O/T: Hiring Tips & Questions

[Bteachman]

I work for a rapidly growing manufacturing company in the Midwest of the USA and we are looking to hire a lot of people, but not having the best luck. We have placed adds in news papers & web sites, we have gone to career fairs, had plant open houses for schools, etc. We are not getting many applicants with experience (School or real world).

Any one have any ideas?

 

[geniusintraining]

Have you tried the NET?? Hot jobs and Monster

How big is the largest city? and how close is to you?

Are you paying very much? or want it all but have nothing to offer?

 

[CroCop]

Look at what the local labor market is like. Find out if others are having these problems, or it it's just you.

If it's just you, see if you can fix the issue. If it's from above your head, good luck.

Right now, in Utah, we're extremely tight on labor. Good help is hard to find, even when you pay well above supposed market value & have good benefits & good work enviornment.

 

[S7Guy]

.....Good help is hard to find, even when you pay well above supposed market value....

I think "supposed" is the key word though. Companies don't get to determine what the market value is- the consumer does (in this case, the prospective job seekers are the consumers). If a company comes up with a job description and can define exactly what they are looking for, then the only missing varaible is the compensation (wages, benefits, vacation time). If they can't find anyone for what they were willing to pay, then they have underestimated "market value" and have to raise the compensation. If they don't, they have to settle for someone less suited to the position.

 

[CroCop]

I think "supposed" is the key word though. Companies don't get to determine what the market value is- the consumer does (in this case, the prospective job seekers are the consumers). If a company comes up with a job description and can define exactly what they are looking for, then the only missing varaible is the compensation (wages, benefits, vacation time). If they can't find anyone for what they were willing to pay, then they have underestimated "market value" and have to raise the compensation. If they don't, they have to settle for someone less suited to the position.

You're exactly right.
The problem we have is our corporate entity isn't plugged in well enough to see what the true market value is right now.

 

[LadderLogic]

I am still wondering how to bring this kind of information in line with the constant complaints about jobs escaping overseas. This is not the first time I hear about employers desperately seeking good people while, according to all accounts, good people must be desperately seeking jobs and ready to work for food.

Maybe it is true that every five or so jobs overseas create at least one job here?

 

[Ken Moore]

I think many times companies place to much emphasis on education. Many job ads have things about minimum degrees required. But..... there may be candidates with many years of experience in the desired field, but do not have the required formal education.

So....
I like the ads that say something like:
BS Degree + 5 years experience
or
AS degree + 10 years experience
or
15 years experience

 

[Sergei Troizky]

I think many times companies place to much emphasis on education. Many job ads have things about minimum degrees required. But..... there may be candidates with many years of experience in the desired field, but do not have the required formal education.

So....
I like the ads that say something like:
BS Degree + 5 years experience
or
AS degree + 10 years experience
or
15 years experience

You are right in your statement however imo do another overemphasis- this time on experience terms in your example. Even 3 years of experience may be reasonable in almost any field, if it is real experience, not just work terms.
Definitely, 3 years of being the only technician in a small non-unionized company may mean more than 15 years of being almost useless 1 of 10 in a large unionized team.

 

[geniusintraining]

... Even 3 years of experience may be reasonable in almost any field....

I guess it depends on what you think "reasonable" IS...

 

[plc_padawan]

The bottom line is that young people just don't go into the trades much anymore. The pay is not that great considering every company wants you to be a supertech with experience in plcs, programming, welding, fabricating, machining, pipefitting, construction, sweeping, mopping, etc. It's actually quite comical sometimes when you read the job requirements for "maintenance techs" in a factory.


When we run help wanted ads at my plant, we hardly ever get an applicant under 35 years old. Most are in the 45 to 50 year old range.

 

[CroCop]

The bottom line is that young people just don't go into the trades much anymore. The pay is not that great considering every company wants you to be a supertech with experience in plcs, programming, welding, fabricating, machining, pipefitting, construction, sweeping, mopping, etc. It's actually quite comical sometimes when you read the job requirements for "maintenance techs" in a factory.


When we run help wanted ads at my plant, we hardly ever get an applicant under 35 years old. Most are in the 45 to 50 year old range.

Most places around here expect the techs to program, design, fab, & everything under the sun to do with an automation system, motion & process included.

There are a few places where that falls to engineering around here, but by far & away, the expectation is that the techs take care of it.

 

[SLC_Integrator]

Most places around here expect the techs to program, design, fab, & everything under the sun to do with an automation system, motion & process included.

There are a few places where that falls to engineering around here, but by far & away, the expectation is that the techs take care of it.

They also dont want to pay anything for you to do all that.
O and have a BS or MSc.
Plus 15 years of experience.


I really think HR departments alot of the time aim way too high and as such miss out on alot of the really good candidates.
A guy with a BS and 15 years of experience isnt going to work for $22 an hour.......

Take instrument techs for example:

We have several heavy indutrial sites here and they all end up fighting over the same labour pool.

What happens?

Those who pay the highest get the guys.
Everyone else becomes a training ground for these better paying places.
As for the education vs experience, I would day for an entry level guy, get the degree.
If you have 5 years or more experience, an AS is acceptable and If you have a 10yr-plus proven track record, why insist on a degree when its not going to add ANY value to what the person can do.

 

[MorphuisOGrady]

I am the opposite. I have been working as an Automation Engineer for approx 5 years now. I am Irish and moved home from US 6 years ago due to visa expiration. Have you any room for me?

 

[geniusintraining]

I am the opposite. I have been working as an Automation Engineer for approx 5 years now. I am Irish and moved home from US 6 years ago due to visa expiration. Have you any room for me?

Ever been to SC?? send me your resume [email protected] if you would relocate and I will pass it on to the HR department

This is for my other job.. not my PLC trainer company

 

[Ron Beaufort]

I’m not sure whether this will add to the conversation or not - but here’s what I’m seeing from my end of things ... quite a few of the companies that I’ve dealt with lately seem to have given up on finding the people that they “want” and have started settling for the people they can “get” ... then they pay to run their new hires through enough training to get the job done ...

special interest disclaimer: for those of you who don’t already know it, I teach PLCs for a living ...

personally I don’t know of any specific examples, but I’ve heard several rumors about companies that basically “loan” their employees the money for the training ... the employee pays nothing up front, but if he quits before a certain “recovery” time limit has expired, then he has to pay for the cost of the training ... I’m not saying whether that’s “good” or “bad” - but that’s what I’ve heard from time to time ...



personally I blame most of the “good-labor-is-hard-find” problem on the minimum wage laws ... way back when I was young, every tradesman (carpenter, brick mason, plumber, you name it) always had at least one or two young kids tagging along as “helpers” to pick up the tools and handle similar “gopher” jobs ... the kids worked for peanuts - but at least they were learning the trade ... when was the last time you saw a common-sense arrangement like that in action? ... with the minimum wage as high as it is, the tradesman will jolly-well fetch and carry his own tools ...



my main reason for posting is to say this ... out of all of the discussion along the lines of training and experience, one thing seems to have been left out: MOTIVATION ... in my carefully considered opinion, that one factor alone is worth MUCH MORE than any amount of experience and/or training that you care to mention ... sadly I don’t have a litmus test for determining which job applicant is - or is not - motivated to get the job done ... but that MOTIVATION idea is what I’d personally be looking for if I were trying to hire someone ...



I read a story on the CBS News website the other day about an illegal immigrant who jumped the fence about 20 years ago - and scrounged up a job in the fields pulling weeds with his bare hands ... today he’s one of the top brain surgeons in the country ... we’re talking MOTIVATION here folks ... (search for Dr. Q if you’re interested enough) ...



true personal story: fifteen years ago I was working as an instructor in a tech school ... one student (we called him OP for short) had just finished the conveyor programming project ... I gave him an A+ on his printout ... then he asked me: “Is there any way that I could make it better?” ... “No, OP, there’s no better grade than A+” ... then he said, “No, not the grade, Ron. I meant could I make the program any better?” ... “Well, yeah. The program works fine, but you could clean these branches up here. And touch up the documentation here - and here.” ... the little guy got right back to work again - on his already A+ project ... I walked over to the phone and dialed a friend of mine who ran a systems integration shop ... “Jim,” I said, “I’ve just found another one for you.” ... OP didn’t know it then, but he had just got himself hired - the interview process would be just a mere formality ... Jim had me on a constant lookout for people just like OP ... for people MOTIVATED to do more than necessary - and who were willing to put in the extra effort it takes to do the job better than it has to be done ... you can’t bottle that stuff ...



now if we could just find a foolproof way to identify that MOTIVATION factor during the hiring process, then we could skip right over the “previous experience” and the “prior training” concerns - and hiring good employees would be a walk in the park ...