Siemens MicroMaster 440 Help

[usedplcs]

Hi All,

Today we had a drive die on us. There was no backup but we have a duplicate drive in service.
Can't upload via AOP or starter but Siemens are investigating this.

We have replaced the drive and used the Quick Start Guide for 440.
With advise from a drives company we have also added the other required parameters, inputs outputs etc.

The drive now pulls the contactor in and shows it as running.
Times out after a set time as no pulsed feedback due to no movement.
BUT the frequency is showing negative Hz?

I am no drives guru...
So the motor is getting voltage but assume -ve Hz

My question is why -Hz and is this the reason the motor doesn't turn.
Is this a parameter setting wrong or could this be something else?

No support now available going into the weekend, so any help or guidance is very much welcome. Many Thanks

Rob

 

[Sidewinder]

What is the drive doing, have you got a parameter list from the drive in service, how does this compare with the other drive?
Are you using an AOP or a BOP?
I'm guessing AOP, do you have another spare?
Can you blank the "faulty" unit completely & re-try an upload of parameters?
Have you got the drive direction command correct?
Anything else you can add?

 

[usedplcs]

Hi,
Thanks for the quick reply.

The drive started to play up last week so we purchase a spare.
We tryed to back the good drive using Starter, I know starter works as I have backed up other drives.
But we can't back the good drive up with either starter or various AOPs.

We couldn't enter the parameters using an AOP so done them using a BOP. Yes have tryed different AOPs.

So our electrical engineer wrote down all off the parameters!
After speaking to a drive company the advised us the following.
Attached is the quick commissioning guide used to set up the micro-master 440

Please follow the following steps when setting up the new inverter

1. Carry out a quick commissioning as listed in the attached document (it is possible to run the drive from the BOP at this point)
2. Set parameter P700 to P708 (digital inputs) as per your other drive
3. Set P1000 as per your other drive
4. Set P0750 – P0762 (analogue inputs) as per your other drive
5. Set P0731 – P0733 (digital outputs) as per your other drive
6. Set r0770 – P0781 ) Analogue outputs as per your other drive

The drive should now run as per the old drive

This was done. Drive looks good but motor won't turn. The electrician has been through the parameters and said they all look good.

As a none electrician - I am a DCS Engineer I have taken his word. I am back in early in the morning to check myself,
Are there any parameters I should look at directly that would cause a -ve Hz?

Thanks for the reply.
Rob

 

[Sidewinder]

There are parameters that you can't change with a BOP that could affect the drive set up you have to use Starter, an AOP, or, um, I can't remember the other software name & my Field PG is in bed now!
Have you set the actual MOTOR parameters?
Is the command input correct?

I would check drive direction related commands first, I can't think of any more at this time.
Sorry, been busy all day, and still working, and getting very tired now, but I have to finish my bits tonight ready for the morning!
I would offer a friend of mine to come over to help, as he is close by to you, but he would probably just bring a shotgun & shoot the drive as he hates MicroMasters with vengeance!

 

[usedplcs]

Many thanks,
The electrical guy has just advised that some are not correct or not available! How close is your guy and would he be interested.
Siemens can come but probably Thursday and another company Tuesday.
Looks like its going to be an early start and an uphill learning curve...... This has to be working by Monday morning. The joys

 

[marcius]

what is P1000 and P1070 set to?

 

[504bloke]

Many thanks,
The electrical guy has just advised that some are not correct or not available! How close is your guy and would he be interested.
Siemens can come but probably Thursday and another company Tuesday.
Looks like its going to be an early start and an uphill learning curve...... This has to be working by Monday morning. The joys

Hi Usedplcs

No I'm not interested - thats honesty for you - If you want to chuck it out and fit a decent drive in the future then i am all ears

I have sent you a PM re your siemens weekend problem, give me a call over the weekend and if i can help then ill try

 

[Sidewinder]

usedplcs
Go on the Siemens Automation Mall, search for the pdf with this name:
440_PLi_23708204_en_0106
Open it & search for "negative", you may find the parameter you have issues with, that is as long as your set points as above are ok.

 

[JRW]

Step by Step guide- I hope this helps
I would go through these, then run drive through keypad first

 

[strantor]

Check out the manual; IIRC there are a couple of parameters that you have to set in order to be able to view all of the parameters via the operator. -Hz I believe indicates running reverse, and doesn't indicate a fault. Have you verified that the drive is receiving a speed reference?

 

[jraef]

Check out the manual; IIRC there are a couple of parameters that you have to set in order to be able to view all of the parameters via the operator. -Hz I believe indicates running reverse, and doesn't indicate a fault. Have you verified that the drive is receiving a speed reference?

Ding ding ding, we have a winner!

He's right, the minus sign just indicates the direction of the VFD output rotation (not the motor rotation by the way, because that depends on the connection).

Also, I believe that if you have P1300 set for Sensorless Vector Control (P1300 =20), and you have NOT performed an Autotune procedure, the drive doesn't know what to do because it doesn't know what the motor is yet, so to be safe, it does nothing.

 

[usedplcs]

Many Thanks

Thanks to you all for your replys.

The micromaster is now up and running finally....

Well, after checking and checking the parameters and help from others there were to items.

Drive is set to Sensorless Vector Control and ID run.
When trying ID run error returned Motor identification failure.

On checking the motor data,
RPM was 5 out
CosPhi was .02 out
Motor eff was 1.2 out

Can't believe this would make a difference but once corrected the ID run completed OK.

Then one of the outputs drive ready needed to be inverted.

Drive no OK and running. Lessons learned.
Many Thanks Again

Rob