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Old May 13th, 2007, 05:06 PM   #1
Culan
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SoftLogix Chassis config

Hey guys!

I have an annoying problem. I'm trying to emulate a plc to test an RSView HMI.

I had RSLogix Emulate and heard SoftLogix should be better, so i installed SoftLogix. When installing i had to uninstall Emulate because they are incompatible.

Now, i can't start SoftLogix because it says:

"Could not determine which modules are present in the chassis. Aborting the application"

And, also i can't uninstall SoftLogix (to go back to Emulate) because:

"*FAILED* 1. SoftLogix Chassis modules must be removed".

How am i going to get out of this?
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Old May 13th, 2007, 05:48 PM   #2
Ron Beaufort
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Greetings Culan ... and welcome to the forum ...



sorry but I can’t personally help you with your “installation” problem - because I’ve never worked with either RSLogix Emulate or SoftLogix ...



but here’s a thought ... why do you need either one of those packages to “test an RSView HMI” application? ... I’ve always had EXCELLENT results from using the following technique ...



suppose that you’re animating a display of a tank to show the liquid level rising and falling based on a numerical value in the PLC ... suppose that the tag is named TANK_LEVEL ... instead of setting this up as a “Device” type tag, just set it up (temporarily) as a “Memory” type tag ...



now while you’re working on your graphics, etc. just put a small (temporary) “Numeric Input” object on your window - and tie that to the TANK_LEVEL tag ... now you can manually enter any value that you desire into the tag - and check out the operation of your screen animation ...



you can get fancier of course by using a temporary horizontal or vertical “slider” to more easily change the value ...



fancier yet: try using the same types techniques used in the RSView “Samples” application ... specifically, check out how the value of the tag “Automotive\Motion” is automatically incremented in the “Derived Tags” section under “Logic and Control” ...



basic idea: whatever software you’re trying to use to “emulate” the PLC is probably going to take at least as much trouble (if not MORE) to properly simulate a series of variables as the techniques I’m recommending ... of course after the initial design work is done, you’ll still have to reassign your tags from “Memory” to “Device” before you put the system into operation in the field - but as long as you work systematically and carefully, that shouldn’t be too hard to do ...



finally ... in SOME cases you can actually go ahead and assign your tags directly as “Device” type and use the same techniques I’ve mentioned to manually adjust the values during the development phase of your project ... try experimenting with a few tags to get started ... secret handshake: USUALLY you can go to the “Node” setup screen and temporarily turn off the “Enabled” checkbox ... then you can USUALLY manually adjust the tag values yourself ...



then again, there’s the distinct possibility that I’ve misunderstood exactly WHY you’re trying to emulate the PLC in the first place ... if so, feel free to ignore all of this ... good luck with your project ...
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Old May 13th, 2007, 06:08 PM   #3
abwiz
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I agree with Ron's suggestions on RSView completely. I do this same thing all the time...

I have dealt with SoftLogix on numerous occasions but I have never came across that problem. I suppose this might be best for RA tech support.
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Old May 14th, 2007, 07:45 AM   #4
rgurin
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I had the same problem one time recently. IIRC, this was an issue with RSLinx Classic and RSLinx Enterprise.

Before trying to uninstall SoftLogix, go to the Services in your Control Panel and shut down the following services:

RSLinx Classic
RSLinx Enterprise (may be called RSLinx NG)
Any services named "Harmony."

If this doesn't work, I second the motion to call RA Tech Support. They were the ones who got me out of the weeds.
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Old May 18th, 2007, 03:03 PM   #5
Culan
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I Actually found the solution with the help of another problem in RA knowledgebase.

To uninstall SoftLogix i had to stop the RSLinxNG service as rgurin said.

To get SoftLogix working i uninstalled it, deleted the registry key:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Rockwell Automation\VirtualBackPlaneMonitor
And then reinstalled SoftLogix.

One thing that amazes me though, running RSLogix Emulate or SoftLogix (tried both) together with RSView ME Station is not working well at all, it drops connection to the TagServer or whatever it is called all the time.

I find this strange, ok, you could test your HMI as Ron said and get a good idea if it works as it should but i also wanted to check the tag connections to the plc and then just change the connection to the plc when at customer site.

Is it really that strange running a SoftLogix plc and an RSView HMI on the same computer? I even feel this could (if it worked) be a solution for a customer.


Thanks for all your help guys!
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Old May 18th, 2007, 03:24 PM   #6
rgurin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Culan
Is it really that strange running a SoftLogix plc and an RSView HMI on the same computer? I even feel this could (if it worked) be a solution for a customer.
It could depend on the machine you are using. SoftLogix and RSView ME together can be very resource-intensive.
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Old May 18th, 2007, 05:16 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Culan
Is it really that strange running a SoftLogix plc and an RSView HMI on the same computer? I even feel this could (if it worked) be a solution for a customer.
Try running it that way for a while first. I've not had good luck with the stability of the Emulate product. Someone would have to try really hard to convince me that SoftLogix isn't the same product with a different name, so expect the issues are there too.

Spend some time beating it up and see that it meets your needs before you offer it as a solution.

Also, test user access rights. You need to be an administrator on the PC in order to add a processor to the virtual backplane. This could pose a problem if you're putting any type of user security on the machine.
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Old March 3rd, 2012, 11:24 AM   #8
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I may be wrong but I think Softlogix runs with RSLogix5000, check RA white paper on Softlogix.
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Old March 3rd, 2012, 06:57 PM   #9
daba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akreel View Post
.....Someone would have to try really hard to convince me that SoftLogix isn't the same product with a different name, so expect the issues are there too......
Yes, RSEmulate5000 is a "cut-down" version of SoftLogix - I was told it was when I complained that RSEmulate does not handle the JSR/SBR/RET parameters in the same order as a hardware controller. I found this anomaly in the first (and last!) attempt at trying to emulate a ControlLogix system. I won't do it again.

When I queried why the developers of SoftLogix didm't follow the same "rules", I was given the answer "The developers of SoftLogix were not given a specification to work to, so they are not in error" !! A "corporate" answer, probably the only one they could give without admitting a "goof".

For SoftLogix, that would be almost acceptable, since SoftLogix would be the target machine, but when they use the core code of SoftLogix as Emulate5000, then that makes it unacceptble IMHO.

When you take that into account, and the fact that SoftLogix/Emulate reserves slot 0 for RSLinx comms, meaning you can't use it in your final hardware system without butchering it after emulation, in my opinion it shouldn't be called an "emulator" at all.

I personally wouldn't trust Emulate5000 to give me any confidence my final PLC code will work 100%.
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Old March 3rd, 2012, 07:03 PM   #10
daba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldnerd View Post
I may be wrong but I think Softlogix runs with RSLogix5000, check RA white paper on Softlogix.
Doesn't "run with" - you develop your control system software with RSLogix5000, which can create/monitor/debug/online edit etc. applications for ControlLogix, GuardLogix, CompactLogix, FlexLogix, DriveLogix, SoftLogix, and Emulate.

It would not be a good idea to have your programming software RSLogix5000, and your controller, SoftLogix, running on the same PC, both applications are resource hogs.
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Old March 3rd, 2012, 08:26 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daba View Post
When you take that into account, and the fact that SoftLogix/Emulate reserves slot 0 for RSLinx comms, meaning you can't use it in your final hardware system
This isn't exactly true.
There is a registry hack that can be performed to allow the controller to be in Slot 0, and RSLinx comms to be in an unused slot.
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Old March 3rd, 2012, 09:51 PM   #12
daba
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Oakley, post the details or a link, pls

Still not sure I wanna trust Emulate or Soft, but I'll follow it up
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Old April 24th, 2012, 07:00 AM   #13
Zaheer
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See page no 33 of:

1789-um002_-en-p.pdf

and daba can you please shortly explain to me what is the difference in handling of the JSR/SBR/RET instructions. As I sometimes use Emulator and if does not do the same as real PLC then I have to be careful, thanks.

Last edited by Zaheer; April 24th, 2012 at 07:04 AM.
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Old August 7th, 2012, 04:51 AM   #14
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Found this in the Emulate release notes.

*****************
Jump to Subroutine (JSR) instructions do execute in the emulator. However, the instruction passes parameters to subroutines in reverse order from the order in a physical controller (the last parameter is passed first in an emulated controller). Do not use JSR instructions in a manner where the order in which parameters are passed to a subroutine matters.
*****************
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