TP1200 Backtransfer

sparkotronic

Member
Join Date
Oct 2005
Location
edinburgh
Posts
37
Hi,

At one of my sites contractors have failed to supply a backup of our TP1200 Comfort HMI.

I was going to try and carryout a backtransfer in WinCC but the 1200 isn't listed in the transfer settings.

Is this because it is not compatible with WinCC and needs to be TIA?

If so, how do you backtransfer in TIA15, if it is possible?
If not, is prosave the only option going forward?


Cheers, Colin
 
You can at least create a backup using the backup function on the HMI. Insert a USB stick, then move to the system panel (if someone hasn't provided button in runtime, power cycle the HMI and before the runtime starts enter the control panel) and "Service and Commissioning". Then you can create a full backup with all relevant data on the USB stick, from which you can also load a new panel.
 
1) Comfort panels do not support getting an engineerable project back off of them (what was called "backtransfer" in wincc flex).



2) They are not supported by WinCC Flex; they require at least WinCC Comfort (which is in TIA, latest version is V16, but I think they started in v11 or v12).


3) You can do a binary backup, as Thomas_V2 suggested (with either TIA or Prosave), but you won't be able to edit it. It will allow you to take the data from this HMI and transfer it to a new one in case the HMI dies.


4) another recovery option is to use a system backup card, where it automatically stores everything on an SD card, which you can just swap to a new HMI in case of replacement.
 
That's pretty much what I thought.

What a bugger, when you have sloppy 3rd parties, it means there is going to be some fun down the line.

Back to prosave and finger crossing.
You have to wonder the logic behind a decision like that.
 
No, but they are basicly s#it at supplying backups.
At one site they sent me 5 diffrent versions of a project and none matched the running code.

There is a long history of ineptitude.
It's a complicated issue, we have only just managed to get them to tick the back transfer option on WinCC.

Siemens suck at allowing you to back up.

Hey ho, it'll make for an interesting 3am call out one day :p
 
I can see your frustration, I like siemens tia , but that is rubbish that you can’t copy (Back transfer ) restore ,if you haven’t got the project and need to modify a hmi , when you spend lots of money on there software ,
You can upload a plc , drive project ? Why not a hmi ?
Never mind I have the same issue ��
 
The fact that you can upload an entire TIA PLC project should not be an excuse for not implementing strict program backup procedures. I only use the ability to see the online PLC program to verify that I have the correct backup. If it it turns out that I do not, then something has gone wrong and an investigation must be started up. Just uploading the program and using the upload is poor managemnt.

When the programs are from a sub-supplier, and it is agreed that you shall have the program source code. Then it must be verified in exactly the same way as any other part that is delivered and installed. Why should software be different than hardware ? In a way, it is MORE important that software is documented than hardware.
And if the sub-supplier makes changes post installation, it must be by mutual agreement and subsequent documentation.
 
Even the dumpster fire that is FTME has this ability, it is long over due this was in TIA.

Sure, in the utopian world some live in, it's not needed. But those of us living in reality, it's bloody useful.
 
The fact that you can upload an entire TIA PLC project should not be an excuse for not implementing strict program backup procedures. I only use the ability to see the online PLC program to verify that I have the correct backup. If it it turns out that I do not, then something has gone wrong and an investigation must be started up. Just uploading the program and using the upload is poor managemnt.

When the programs are from a sub-supplier, and it is agreed that you shall have the program source code. Then it must be verified in exactly the same way as any other part that is delivered and installed. Why should software be different than hardware ? In a way, it is MORE important that software is documented than hardware.
And if the sub-supplier makes changes post installation, it must be by mutual agreement and subsequent documentation.

It is super common in the US for a factory to not have any in house controls engineers, and just hire whatever integrator to make modifications as needed. It is also common for these same types of facilities to buy used machines with minimal documentation, as long as they theoretically work. Purchasing often makes these decisions with minimal input from engineering, and then engineering is expected to make it work.

These HMI upload complaints typically come from integrators who are seeing the system for the first time, and who are then blamed by their customer because the problem is much harder to fix than it should be.

Basically, anything that feels like a best practice? Assume it's thrown out the window for the average American factory. Obviously big facilities are a different story, but there are lots of small players that don't know what they don't know until it's too late.
 
It is super common in the US for a factory to not have any in house controls engineers, and just hire whatever integrator to make modifications as needed. It is also common for these same types of facilities to buy used machines with minimal documentation, as long as they theoretically work. Purchasing often makes these decisions with minimal input from engineering, and then engineering is expected to make it work.

These HMI upload complaints typically come from integrators who are seeing the system for the first time, and who are then blamed by their customer because the problem is much harder to fix than it should be.

Basically, anything that feels like a best practice? Assume it's thrown out the window for the average American factory. Obviously big facilities are a different story, but there are lots of small players that don't know what they don't know until it's too late.

Exactly! I work for an integrator and run into this problem way too often!
 

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