bit - but instead would use an extra “marker” bit (example: B13/0) and a rung of logic to tie this “marker” to the PID’s bit ... one major reason (there are others) is that by using a range of consecutive bits (all located in word B13:0, for example) then Wonderware can take care of reading/writing 16 separate operations (one for each bit in the word) with only ONE transfer over the communications link ... on the other hand, if you set up Wonderware to read/write into a “single-bit-here” and another “single-bit-there” then the network traffic can quickly bog down with needless reads and writes ...



reality check: things that we have NOT covered here (yet) ... what mode should the system “wake up” in? ...



(a) in the same mode that it “went to sleep” in ... or

(b) always in the Automatic mode ... or

(c) always in the Manual mode ... or

(d) in some other mode that the customer’s operators can dream up?



big idea: programming the system is usually the easiest part ... specifying all of the “what-if” types of things like this can be quite taxing ...



Quote:
What would the code look like to control it from the HMI?




if (big IF) you have the HMI write directly into the PID’s control block, then you wouldn’t need ANY logic in the PLC at all ... the status of the bit would just mysteriously switch back and forth between 0 and 1 as the HMI operator pressed his magic button ... but ... if you use the extra “marker” bit approach that I recommended above, then the last rung shown above is pretty much all you’ll need ... the top two rungs would only be required if (big IF) you decide that you need that operator’s station out in the field IN ADDITION to the HMI screen ...



or ... did I misunderstand the question? ... are you asking about what the HMI (Wonderware) end of things will look like? ...
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Old December 12th, 2006, 02:50 PM   #5
lawebster
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That is EXACTLY what I was asking! The HMI is the only way that the operator will be able to change the mode (other than firing up RSLogix on a PC).

Your last line is how I have it set up but didn't know if it had to be "latched" to stay in Manual. I guess the value in the data table N32:0/1 will stay 1 until it is toggled?

So when B13/0 is closed again it will change N32:0/1 to 0? Should I think of this as just a toggle switch?
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Old December 12th, 2006, 03:35 PM   #6
tomalbright
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My company (in Louisiana) has considered teaching classes for our customers, but there is great difficulty in developing a plan for everybody, as you mix rank beginners with experienced personnel. I currently use both of the products you mention.

It sounds like you would benefit from a basic PLC class. Call the Reynolds company and see if there are any AB training classes, or "home grown" classes scheduled for the near future.

I'm sure you could benefit from a Wonderware class as well - I had to pick it up on my own, but I have experience in so many HMIs going back... well, a long time. WW is not the easiest for a beginner to pick up.

Or you could just contract the whole mess out, hint hint...
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Old December 12th, 2006, 03:58 PM   #7
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I snooped around a bit and found this web site the best thing to use since I cannont get the trainers come to my office.

Don't be afraid to ask for help. Just don't ask for code.
I got told about this site from one of my company's PLC/HMI gurus. He lurks here all the time.
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Old December 12th, 2006, 05:20 PM   #8
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Most of the suppliers have short training/sales seminars. Most are of good information, and most importantly good contacts for help. The Reynolds Co., Standard Automation, and Awc-Corp do have these at no cost often. Glad to see more counterparts here from Cajun Country.
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