Rockwell licensing changed, Who is better?

[IXLR8]

I guess the lesson in this thread is that everyone's "philosophy" is different.

Rockwell's philosophy is that a control system should be built in modules that can be scaled up larger...the nice "best practices" manual the OP referenced is a prime example of how they feel their products are best used. If you don't agree with that philosophy, then Rockwell products aren't for you.

Rockwell has been selling their systems for years, Last July was the first time they have released a comprehensive manual for the implementation of the hardware and software. It only came to our attention when we began to have problems, Rockwell offered it as the reason their equipment was not working to specification. No single specification was exceeded, but the system as whole did not meet the design guideline that was not made available during the quoting stage. Rockwell assisted with the quote, sold the hardware and software with the knowledge of the intended use, and then offered a previously unreleased set of guidelines when it did not work as designed.

Read the manual, If you build large systems and use RS products, you may choose a different route.

I am sorry I should controlled my emotions a little better. I have been programming for 30 years, and I have seen this same situation repeat itself over an over again, with the same results. You really feel passionate about a product, defend it against harsh words, and support it in the face of adversity. Then they change it, the passion is gone, and you move on. I am moving on.

 

[OkiePC]

We feel the same pain as far as the reliability of one product: RSViewSe (FactoryTalk View SE).

A/B PLC offerings are just fine, and I have never had any issues with the performance being less than specified. We have had issues with our Controllogix firmware a time or two, and there are honestly too many times in which they have released firmware with bugs. But aside from those (two) occurrences, the PLC hardware and software have "measured up".

It is only their PC based HMI software that has been a complete PITA and utterly disappointing in almost every sense.

Rockwell has supposedly fixed most of these isues with the release of FactoryTalk View 5.0, but the name change and a bunch of bug fixes sure took a long time to happen. I really think they should start over again and do it right, similarly to what Microsoft has allegedly done with Windows 7.

If we did not have so much development time invested in RSViewSE, we would probably switch to WW or iFix.

So, don't apologize for a/b bashing, you were actually quite kind to them compared to other threads I have seen...

Paul

 

[robertmee]

We feel the same pain as far as the reliability of one product: RSViewSe (FactoryTalk View SE).

Paul

Biggest turd to come out of AB in a long time, IMHO. RSView32 was bad enough, and I would have thought they would have gotten it right with SE, but no. More or less View32 with less reliability. WW runs circles around both.

 

[careed_25]

I almost forgot, there is of course a "quirk".

The activation client/server needs the .net framework 2.0, which RSViewME/SE 4.0 is not compatible with. So if you are using ME/SE 4.0 you need to obtain a "legacy" license for that product (and any other product that is not compatible with .net 2.0).

I'm not 100% positive on this but i have loaded the new activations and can access my rsview studio me files without any problems. One problem i did have is that i couldn't open some older rslogix 5000 projects because they were written in a release of a version not supported by the new activation type. here is a tech note that gives what is and isn't supported.

To open the older files all i had to do is download a latter release of the same version that was supported by the new acitvation.

 

[SCADA_Dude]

VMWare has the ability to define the VM's NIC MAC. This allows you to install software assigned to specific H/W but still make a backup of the image in case you ever need it later (without having to reactivate).

In the .vmx file:
ethernet0.addressType = "static"
ethernet0.address = "00:00:00:00:00:00" <- Put desired Mac here

Just make sure you never fire this VM up on more than one machine, because they will both have the same mac address and wreak havoc on your network (not to mention you would be violating the user license)

 

[REHJ]

I cut my teeth on Omron PLCs and love them but when I changed companys I found myself working with AB and Modicon. They both had some good stuff but a few years back I changed again to a small company who was full of AB stuff. Because we did not spend the money to stay up with the latest software and hardware I soon found that it was a real pain to get any support on the phone. What I found out was that on most of the systems where I had trouble I could change out the PLC to a Direct Logic PLC for less money than it cost me to buy what I needed to fix the AB PLC. For the smaller company it just does not make sense to try to keep up with the software upgrades and all on AB. Not to mention the arogance on the phone you get from them. The stuff they have is not worth the trouble they put you through. I hope more people start waking up to this.

 

[IXLR8]

Found a new vendor, GE

After unsuccessfully negotiating for additional development licenses from Rockwell, our company was very impressed with the interest for new business that GE has shown. They are partnering with us, and providing the necessary development licensing that was denied by Rockwell.

If you are in a similar position I recommend looking at the GE equipment. Training for out personnel will begin in the next two weeks, with implementation on all current quotes. Go GE!

 

[CroCop]

After unsuccessfully negotiating for additional development licenses from Rockwell, our company was very impressed with the interest for new business that GE has shown. They are partnering with us, and providing the necessary development licensing that was denied by Rockwell.

If you are in a similar position I recommend looking at the GE equipment. Training for out personnel will begin in the next two weeks, with implementation on all current quotes. Go GE!

This is what causes companies to turn around stupid policies.
Money talks.

 

[HJTRBO]

Down here in Melbourne AB has decided to ditch its local distributors who have many years technical and sales expereince with their product. They are to align nationally with NHP. Anyone know of NHP and their technical support? Not the best I can assure you, and thats just asking about electronic overloads. I foresee fustration for many Australian AB users with the loss of so much local, friendly, close relationship, technical support and expereince. Good luck Rockwell, I hope for you a humbling market experiecnce.

 

[KP_EENG]

IXLR8,

I am happy to see that you have selected the GE product. As I mentioned earlier, I have been using GE for a little over two years now and I am very happy with the product. Although it did take time for me to get used to the GE programming software, now I really do like the software. Best of luck with your training.

 

[dschlic1]

AB's recommendations on PLC and HMI loading has changed over the years. I was involved in one of the largest (at that time) RsView SE and ControlLogix installations. All set up according to AB's recommendations. Big problems, mainly to do with size. The new sizing recommendations are being developed by a group within Rockwell that is in charge of replacing legacy DCS systems. For this reason, many of the sizing concepts are orientated toward the DCS world.
In all I think that the reduced sizing recommendations are a step in the right direction. The orginal sizing recommendations would would in a lab, and in a stand alone situation. Throw in the real world and multiple processors etc and Houston we have a problem.