Automation Direct PLC's Opinions
- Thread starter Duwop
- Start date
rsdoran
Lifetime Supporting Member
Not doing it again
You can talk synonomous all you want, does not matter. AC is Alternating current, current revesing direction. DC is direct current, only flowing one direction.
There is no "implied voltage or current involved, just how the current (there is) travels.
It is what it is, no engineering or any other terms can make it anything less or more.
Just realized, everything just posted proves what I have already said. I never disputed that voltage could vary in time BUT as you noted the current will always flow one direction i.e. constant polarity.
NOTE: When dealing with DC the flow (electron) will be negative to positive, JUST because you connect a DC motor to run reverse does not change the current flow, it just changes how the DC motor reacts to the applied current.
Output in current is always relative to the load, since power is usually relative to current......
NEVER try to overcomplicate things, much of it is not that complicated.
Been here done this, dumb arse conversation especially if you are a degreed engineer.
You can talk synonomous all you want, does not matter. AC is Alternating current, current revesing direction. DC is direct current, only flowing one direction.
There is no "implied voltage or current involved, just how the current (there is) travels.
It is what it is, no engineering or any other terms can make it anything less or more.
Just realized, everything just posted proves what I have already said. I never disputed that voltage could vary in time BUT as you noted the current will always flow one direction i.e. constant polarity.
NOTE: When dealing with DC the flow (electron) will be negative to positive, JUST because you connect a DC motor to run reverse does not change the current flow, it just changes how the DC motor reacts to the applied current.
Output in current is always relative to the load, since power is usually relative to current......
NEVER try to overcomplicate things, much of it is not that complicated.
Been here done this, dumb arse conversation especially if you are a degreed engineer.
Stationmaster
Member
duwop,
I'm sensing a not-so-veiled reference to AC/DC? (needs more diodes or something) : )
I was just about to ask why tark and duwop have the same avatar but you threw me a curve and changed yours.
I'm ssoooo confuse
I'm sensing a not-so-veiled reference to AC/DC? (needs more diodes or something) : )
I was just about to ask why tark and duwop have the same avatar but you threw me a curve and changed yours.
I'm ssoooo confuse
Last edited:
Stationmaster
Member
Wellllll,
Even though it's off topic, and has obviously peeled the scab off an old wound, and I know I shouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole........
I think the observation that the term "DC" is subject to semantic interpretation is the key to peace in diodeVille.
A diode forces the current to move in only one direction, therefore "direct current".
However, if I sold you a "DC" power supply, and you discovered it had a 100%, half wave, 60hz ripple, could I pacify you with the strict definition that "it must be 'DC' because the ripple is all in one direction"? Or would you sue me for false advertising? Especially if you opened the case and found only a single diode.
Two uses of the term "DC", Two completely different sets of expectations.
The very definition of semantics.
Stationmaster
Even though it's off topic, and has obviously peeled the scab off an old wound, and I know I shouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole........
I think the observation that the term "DC" is subject to semantic interpretation is the key to peace in diodeVille.
A diode forces the current to move in only one direction, therefore "direct current".
However, if I sold you a "DC" power supply, and you discovered it had a 100%, half wave, 60hz ripple, could I pacify you with the strict definition that "it must be 'DC' because the ripple is all in one direction"? Or would you sue me for false advertising? Especially if you opened the case and found only a single diode.
Two uses of the term "DC", Two completely different sets of expectations.
The very definition of semantics.
Stationmaster
The output circuit on a low current SMPS is 1 diode and a cap. At 50 KHz, the cap can be smaller, and ripple quickly becomes negleable. They use 2 diodes on high current (full wave).Stationmaster said:
Compare current to water. A diode is a check ball. It blocks flow in one direction.
Let's be practical here. If you need DC and you have AC, a diode is the key part in converting AC to DC.
The Engineer that said that a diode does not do it is an idiot that wants to argue, but is another one that can't apply his knowledge to the real world.
Everybody knows that a diode makes DC from AC. Why argue the point?
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rsdoran
Lifetime Supporting Member
keithkyll said:
Thank you.
controlled
Lifetime Supporting Member
jeebusmn said:"
Within electrical engineering, the term DC is a synonym for "constant". For example, the voltage across a DC voltage source is constant as is the current through a DC current source. The DC solution of an electric circuit is the solution where all voltages and currents are constant. It can be shown that any voltage or current waveform can be decomposed into a sum of a DC component and a time-varying component. The DC component is defined to be the average value of the voltage or current over all time. The average value of the time-varying component is zero.
Although DC stands for "Direct Current", DC sometimes refers to "constant polarity." With this definition, DC voltages can vary in time, such as the raw output of a rectifier or the fluctuating voice signal on a telephone line.
Some forms of DC (such as that produced by a voltage regulator) have almost no variations in voltage, but may still have variations in output power and current."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_current
Figure 5.
Still, the signal will not be absolutely constant. Upon inclusion of the capacitor, the AC signal has now been converted to DC signal with a ripple. Ripple is a small AC signal on the backgraound of a big DC signal. The ripple factor can be expressed quantitatively as the ratio between the amplitude of the AC waveform and the DC signal.where
http://www.utc.edu/Faculty/Tatiana-Allen/Diode.html
Here is a manual for an oscilloscpe as to how to measure VAC. You flip the oscilloscope to AC to remove the VDC Offset, the constant DC voltage component of your signal. With that you can calculate your ripple factor (RF) to show how well your circuit removes AC from your DC.
Different industries have different definitions. Inside of electrical engineering, this is the definition that is used.
WHAT DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH THE ORINAL QUESTON
rsdoran
Lifetime Supporting Member
Nothing
This was a respose to something I said.
Like many things some of us have a fixated idea on which plc is best AND what we think is correct.
The point is, what we think may not be exact. My plc of choice may not be yours. We all think differently.
Oveall do not over complicate things.
controlled said:
This was a respose to something I said.
Like many things some of us have a fixated idea on which plc is best AND what we think is correct.
The point is, what we think may not be exact. My plc of choice may not be yours. We all think differently.
Oveall do not over complicate things.
testsubject
Member
I like AD. I thoroughly love Stage Progamming. Better than sliced bread and almost better than ***. Just do a search on my name and you will get the gist of it.
BTW, 9 weeks until GRADUATION!! Woot!!
<waves to all the usual suspects>
BTW, 9 weeks until GRADUATION!! Woot!!
<waves to all the usual suspects>
Peter Nachtwey
Member
I think AD provides good value but...
I can't forgive the numbering system. Some in octal, sum in BCD, some in decimal, sum in hex. I can't see why they don't let you use any numbering systems you want anywhere you want. Obviously floats can't be used for addresses but the programming environment should be much more flexible. Also, V memory should start at 0.
I can't forgive the numbering system. Some in octal, sum in BCD, some in decimal, sum in hex. I can't see why they don't let you use any numbering systems you want anywhere you want. Obviously floats can't be used for addresses but the programming environment should be much more flexible. Also, V memory should start at 0.
MarkTTU
Lifetime Supporting Member
I think you'll like the AD platform, especially the DL06; I've actually used them to replace several of the AD 205 series PLCs I used to use with no problem. They're not as powerful as some of the other brands, but they can do a whole lot and have a great bang for the buck.
Peter, V memory does start at 0; V0 is the accumulator for timer 0 which in DirectSoft is aliased as TA0. All memory in the AD PLCs is "V" memory; things like timers, stages, internal bits, inputs, outputs, etc are just shown in the programming software as T, S, C, X, Y, etc. I'll grant you that the numbering system is enough to drive one mad, but at the same time the numbering system and the memory addressing system afford incredible flexibility if you're willing to think outside the box. It reminds me a whole lot of good 'ole C programming where if you're ingenious enough you can do some really slick stuff and you can also totally fubar things if you try to get creative and don't know what you're doing... I've got a couple of bricked CPUs that prove I frequently don't know what I'm doing.
Jeebusmn, when I was in school getting my EE degree DC meant Direct Current. It never meant constant or steady state and I got enough goose eggs on assignments and test problems to back up that Direct Current is not a synonym for constant.
Peter, V memory does start at 0; V0 is the accumulator for timer 0 which in DirectSoft is aliased as TA0. All memory in the AD PLCs is "V" memory; things like timers, stages, internal bits, inputs, outputs, etc are just shown in the programming software as T, S, C, X, Y, etc. I'll grant you that the numbering system is enough to drive one mad, but at the same time the numbering system and the memory addressing system afford incredible flexibility if you're willing to think outside the box. It reminds me a whole lot of good 'ole C programming where if you're ingenious enough you can do some really slick stuff and you can also totally fubar things if you try to get creative and don't know what you're doing... I've got a couple of bricked CPUs that prove I frequently don't know what I'm doing.
Jeebusmn, when I was in school getting my EE degree DC meant Direct Current. It never meant constant or steady state and I got enough goose eggs on assignments and test problems to back up that Direct Current is not a synonym for constant.
Peter Nachtwey
Member
That's right. It is the TI505 that starts at 1. It is hard to keep them all straight.marksji said:
testsubject
Member
Peter Nachtwey said:
I would have to concede here. The numbering system does take some getting used to. I remember when I set up my first double counter and did not allocate the next Vmem locate for the upper byte and used it for something else. It was driving me nuts trying to figure out later on why the value kept changing for the number I was putting in there.
Tom Jenkins
Lifetime Supporting Member
testsubject said:
Ditto. Accumulating timers do the same thing. My response is to use only even numbers for timer and counter designations.
ADC is not perfect (but then neither am I) but it is well above average in my opinion.
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