PLC battery

Hi, I just wonder about this 3.6V battery widely used in PLC.
I've seen many PLC related items using this 3.6V, ie. siemen, AB, Honeywell, etc.
Some are using AA size, some D size and some 1/2AA.

Any reason why they are not using the one that is easily available in the market?

Thanks.

I just got done trying to defend automation companies for charging for plc development software. But this deal is just a straight-up jam job. The reason for the specialty batteries is that batteries are sure to fail and require replacement. Specialty batteries require the end user to come to you and only you for the replacement, giving the plc manufacturer a guaranteed replacement part sale.

Keith

Yea, For example. The battery in a Contrologix processor is not re-chargable. Will go dead in about 48 hours and costs $32.00 from AB.

bobwithdana said:

Yea, For example. The battery in a Contrologix processor is not re-chargable. Will go dead in about 48 hours and costs $32.00 from AB.

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We learned this lesson on a couple of testbed CLX processors that we were using for learning/development. Now we leave those batteries all disconnected until the processor is to be installed in its control panel.

This is a serious screw-job on the account of A-B.
Unless we raise this concern with them and the fact that it will cost them sales, then they will continue this practice.
It just ****es me off.

jimbo3123 said:

Unless we raise this concern with them and the fact that it will cost them sales, then they will continue this practice.

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How do you plan to convince them? Should we all band together and not buy AB for a day, like we're "supposed" to when gas prices go through the roof? That'll teach 'em right? AB has you over a barrel and they know it. Often, your CUSTOMERS, not you, are demanding AB. You've got to use it whether you like it or not sometimes.

Suck it up, or build your own battery! I won't pay $90 for a null-modem cable. That's why RadioShack gets paid any time I need a XXXX-CP3.

By the way, there are PLCs out there that use a "standard," available at Walgreen's, watch battery. I think AD's DL05 is one. I know I've seen others.

AK

akreel said:

How do you plan to convince them? Should we all band together and not buy AB for a day, like we're "supposed" to when gas prices go through the roof? That'll teach 'em right? AB has you over a barrel and they know it. Often, your CUSTOMERS, not you, are demanding AB. You've got to use it whether you like it or not sometimes.

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This is a sad truth.

Also, I'm not sure that we can add a rechargable battery to a processor that isn't designed to use one. I was under the impression that the charging circuitry had to be present for it to work properly.

Anyone have any insight?

jimbo3123 said:

Anyone have any insight?

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I think it depends on the battery. You can use a Rayovac Renewal (are those still around?) battery almost anywhere you would use a normal drycell.

Using a non-rechargable in a charging circuit would not be good though. It wouldn't even be worth trying, because the warning label is already there on the battery. So, you're not going to win your $1M lawsuit.

"Read the datasheet" is probably the best advice.

AK

PLC Batteries

We have established a yearly PM that includes all electrical panels that have processors, I/F equipment or modules that have backup batteries to replace these batteries. We have cross referenced the batteries by voltage, amp hrs, size, style and connection type. Local
supply houses like "Batteries Plus" or "Independent Electric" have been able to provide us with the cross referenced batteries at 1/2 to 1/3 the cost of the actual device vendor.

There have not been any problems since the batteries being ordered are direct replacements. We do this on a yearly basis because some of the equipment would fall through the cracks and not have the backup battery replaced for 4 to 5 years. This problem would usually show up on the next storm power outage.

Some examples are listed below.


Eternacell 3.6V T06/51
Lithium (AA Size)

Sanyo 3V 1.9AHr SB9758T
Omron Sysmac (2 wire Connector)

Sanyo 3.6V 1.9AHr B9708T
1399581427 (9V Plug)

Panasonic 3V 2/3AHr BR-2/3
Lithium 1/2 AA size

A Panasonic BR-A 3V Lithium 1770-XYC 95546902 9907 Promark battery can replace the Sanyo 3V 1.9AHr SB9758T Omron Sysmac battery.


Thanx Dan

You can typically use a rechargeable battery in a non-charging application as long as the voltage is the same or very close in circuits sensitive to voltage levels such as battery backup. For example a typical alkaline battery such as a AA from the drug store is 1.5 volts but a nickel cadmium rechargeable is only 1.2 volts. Two of those in series and you have lost 0.6 volts which will send off alarms in most PLC memory backups.

Did I read that correctly? 48 hours on memory backup?

jimbo3123 said:

We learned this lesson on a couple of testbed CLX processors that we were using for learning/development. Now we leave those batteries all disconnected until the processor is to be installed in its control panel.

Click to expand...

I learned that lesson on my first 90-30. Assemble the rack, install the battery, and only then RTFM to discover the battery got sucked dry charging the super capacitor on the backplane...

beerchug

-Eric

Eric Nelson said:

I learned that lesson on my first 90-30. Assemble the rack, install the battery, and only then RTFM to discover the battery got sucked dry charging the super capacitor on the backplane...

beerchug

-Eric

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bummer.

I know we've had 90-30s in the office here.
I don't think we removed the batteries on those. I know of one (backplane and all) that I personally delivered to the field where the panel had already been installed. I'm pretty sure it ran with no battery problems at all.

This was the issue:

[attachment]

Seems it's been fixed in newer versions.

beerchug

-Eric

Ok, now I am freaked out. I was sitting here reading this thread when my work pager goes off. I called the maint tech and he told me that one of our machines will not do anything. I asked him if he had any outputs showing on the PLC. He said "No, but what does this flashing led labeled batt mean?" Oh sh!t.

dale

Sorry to jinx you, Dale... utoh

beerchug

-Eric

Good thing is that it doesn't have a batt but does have an eeprom. The batt led isn't flashing, it's solid, but the run/stop led is flashing. It is a Telemecanique TSX-17. According to the manual, flashing led means PLC stopped "Status selected by setting IO,00 from the terminal or caused by a fault". I've never messed with a Tele but it seems like I need to.

dale