First time on Siemens S5 & Omron PLC, please advise

ckchew666 · Aug 21, 2006

Hi,

We've a customer running a few Siemens S5 PLCs. Their intend is to upgrade to Omron PLC. Because most of the new machines are Omron based.

1) 6ES5 421-8MA12 is digital input 8 points, 24 VDC. Does anyone knows if this is a sinking or sourcing input?

2) 6ES5 441-8MA11 is digital output 8 points, 24 VDC. Does anyone knows if this is a sinking or sourcing output?

3) For a system with 120 - 130 Digital IO only (no networking or HMI connection), what is the best model to go for in Omron?

Thanks...please advise as I'm new to Siemens & Omron.

jvdcande · Aug 22, 2006

First of all, I'm not sure if you can call a change from Siemens to Omron an upgrade, because the differences between the two are way too big. I would regard this as a change and nothing more. Switching from Siemens S5 to Siemens S7 (except S7-200) is an upgrade, because these you can compare.

The 6ES5 421-8MA12 is digital input 8 points, 24 VDC sinking.This is the connection diagram:
The 6ES5 441-8MA11 is digital output 8 points, 24 VDC, sourcing. The connection diagram is this:
For the question about what Omron to use, I would suggest maybe CQM1H, but I'm sure BobB (and others too) knows better than me what the possibilities are.

BTW, the external connection diagram is (almost) always printed on the front or behind the connections cover of a Siemens PLC.

Kind regards,

paraffin power · Aug 22, 2006

Use the CJ1.
Looking at the i/o count, maybe a CPU11, but this very much depends on what you're doing.
Pp

ckchew666 · Aug 22, 2006

jvdcande: 1) Thx for ur info, don't scare me off. Because I see OMRON also has sinking input and sourcing output 24V DC. Your statement " because the differences between the two are way too big. " really shake me off!! Care to explain this, I taught for changing from Siemens S5 to OMRON all we need to do is to make sure the wiring are correct at the IO, while the program we can copy back (in OMRON format) from the Siemens S5? No?
2) The CQM1H has 32 points module, does this module required soildering for plug-in type (like AB SLC 500)? The screw type is the best for wiring guy.

paraffin power: 1) Thx, I'll check out the model you recommend, CJ1 is lower end than CQM1H, right?

Thanks everyone.....

JesperMP · Aug 22, 2006

Sorry to barge in on a subject I know absolutely nothing about.

But the other day I just browsed through an Omron catalogue, and I noticed that they have released a new series of PLCs with an integrated ethernet port. I think it was called "CJ1ME" as I cannot find that catalogue now. The prices were surprisingly reasonable.
It looked like you could make quite large systems with this PLC, despite it physically being rather small.

For a system with 120 - 130 Digital IO only (no networking or HMI connection), what is the best model to go for in Omron?

As you want to "upgrade", one thing that I would do is to get Ethernet functionality. With 120 i/o it is not so small a system. How can it not have an HMI ? Maybe the old system uses lamps and pushbuttons, but you should use the opportunity to do something better.

PeterW · Aug 22, 2006

ckchew666 said:
I thought for changing from Siemens S5 to OMRON all we need to do is to make sure the wiring are correct at the IO, while the program we can copy back (in OMRON format) from the Siemens S5? No?....

No, S5 and Omron are totally different machines.

Wiring to I/O, there may be slight differences in the wiring requirements, but adapting should be quite easy providing you have full details of both.

Software, you would need to write from scratch. You could use the S5 program as a basis for the new code, but the differences in language subsets could make this difficult to follow when changing from one to the other. It would be better to write a Function Design or 'borrow' the original if accessable, to write the code to.

gtsuport · Aug 22, 2006

I would agree with paraffin power on the CJ1 product. However, you will need to check the I/O mix. CJ1M-CPU11 will allow 10 modules and max of 160 local I/O. CPU12 will allow 10 modules and 320 local I/O.

CQM1H is an older product. Does not offer as complete instruction set as the CJ1. This may become an issue when converting the Siemens program.

Just my .02. Hope this helps.

ckchew666 · Aug 22, 2006

gtsuport said:
I would agree with paraffin power on the CJ1 product. However, you will need to check the I/O mix. CJ1M-CPU11 will allow 10 modules and max of 160 local I/O. CPU12 will allow 10 modules and 320 local I/O.

CQM1H is an older product. Does not offer as complete instruction set as the CJ1. This may become an issue when converting the Siemens program.

Just my .02. Hope this helps.

HI,

Thx for informing, I do not know the CQM1H is old model as I browse their website, it does not mentioned anything about it.....I'll look for CJ1-CPU11 looks okie, as my IO are all Digital between 120 - 130 only.

jvdcande · Aug 23, 2006

Sorry to hear the CQM1H is out of date, but the only OMRON PLC I've ever used is the predecessor CQM1. And sorry if I'm scaring you off, but as already stated by PeterW, the instruction sets (and not to forget the addressing system) of these two systems are completely different. You'll have to completely rewrite your program from scrap using the S5 program as a mere design specification.

I wonder why your company is going to invest that amount of money where there is a much better alternative (regarding manpower): updating to Siemens S7 (but not S7-200). In that case you can leave most of the translation to the programming software.

Kind regards,

PeterW · Aug 23, 2006

jvdcande said:
I wonder why your company is going to invest that amount of money where there is a much better alternative (regarding manpower): updating to Siemens S7 (but not S7-200). In that case you can leave most of the translation to the programming software.

I can understand their reasoning, why pay for Step 7 software, hardware (incl. spares) and the training of tech's on an upgrade, where the alternative is the have a maybe a (marginally) larger installation cost and a standard product that everyone knows.

Don't know if these machines are the same or similar, which means the costs could be mainly paid on the first machine.

ckchew666 · Aug 25, 2006

Hi,

Anyone has the selection guide for CJ1M Omron plc? The selection I downloaded from : http://www.omron-ap.com.my/product_info/CJ1M/index.asp

does not help much, I'm looking forward for the IO modules part number.

Thanks.

Leadfoot · Aug 25, 2006

ckchew666 said:
Hi,

Anyone has the selection guide for CJ1M Omron plc? The selection I downloaded from : http://www.omron-ap.com.my/product_info/CJ1M/index.asp

does not help much, I'm looking forward for the IO modules part number.

Thanks.

That link is the sales brouchure.

Tell me what kind of inputs you want. Voltage, number of I (inputs) and the voltage and number of O (outputs) and type of output, IE relay, PNP, NPN, TRIAC.......

I just happen to have the latest parts list for OMRON PLC's and would be glad to post the part numbers.

ckchew666 · Aug 25, 2006

Leadfoot said:
That link is the sales brouchure.

Tell me what kind of inputs you want. Voltage, number of I (inputs) and the voltage and number of O (outputs) and type of output, IE relay, PNP, NPN, TRIAC.......

I just happen to have the latest parts list for OMRON PLC's and would be glad to post the part numbers.

I'm looking for the part # for CJ1M Digital Input (sinking) and digital output (sourcing) 16 points each. Also the backplane for my 8 IO modules + 1 cpu + 1 power supply.

Do you have the selection guide or user manual with the part number inside? Pls send me one if you have: ckchew666[@]gmail.com

Thanks.

ckchew666 · Aug 26, 2006

Hi all,

Does anyone know what's the input & output type of IO at the Siemens S5-95U? It has 16 DI & 16 DO.

ArikBY · Aug 26, 2006

Omrom CJ1

P.S CJ1W-PA205R
CPU CJ1M-CPU11 (Max 10 cards)
IN CJ1W-ID211
Out CJ1W-OD212
Back plan is Just Din Rail

First time on Siemens S5 & Omron PLC, please advise

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