Need a autocad electrical drawing made.

[CaseyK]

On a lot of smaller drawings, I can do them so much faster on the board. Perhaps 'cuase I started drawing on one in grade school, around 1959.

Electrical stuph up to B or C size, for sure. For some small customers, I have pre-made A and B size drawings for inputs and outputs, and I use a template to indicate what is connected to them, such as a NO pressure switch, or a NC limit switch, with the connecting wire numbers. This is in pencil (#2 works fine) so they can make changes or copies and mods at random.

I have the distinction of taking a Komatsu-Dresser CAD drawing and converting it to a board drawing in 91 or 92. "Change Control" said it could not be done, but they handled the paperwork.

regards.....casey

 

[yam785]

Maybe it's just me, but if a customer asked for an ACAD drawing in a couple of days, that is exactly what I would give them. If they are asking for an ACAD drawing, chances are there is a reason, like maybe all their other prints are in ACAD. Regardless, in my field, the most important thing is giving the customer what they ask for, not what I think is best.

 

[CaseyK]

In many situations, in a couple of days is fine.

Some places like the Locomotive PLant, the request may not even make it to the drafting department for 7-10 months or more. Even for a small change.

Granted, when dealing as a small company with another small company, time frames are much shorter.

But after a while, you can get a little tired of "in a couple of days".

If the customer wants AutoCAD, should he supply it?

You can go to many manufactures and ask for a GE Fanuc plc, and hear "we don't use them", "You'll get an OMRON".

Then you either put up with an Omron, or change it out with a GE.

The GE plant I was in had a lot of Telemchanique controls, since one of the German equipment manufacturers usen them exclusively.

The day of the customer is always right has long since passed.

I agree that they should be able to get ACad drawings, which I think should STILL be industry standard (or at least the format) (format R-12!!!), but should be reasonable.

Many years ago, I would arrive at work in the morning, and start making revisions to the drawings I did the day before. As soon as they were done, I would make blue prints, then depending on the time, leave them or drive them into FedEX in Peoria to be shipped out overnight to a big CAT dealer in New York. They would have an early morning (eastern time zone) design review meeting, then call or FAX the boss, and he would have the changes ready for to start in when I got there. This went on for months. CAD would have been easier, but they wouldn't spend the money. In fact, ORIGINAL drawings (not blueprints) went to the shop. Some survived, and made it back into engineering for filing. Many got burned up in the assembly department. A picture was taken of each job so an "identical" unit could be built. This company wa doing six million plus in 1986. They now have CAD, but not much else has changed.....

regards.....casey

 

[Lancie1]

fluidpower1,

If you load your Word drawing into Microsoft Powerpoint, then you can save it as a Windows metafile (*.wmf, which AutoCAD can read, even in the older vesions. The new AutoCAD has some other options for conversions.

 

[willpower100]

Okay, I cant believe how much responce this has got, for an update, I am still in the process of completing the drawing, I am and have been working 7 days a week on another project, so this one got sidelined, my customer understands.


As for why I do not have a copy of autocad, I do, its just that I have a very old pc that needs updating before I can run it, I have no time to update my system right now. And no this is not a school question, its an actual job. I dont even have the time to look at all of these posts.

 

[darrenj]

Like I said , I don't know anyone who says they are involved in engineering to a professional level who cannot produce something using a PC based drawing package - I note this guys does work with railway points and signals , and you still maintain that a crayon and fagpacket is enough ?
I was always taught that not only must a job be done , it must be seen to be done - I know from time to time we have to cut corners when working on some projects as we personally can't justify the software , but there is a limit .
You can build panels with a rusty hammer and a bent screw driver , but no one will take your seriously .

Of course on the other hand , you can have the newest laptop and shiniest toolbox with all the goodies in , but not be able to time an egg -

Its like advertizing to be a PLC programmer , getting the job , then telling the customer that the first job payment is for your training course - customer might get just a tincy wincy bit worried .

Did this off the top of my head..no napkins, or cad drawings..And yes the dates are correct..24 hrs..24 LONG!! hours.. 2 problems when i turned it back on..both stupid mistakes due to lack of sleep...some "engineers" like cad and paper to much..sometimes you just need to do it!

my 2c

 

[darrenj]

was looking for a fully finished pic and cant find it.I will have to take one...

 

[TDMartin]

DarrenJ,

I hope you got paid by the job and not by the hour!

 

[Fred Floggle]

Did this off the top of my head..no napkins, or cad drawings..And yes the dates are correct..24 hrs..24 LONG!! hours.. 2 problems when i turned it back on..both stupid mistakes due to lack of sleep...some "engineers" like cad and paper to much..sometimes you just need to do it!

my 2c

Thats very good if its right first time - it nevers needs fault finding , and it never needs modifying .
Are we saying that this is the way to start a project ? with no plan or drawing ? I assume that this panel has wire numbers .
Yes , I have built panels with an outline drawing only , but I/we have a set wire number schedule (you know that 100/101 are 24VDC everywhere) . I have drawn up the net list while building - but there are always drawings done afterwards , and always a plan before .

 

[fluidpower1]

Lancie1;

The AutoCad conversion works great. Thanks

 

[darrenj]

Did this off the top of my head..no napkins, or cad drawings..And yes the dates are correct..24 hrs..24 LONG!! hours.. 2 problems when i turned it back on..both stupid mistakes due to lack of sleep...some "engineers" like cad and paper to much..sometimes you just need to do it!

my 2c

Thats very good if its right first time - it nevers needs fault finding , and it never needs modifying .
Are we saying that this is the way to start a project ? with no plan or drawing ? I assume that this panel has wire numbers .
Yes , I have built panels with an outline drawing only , but I/we have a set wire number schedule (you know that 100/101 are 24VDC everywhere) . I have drawn up the net list while building - but there are always drawings done afterwards , and always a plan before .

Yes i did the drawings after..actually i didnt..someone else did..my point was don't say..

"With the greatest respect to your respective technical abilities - you cannot do this work without the ability to produce in some shape or form PC generated drawings - no if's , no buts .
You will be telling me next that ladder logic should be created on some sort of peg board with metalic contacts etc .
How can you say this is normal ? What is this Armish PLC ? I am not trying to be offensive , and I respect that way of life , but are you serious ? just what sort of engineers are you ?"

and i quote..."just what sort of engineers are you "

I am not an engineer..Can i produce cad drawings...sure i can..am i good and efficient at it..NO!! so why would i do them..I have engineer shops here that will do them at a fraction of the cost it would take me so again..why would i do them..do it on paper and hand it to them..I can do the work in my sleep..its getting the stuff out of the head and on paper i have a problem with..getting the stuff from the head to work is easy..maybee its just me but a customer can tell me what he wants and i can visualize it my head..down to the panel size.. i can then wire it, program it and commission it..all without drawings..(Depending on the size) After i am done i will if its slow do the drawings myself..if busy do as fluidpower1 did and ask if someone can do it for me....

I guess in closing i am saying just course someone asks for help in an area others are good at it doesn't mean they are less of an "engineer" or integrator..

again i ramble

Darren

 

[rsdoran]

darren I agree and my previous posts stated the equivalent. We arent all blessed with the option to "plan" and make drawings prior to doing a job...sometimes customers want NOW.

I said it before and will say it again "YOU can not base what others have to accomplish from the requirements needed in your position". All of us are different and our job duties can be varied.

 

[CaseyK]

With the greatest respect to your respective technical abilities - you cannot do this work without the ability to produce in some shape or form PC generated drawings - no if's , no buts .
You will be telling me next that ladder logic should be created on some sort of peg board with metalic contacts etc .
How can you say this is normal ? What is this Armish PLC ? I am not trying to be offensive , and I respect that way of life , but are you serious ? just what sort of engineers are you ?

Whay kind of engineers? Fantastic, that's what kind. Some have EE degrees, some are Mechanical. Many have NO college. Some are ONLY techs or electricians. These guys are some of the smartest that I would ever want to meet. Most are down to earth. Some are a little radical. Many self taught. Some are gentlemen, some can get rude or testy, and a few are just plain obnoxious. I wish that I could meet and work with or for them. Many have their own companies, some started on a shoestring, many still operate that way. Some each shoe strings (spuds). They come from so many different backgrounds.

I would like to be able to say that Tom, Bob, Mike, Ron, Eric, Steve, Ken, Lance, Randy, Norm, Allen, Alan, Dick, David, Stephen, Dan, Darren, Phil, "Rezar", "JP", those guys in Europe and "OZ", and so many others were my close friend. I will never meet them all, I hope to run into at least a few of them. Maybe for a project, or a MGD, or a grape NEHI, it doesn't matter.

They take what they have available, and MAKE IT WORK. Many are used to doing the impossible with not much to work with,on a regular basis. True modern day Amish craftsmen, but in the "REAL" world.

I couldn't find any mention of an ARMISH PLC, I suspect that it should have been Amish, and I am jealous of some of their folksy ways. (NOTE: I DO prefer blondes!). I think an Amish PC and CAD package is great! What I would rather use until I retire.

Some one asked Fred what world he lived in. I just noticed his "FLAG". I have never heard of his country. But I suspect that it is one of those places where all the taxis are new Mercedes.

"RANT DELETED"

It must be nice to live in an affluent country, with modern equipment and all the ammenities.

"RANT DELETED"

Unfortunately, in so many "countries" and "counties" companies are "right-sizing", furloughing, consolidating, NAFTAizing, and on and on.

"More RANT deleted"

Perhaps, many of us should pool our resources and take a "road" trip, to see how the other half lives. So, who is up for a visit to see how things should be done?

"Even more RANT deleted".

time to fume.....

tomorrow is another day, thank goodness!



best regards to the real world Rube Goldbergs.....casey



BTW I wish I could state it as elegantly as Tom could phrase it, but ya gots to luv slang (it can cause so much 3rd world corn fusion) (explanations available by PM)



Even as a lite weight, I could go for a stout 'bout now!

 

[Fred Floggle]

Feel free to fume - this all started because of the suggestion that the guy should tool up to do the job , whether he uses visio , word , something , whatever , It is necessary to be able to take thoughts and transpose them into a medium that can be electronically transmitted - but no , a few dedicated dinosaurs have to jump on the bandwaggon and say that flintstone cad is the way to progress.
Yes sure , I have done work without drawings , or lashed the drawings up afterwoods , but please , please don't tell me this is right or proper.

Yes , we all have to "get it to work" using what we have , and that is worshipful , but let us not forget that wherever we work , in a land with mercedes taxi's or horses and carts , we should at least try to do the job with a tad of professionalism .

How observant regarding the flag , shame you assumed just too much . I live and work in Indonesia , travelling frequently to Yemen , Bangladesh India , east Africa , and anywhere tobacco grows . I meet some truly brilliant engineers , and the deciding factor for me is not the location or the facilities , but rather the attitude and professionalism - I have seen absolute wonders created out of nothing with little more than simple handtools , because that was what was available , but the guy was a professional . That is the difference for me . I have worked for a very well know supplier of equipment and some of there guys were the most useless lazy unprofessional sods I have ever met - the job was run by contractors . I am that shoestring engineer , I have to pay for my own equipment and software just like many other guys , but pay I do as I can afford it - I despise these guys who take our work because they are cheaper , why are they cheaper ? cracked software and dodgy licenses .
So in conclusion , I don't see what is wrong in at least trying to be professional , I don't need to see how the other half live , I am the other half.
PS , sorry about Armish , - I at least took the trouble to check , unfortunately I chose the wrong one , but judging by the level of literacy exhibited in some of the postings by "native" english postings , I don't feel to ashamed.

 

[rsdoran]

Fred you are asinine...look it up. You supply the other S
To date the only time you havent criticized or been antagonistic to someone is when the topic was tobacco....one post.
Shoestring my A, you dont have a clue.
You are why I dislike engineers in general...egotistical, pigheaded and do not really have a clue about most subjects that dont pertain to the field you work in.

As Kc said, most of the engineers here are FANTASTIC.
Why dont you make the effort to join them? You have the knowledge but your attitude stinks.
NOTE: I have the attitude too but not the knowledge.